| Author |
Message |
    
New12r
| | Posted on Sunday, January 02, 2005 - 11:19 am: | 
|
I just want to keep my current XB12R, I am learning how to use the bike's power that is there and use all of it before I decide to make it faster.
Yesterday I was riding with a buddy on a gixxer 750 in the mountains and he smokes me in the straigs(after it winds out) and then back in the corner I am up his butt trying to get him out of my way or passing him if it was a 2 lane. This same guy told me my Buell could never pass him!  |
Lornce
| | Posted on Sunday, January 02, 2005 - 01:15 pm: |
|
"I've seen 115+ RWHP at 6,500 RPM out of a 1250cc engine from each of BadWeB's performance engine sponsors."
Granted, but those same numbers are achievable from an 88" motor with milder cam timing and withOUT all the necessary hardware to control the valvetrain of a more radically cammed 1250. (I'm on a budget here, I've got the S2 to build as well!) It'd be stronger than a 1250 down low, too, and more tractable and civilized with a 44mm cv carb.
Looking for a little more oomph in a bike that'll see use in a variety of roles here, not building a pro-mod drag racer.  |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Sunday, January 02, 2005 - 03:28 pm: |
|
Lornce,
Don't forget that an 88" motor may be turning the same piston speeds at 6500 rpm that another could be at 7500. Before you make a choice, check out all the data. Also, make sure that you can get a well matched combo of parts (cams, compression, fuel mapping, etc.) that will give you the engine character you want, and check the history on comparable conversions. There are great parts out there for these motors and also not so good parts.
And if you are going racing, unless you are really experienced, stay away from major engine mods. There were quite a few regional championships won by Buells around the world last year, and all the bikes were very near stock. |
Court
| | Posted on Sunday, January 02, 2005 - 04:42 pm: |
|
>>>>all the bikes were very near stock.
Ahhhhh.....what I call "Lesson '97".
A stock bike has been pretty well bugged out. With each mod you make, each and every itsy bitsy one, you are like a juggler tossing one more ball in the air. Each modification must be managed.
Court |
Grt
| | Posted on Sunday, January 02, 2005 - 05:47 pm: |
|
I'd love to see a comparative list of lap times from all the "Top Contenders", in street trim, on the Streets of Willow Springs track.
I think some of the 4 cylinder liter bikes might might find it a little embarrassing.
I think that track is more fun to ride than any I've been on, including Leguna Seca! It teaches you that riding fast is about more than just horsepower.
G. |
Lornce
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 12:14 am: |
|
"Don't forget that an 88" motor may be turning the same piston speeds at 6500 rpm that another could be at 7500."
Anon,
The most common way for a 74" motor to get to 88" is with an increase in bore to 3 13/16", not stroke. The piston speeds of both motors would be identical at similar rpm's.
"Before you make a choice, check out all the data. Also, make sure that you can get a well matched combo of parts (cams, compression, fuel mapping, etc.) that will give you the engine character you want, and check the history on comparable conversions. There are great parts out there for these motors and also not so good parts."
Thanks Anon, and any advice you can offer on the fuel mapping of 44mm CV Keihins would be appreciated...
What I'm planning is actually pretty mild tuning: Increased bore and cam lift/duration (se .536's) in combination with 44mm cv carb and heads modded for increased flow. The results, according to the vendor (Nallin Racing) is a pretty healthy increase in midrange and top end. Seems pretty straight forward to me.
"And if you are going racing, unless you are really experienced, stay away from major engine mods. There were quite a few regional championships won by Buells around the world last year, and all the bikes were very near stock."
If I was going racing it'd be on a race prepped bone stock XB12R in the 95rwhp limited Canadian Thunder series where it'd be a shoe-in for podium finishes. But I ain't. I just want a healthier S1 for track days and an S2 that'll burble along with plenty of steam to spare. If I change my mind about that, I'll get an XB12R and go racing, proper.
Thanks for your input.
Lornce |
Lornce
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 01:11 am: |
|
"I think that track is more fun to ride than any I've been on, including Leguna Seca! It teaches you that riding fast is about more than just horsepower."
I agree. For just good old fashioned low-heat, non-threatening fun, it's tough to beat a slow, tight, gnarled circuit. They make excellent and safe training grounds to hone skills needed for bigger, faster, more demanding circuits.
