| Author | Message | ||
     M1combat |
Justice indeed  . | ||
| Blublak |
Jose.. I'll have to go with Henrik on this.. Uh.. Reg Pridmore is retired.. At last report, he was only running in 'legends' races and some 'vintage' and club style (no points, all for fun of course) although, it might be interesting to see him come out and try for a fourth AMA championship (he'd be the oldest one to do it.. just not the first). So that must have been the younger Pridmore, he's still racing professionally. Aside from that.. Great Pics! Thanks from all of us that couldn't attend.. Later, Later | ||
| José_quiñones |
Ooops, Jason it is, I did not even realize I wrote down Reg until you all pointed it out, Henrik, thanks! Yep, Art Diaz is FAST! Art and his team are really cool and loved having us cheer them on at Summit Point during the FUSA Thunderbike race earlier this year. He went down on Bryan Bemisderfer's oil when his Buell let go during the opening laps of that race. He won a bunch of CCS classes that weekend, but that Thunderbike crash cost him dearly in terms of prize money he did not make plus the money to fix the bike. He was pretty mad. Wycked, do you want one or the whole bunch on a CD? Anony, Ciccoto's bike also had a leak, but not large enough to cause smoke or to prevent him from finishing. I have a picture of it but I won't post it. Not worth the argument. If any bike starts leaking oil in front of a racer, you better believe that rider's team will alert anybody with some authority as soon as possible to prevent something tragic from happening. It will happen from a track day level all the way to MotoGP, they did the right thing. | ||
| José_quiñones |
Bunch of good pictures over on the AMA official site, ussuperbike.com here's a great one with Barney in it  | ||
| Imonabuss |
Holy **** is Barney ever leaned over! Ooooh, and Jose, the difference between when a Japanese bike leaks oil and when a Buell does is that the Japanese teams get the race red-flagged for a re-start, whereas the Buells get black flagged. Check out what happened at Laguna. | ||
| Blake |
 | ||
| Xbolt12 |
"the difference between when a Japanese bike leaks oil and when a Buell does is that the Japanese teams get the race red-flagged for a re-start, whereas the Buells get black flagged. Check out what happened at Laguna." So I'm not the only one who noticed that after all! Anonymous, Would it be worthwhile to use AN machined fittings and stainless lines to increase reliability on the external oil lines and fittings? I know the xb already has some braided lines and some solid tubing, but I think the fittings are simple flare-nut type, although I might be wrong. xbolt12 | ||
| Bluebuellxb9r |
Funny you mentioned this - I took some pics of the Kosco Buell while they had the fairings off and behold - a strange fitting setup. Now if I could only shrink the picture down enough to get to post it. | ||
| José_quiñones |
Just like the difference when a Japanese or Italian bike makes noise and when a Buell does is that everybody else is held to the 105db maximum noise level mandated in the AMA rulebook while the Buells are allowed to be louder than legal. Favoritism in AMA rule enforcement? That's like saying: I'm shocked, shocked there's gambling in this casino! | ||
| Dano_12s |
Thanks Jose' nice job. Glad you took time off the V-ROD...how do you like it? | ||
| Anonymous |
Right, red flaggged races to allow rebuilds equate to slightly loud on decibals. Thanks for another chance to see the world through the strange distorted world of Jose... | ||
| Court |
>>>Just like the difference when a Japanese or Italian bike makes noise and when a Buell does is that everybody else is held to the 105db maximum noise level mandated in the AMA rulebook while the Buells are allowed to be louder than legal. I've gotta tell you that I lack the race fluency that you do, but let me get this right. You are saying that the AMA uses some sort of audiometer to measure sound pressure level; that there is a 105dB limit and that Japanese bikes exceeding the limit are busted while Buells are allowed to be measured above and a "blind eye" turned? You are saying ( I am begging to be told I am wrong ) that someone, in an official capacity, is KNOWINGLY cheating and allowing Buell an unfair advantage? Frankly, I do not believe that. Any breezears could measure the sound levels and I have to guess that even if you could marshall a unanimity of cheaters (I assume one guy/gal blowing the whistle would shoot the entire deal?) and this is allowed, by the well funded Japanese, Italian and Portuguese teams to go on absent protest. Don't take the brown acid. Court At the risk of sounding skeptical, that's a load of tom-foolery. Don't take the brown acid. Court | ||
