| Author | Message | ||
     Blasterd |
Ran into a little snag, on the lower rockerbox gasket, the new one I have is a metal, one piece gasket unlike the old two piece. There is a raised part built into the gasket, does it point up or does the raised part sit upside down? Ken | ||
| Loki |
up toward the heavens | ||
| Blasterd |
Thanks Loki, Ken | ||
| Blasterd |
I am having some difficulties with the lower rocker cover, it will not seat flush with the head, I think the rocker arms are stopping it. I also have a few more questions but I will take it 1 at a time. Ken | ||
| M2me |
Did you rotate the engine so both valves were closed before removing the covers? Even if you did, you have to slowly tighten it down. The lifters fill up with oil and you have to slowly let them bleed down. | ||
| Josh_ |
Ken sounds like the motor is not properly at TDC | ||
| Blasterd |
M2me, I rotated the engine but maybe not enough, what should I do to get it to TDC. Ken | ||
| M2me |
Ken, Sorry, but I'm not really sure how to do it with the lower rocker cover removed. I always just make sure both valves are closed before removing the lower cover. There must be a way to do it though. Maybe somebody else can explain it. How much of a gap is it? Like I explained earlier, there is a slight gap when you put the lower cover back on because the lifters have filled with oil. By slight gap I mean about enough for a fingernail or so. edited by m2me on June 02, 2004 | ||
| Blasterd |
M2me, there is about a 1/4 of an inch gap before it is flush. Ken | ||
| Josh_ |
I would just bolt it down using the sequence in the manual but don't tell Aaron I said that. | ||
| Blasterd |
Josh, I don't want to cause any more damage to the covers considering I have already scratched the shiny surface. Should I try to turn the shaft over to move the piston? I havn't cleaned all the parts yet either, would greased lightening ruin the finish or should I use a common degreaser? Ken | ||
| Josh_ |
Unless you have a way of measuring where the piston is now, moving the motor more will just be a guess. As m2me said it may just be a question of bleeding the lifters down. What surface did you scratch? I like common kitchen cleaners like 409 to cut grease. | ||
| Aaron |
Too late  You may just bend a valve doing it that way, too. Rotate the motor forward while watching the pushrods. Easiest way to do that is to put the bike on a swingarm stand, put it in top gear, and bump turn the rear wheel with your hand. Make sure the spark plug(s) are removed so you have no compression. When you see the intake pushrod come up, and then go down, rotate it to the next occurrence of tdc in the timing window (the vertical line). That's the TDC you want, at the top of the compression stroke, just before the power stroke. Both valves are closed there. If you go around another rotation of the motor, you'll be at the overlap tdc, you don't want that one. Both valves are actually slightly open at that tdc. You want the tdc that lies between where the intake closes and where the exhaust starts to open. Really, TDC isn't what matters, having both valves fully closed is what matters. The TDC at the top of the compression stroke just happens to be about halfway in between intake close and exhaust open, so it's a good place to be. I generally put it a little before or past the tdc mark just to reduce the chances of the valves hitting the piston, because they will open a little as you bring down the rocker box. But they shouldn't really hit anyway. But it doesn't hurt to makve away from tdc slightly, so long as the cam is still in a position where both valves are fully closed, it doesn't matter. Anyway, now bring your rocker box down, using just the four big bolts. Bring it down slowly and evenly. As mentioned, there's oil in the lifters and the valves will open slightly as you bring the cover down. Give it ten minutes or so after you've got it down before you rotate the motor. The lifters will bleed down during that time and the valves will close. Takes that long at least anyway to put in all the other bolts and torque'em all. If you rotate the motor through the overlap tdc bfore the lifters bleed down, there's a good chance you'll get some valve to valve or valve to piston contact and bend a valve. So be patient. If the pushrods are accessible (i.e. collapsible covers), you can tell when the lifters have bled and closed the valves because the pushrod will spin with your fingers. Piece of cake. edited by aaron on June 02, 2004 | ||
| Blasterd |
Aaron, so if I may have rotated the motor a turn with the cover off I could have bent a valve? yikes! I could be in trouble..... | ||
| Reepicheep |
No... using the bolts to force the rocker box cover down if the engine is in the wrong position could bend a valve. If you have not put it back together yet, no worries. | ||
| Blasterd |
I'm confused........ | ||
| Blasterd |
I guess you guys can tell I havn't had to do much work on my bike, right  | ||
| Blasterd |
Ok here it goes.... I trust what you say Aaron so what you are saying is put the cover on, put the 4 bolts on, slowly tighten them down according to the manual torque them and by that time I should turn the motor? I don't have a swingarm stand (hell, I don't even have lights right now in my shop) so my next alternative would be to turn the mainshaft nut? turn it forward? Ken | ||