Lornce |
Fullpower
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:02 pm: |
|
if you are planning to flog a 45 degree twin, piston speed is the last thing you need to worry about. you will have inertial loads, spalling crank pins, stretching con rods, flexing pushrods, valve spring breakage, and much additional mayhem. piston speed is way way down the long list of things which might shut your hotrod down. |
Fullpower
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:05 pm: |
|
rocketsprinks original Question:"If you wanted to build a bike that was still street legal, but it would be used mostly for track days and oh, say, a trip to the "Dragon" what would YOU pick" Erik already did all your homework. the answer is "XB12S" |
Rocketsprink
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:18 pm: |
|
I know, I know, it's already been built. Crap, can't you guys take a hint? Trying to sell the wife on getting another bike. I have the 12S and love it. But looking for something that will see light duty as far as a everyday rider and am looking for a used Buell that can be made more for track days..etc.. yet still remain street legal. Leaning toward a tuber! |
Fullpower
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:51 pm: |
|
mine is the short legged model. stands 5 foot two, so i bought her a Ducati M620, put an adjustable rear suspension link on it, took the rear down an inch and a quarter, front down half an inch. we dropped the gearing down a single tooth on the countershaft, and now the little Monster is pretty quick. capable little bike, and wife likes it a bunch. she can burn an entire tank of fuel without touching her feet down, and no complaints at all, so we are both happy. |
Lornce
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:51 pm: |
|
"you will have inertial loads, spalling crank pins, stretching con rods, flexing pushrods, valve spring breakage, and much additional mayhem."
Dean, I'm in agreement with you on this. All the more reason to go big, gear high and keep the revs low.
"looking for a used Buell that can be made more for track days..etc.. yet still remain street legal. Leaning toward a tuber!"
Rocco, We both missed out on that score just a month or so ago. A guy in your neck of the woods had a pair of track prepped S1's for sale on this board at a killer price. I tried talking a buddy to go halves on the pair, but they got snatched up before I got organized. Yah snooze, ya lose.... Keep your eyes peeled on this board, S1's go for some very reasonable prices.
Lornce |
BadS1
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 08:57 pm: |
|
Lornce those race bikes were Wes's and he is in are Rocco's and I's Brag club.Those bike don't have titles or Vin's for the matter.Daves has areally nice S1 for a descent price right now Rocco. |
Gearhead
| | Posted on Monday, January 03, 2005 - 09:37 pm: |
|
I've got a question for the posters who have suggested finding an S1 or S2 as a second bike.
Why not suggest an M2 - M2L? They are newer, plentiful and have all the updates. Why wouldn't this be a better choice for a tuber?
I'm looking to do something very similar but I'm going XB9R. They have all the latest hardware updates and are considerably less expensive than an XB12R currently. |
Mikej
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 04, 2005 - 10:46 am: |
|
Forks and steering geometry. |
Rick_a
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 05, 2005 - 01:35 pm: |
|
I went about my Tube frame purchase like this...the one I could live with best stock. That would be the S1. If I bought an X1, S3, S2, M2...whatever, I would've tried to turn it into an S1. |
Lornce
| | Posted on Thursday, January 06, 2005 - 10:56 pm: |
|
While we're on the topic of engine mods: Does anyone know what needs to be considered when using XB heads on a tuber, besides the front engine mount?
tia,
Lornce |
Lornce
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 11:36 am: |
|
Now, how about those XB heads?
I'm looking for answers as I'm planning to order
some Stage III Nallin heads, (possibly two sets) but I don't
know which type to plan for in my project(s).
I'm a little confused as one of the primary
advantages of the XB heads appears to be lighter valves with 7mm stems
and lighter "bee-hive" taper wound valve springs.
However, NHRS installs valves with 8mm stems and heavier,
conventionally wound springs when they build Stage II and Stage III
heads (just like T-Storm heads). At that point the advantage must
simply be in the shape of the XB's ports and combustion chambers. Or
is it? That's what I need to know.
In stock form the XB head outperforms the T-Storm head, that's
understood. How about the difference in performance by the Stage III
level of modification with larger unshrouded valves, squish band cut to 15 degrees to match T-Storm type pistons and ports suited
to breath best for 88" applications?
I'd call Nallin and ask them directly, but my phone access is limited
during business (read working!) hours.
best,
Lornce |
Kdkerr2
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 09:55 pm: |
|
I was also attracted to the XB heads for my tuber. Will everything bolt up correctly? The intake manifold and the front motormount?
KK |
Koz5150
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 10:07 pm: |
|
Kdkerr2. I am pretty sure the topic has been covered in the knowledge vault. I think Spidey has the new heads on his M2. You may want to ask him about it. |
|