| Bomber |
or, do take the brown acid, but be prepared for a 3-axis ride every race sanctioning body that i've had a relationship with has had fools and poltroons on the track enforcing rules inconsistantly -- I think it's part of the territory (and goodness knows the AMA is near the top of the list) consistant rule bending in favor of one brand, though, does seem a bit hard to beleive (granted, by experience is dated, ending approxiamtely when Puegot still campaigned their 15 liter cars) (Message edited by bomber on October 14, 2004) | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Yes Court, it was mentioned that one of the Cali tracks that the Japanese bikes were being held to the 102/db limit while the Buells were hitting 105db with their race exhausts. No one filed a protest because at the time the general concessus was the Buells weren't competitive enough to be a problem. Also the fact the Buells met the 105db limit established by the AMA even though that particular track has a mandated 102db limit. But I agree comparing a sound issue to a blackflag VS redflag for an oil leak is piddly. The issue gets mentioned about the sound in one of the archived threads covering one of the Buell races, like either the first or second race the Buells attended for the season... | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
btw...Jose, did you get my email? | ||
| BadS1 |
Laguna Seca,Daytona,an there is others that db limit. | ||
| José_quiñones |
Yes, as wycked explained. None of the other teams are complaining because the Buells are not taking podium spots away from them yet. When that happens, they will complain, then the AMA will have to actually take readings. The AMA has not taken readings because they are more interested in having the Buells out there than enforcing that particular rule. I was told this by several people in the Buell teams, they know they are above the limit and they also know that the AMA knows but is letting them slide this year. Why would Buell be working on a quieter exhaust for next year? Because the current one exceeds the AMA limit by a considerable amount and they know it. Wycked, got it. | ||
| Court |
Okay...that's a plausible explanation. I was just struggling with trying to stretch to the "Buells are being favored". Basically, it's a 102dB level, unique to one track, that no one, Buell, other brands or the AMA sees as rising to a threshold that would merit even measuring. Thanks for the explaniation. Court | ||
| BadS1 |
There not complaining cause BUELL isn't they aren't on the box yet!!! Kinda like Vance & Hines's V-Rod drag bike soon as they started spanking the competition they slapped with 40 more pounds to the bike. | ||
| Crusty |
Yeah, and if a Buell should win the Daytona 200, you won't believe how much crying you'll hear from the other teams. "They have twice the displacement"; "They're allowed to make more noise"; "The AMA is owned by Harley"; etc., etc., etc. But I'll just be loving it! It could happen! | ||
| Blake |
I say the AMA should institute a minimum dBa noise threshold for the FX bikes. Too quite and you are disqualified, humiliated and ridiculed in public. This is AMERICA damnit!!!! | ||
| Benm2 |
I've never been to a racetrack event where no one has crashed. Most of the time, these crashes are self induced and are associated with riding at personal limits. With that in mind, if I saw oil smoke coming from someone's bike ANYWHERE on the track, I'd pit out to have them specifically black flagged if race management weren't doing it themselves. During my last trackday, I was asked if there was anything I could do to make my Buell louder  | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Ben the point is that some of the japanese teams got them to redflag the race, with restart so they could fix the oil leak and get back out on the track where as the Buells got blackflaged instead with no chance of getting back out. | ||
| Trojan |
When we raced last year we fell foul of the UK ACU rulebook because our Buell exhaust didn't exit directly in line with the centreline of the bike (or some such nonsense) as the rulebook stated. "We said, that's how Buells are". They said, "Ahh but if something blew out of the exhaust it could hit someone!" Right, and a Ducati 996 couldn't fire missiles at following riders then? This went on for most of the season until eventually the scrutineers decided to take us to the clerk of the course, who told them not to be so petty! Justice does prevail occasionally | ||
| Benm2 |