| Blasterd |
By the way Josh, I scratched the bottom of the lower rocker cover, where it meets the metal gasket. Will that be a problem? Ken | ||
| Reepicheep |
You are close Blastard... you want to turn the motor to the right position *before* you start assembling the rocker boxes back on. The intake pushrod / valve is the one closest to the carb, the exhaust pushrod valve is the one closest (suprise) to the exhaust. The front and rear cylinders mirror each other in this regard. Obviously, you do one rocker box at a time, and finish it completely before doing the other (as the engine will have to be rotated to another position for the other cylinder). Like Aaron says, just make sure the engine is at the right place in it's rotation (by watching the pushrods move), and then slowly bolt everything back together and tighten it back down, and give it a little time to settle (15 minutes) before moving it again. How big is the scratch? You can use something like Hylomar or Yamabond in addition to the gasket to give yourself more margin if you are worried about it. | ||
| Smadd |
Blastard... if no stand, you can rotate simply by removing the plugs, putting it in a high gear and simply pushing the bike forward. A bit of a pain.. but you can do it. That's how I adjusted my primary chain before I got a stand. But no lights in your shop?? That could be the biggest problem! I've screwed up a thing or two working hastily in a dimly lit garage! Get some light on the subject. Steve | ||
| Henrik |
For lifting, I like cheap jack stands under the rider footpeg mounts. Fairly sturdy. Put a rag between stand and mount to prevent scratching. Henrik | ||
| Josh_ |
Depends on how big the scratch is. Since that's the area that tends to leak a good scratch will certainly make it leak see there's a quick fix and a "right" fix and now you know why I stick to computers | ||
| Blasterd |
So I am looking for a timing window? Where is the timing window? You guys are really going to get tired of me. I guess that is the only snag now, other than what do you mean by vertical line? Ken | ||
| Josh_ |
Where the "V" of the cylinders makes the point - right under the carb remove the large (hex?) bolt to view the timing window. You'll see the line in the "window" as it;s marked on the crank. | ||
| Reepicheep |
(shhh... don't tell Aaron... but if you don't want to mess with the timing mark, you can see when the valve would be all the way closed by watching the pushrods. Turn the motor (via the back wheel with the tranny in gear) back and forth when you think you are close, and just look for the pushrod to be all the way down, I have done the job 4 times and had no problem doing it that way... but of course Aarons way is better). | ||
| Aaron |
(shhh ... that's what I do, too ... I was just trying to remove the judegement factor for the newbie ) | ||
| Bluzm2 |
Aaron, too funny my friend, too funny! I need a salt fix....... | ||
| Blasterd |
Thanks guys, I am going to tackle it tomorrow. If I have any problems I will post them. All of you have helped me in so many different ways, Thank You! Ken | ||
| Blasterd |
So in the timing window, the crank (or horizontal plate that moves up and down in the window) should be halfway up the window hole? Ken | ||
| Blasterd |
That was a stupid question..... I see now, the vertical line. What I did is since I have the primary off I rotated the mainshaft forward until the intake pushrod came down and then a little more until the vertical line was visible. Does this sound correct? Ken | ||
| Blasterd |
Should I apply loctite to the 4 big bolts? Ken | ||
| Josh_ |
>Should I apply loctite to the 4 big bolts? IMO - exactly as the manual says, no more no less. (which AFAIK means no locktite) | ||
| Blasterd |
I applied locktite to the 4 big bolts and the rest of them as well. All I could think of was one of them coming undone. Have I screwed up? Ken | ||
| Captainkirk |
Well, since I put blue LocTite on all my primary cover screws, I will stay out of this.... | ||
| Blasterd |
Kirk, I put red locktite and have been scolded by some here. Now I'm worried it will never come off again. Ken | ||
| Reepicheep |
Blue is fine, and in fact recommended for the primary cover bolts. I always use it, never had a problem pulling them out. The red stuff is meant for the scary stuff, sprocket nuts, crank nuts, brake caliper bolts, etc. | ||
| Captainkirk |
Ken, Why don't you pull out each screw one at a time, clean the threads and reinstall them (using either blue LocTite or none at all)? Using AntiMurphy logic, if you wait until you need to pull the cover, several if not all of them will strip. If you do it now, preferably during a stretch when you won't be riding for a few days, they'll pop right out and you'll wonder why you even bothered. Besides, LocTite seems to set up more securely with multiple heat/cooling cycles and time. Do it now while it's fresh, IMHO. Let me know how it goes. | ||
| Dion |
does anyone know the torch setting for the 4 bolts that hold the rockers for an x1? |