Wyked, sorry I misinterpreted your comment. Perhaps the right thing to do would have been to run out on the track and lay down? Or maybe throw rocks on the track? Justice, sometimes, seems to be in the eye of the beholder. (i.e. who beholdin the wallet) | ||
| José_quiñones |
The September RoadRacing World (page 58) has a pretty good explanation of how that Red Flag happened at Laguna. I't not the conspiracy theory some people here want to spread. The AMA did not know there was no oil on the track, they just knew that the first two riders to show up at the start/finish line after Zemke dropped out (Ben Bostrom and Miguel Duhamel) had their left hands off the bikes one pointing up and the other apparently pointing down at the bike, which is the typical way riders want to communicate to the officials that there is a problem on the track which might require a red flag. At that split second moment the AMA either has to decide to throw the flag and see what they are talking about, or let the race continue and hope that nobody goes down on an oil spill they were potentially warned about by two riders via their hand gestures. It tuns the AMA got confused by the hand signals which were not directed at them but to the Honda crewmembers on the Pit wall. Either way they would have decided they would gotten crucified by the affected parties, but the erred on the side of caution in this particular case. I'm not going to fault them for that. It was definetly a lucky break for the Honda teams that were having problems. The other teams are quoted in the article and they are very critical of the decision and the "motives" behind it. But to say the race was intentionally stopped when everybody knew there was no oil on the track is innacurate. At VIR, I did not see Barney get Black Flagged, I did not see his bike smoking. All this happened away from turn 5 which is where we were watching the race. We just saw him get passed for fourth in one lap. So the Buells were running fifth and sixth. Then a lap later or two Barney dissapeared from view, so Ciccoto picks up fifth. A lap after that Jason Pridmore drops out, so Ciccoto picks up fourth and holds off a charging Opie Caylor to the finish. Pretty eventful exciting race from our point of view in turn 5. (Message edited by josé_quiñones on October 16, 2004) (Message edited by josé_quiñones on October 16, 2004) | ||
| Anonymous |
Jose, Of course YOU won't fault the Japanese or the AMA. Fact is if the rider is pointing down at his bike for having an oil leak problem, shouldn't the jerk bring it in to protect his fellow riders? And, shouldn't the AMA have black-flagged him, not red flagged the race? So much for the Laguna debacle, which I can guarantee you enraged every Formula Extreme rider other than the Honda guys. And I think their opinions are worth a lot more than yours. So, since the world of AMA racing is not always a fair one, it was up to a higher power to take out the Suzuki at VIR, hahahaha! | ||
| José_quiñones |
Please be accurate in how you describe what happened at Laguna. One rider had his hand up, the other was pointing down at this bike, neither of them were leaking oil, the bike with the oil problem had already stopped on the track. The AMA saw two riders gesturing with their hands and threw the red flag to inspect the track. To do otherwise and hope an accident did not happen would be irresponsible on their part. I don't think anybody put their hand up at VIR. Had they done so the AMA probably would have shown the red flag there too. Next year if one of your riders goes down on somebody's oil after the AMA was alerted to it and did nothing about it, will you complain that they didn't stop the race or the rider in time? | ||
| Crusty |
I wasn't there, so I don't know all the facts but I have to agree with Jose on this point. The officials have to have a bias towards rider safety. Sometimes the red flag is an advantage to one team, sometimes it hurts them and benefits another team. I would much rather see a race red flagged for an erroneous judgment call than see a race continue and have a rider seriously injured. | ||
| Bluebuellxb9r |
The Bias is for rider safety ! During the 1000 superstock race, Eric WOod has a failure of some sort that caused him to have an offtrack experience ( he stayed down for a while, but, thankfully was able to get up an move around a bit ). Jason Pridmore saw , in the area right before Eric went down, some type of fluid on the track surface. He told the officals and they redflagged the race while the 2 minute board was showing. they took an additional 15 minutes cleaning up a oil/coolant spill that could have been real trouble if someone had hit it @ racing speeds. In this case , the safety of the riders was paramount, as it should be. |
