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José_quiñones
| | Posted on Sunday, February 22, 2004 - 09:56 pm: | 
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Man on a Mission: Hyosung comes to America
edited by josé_quiñones on February 22, 2004 |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 12:06 am: |
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Damn Rocket,
Around these parts, at least at the track a "Superbike" is any manner of lightweight class (like SV650 or XB9R), middleweight (all the 600cc IL4s), heavyweight (liter twins and 750 IL4's) or unlimited (liter 4's mostly) that are hopped up beyond stock internal engine parts.
We got supersport/superstock for all classes, and we got superbike specs for all classes. I've seen plenty of SV650/SV700 superbikes.
But you are right, in the conventional wisdom of the buying public, a superbike these days is a liter class repliracer.
If Mr. Fischer was a racer, I can understand how he could find it proper to dub his new machine a "superbike." But not many in the buying public will.
JQ,
Be careful swallowing the propaganda from S. Korean companies. I learned all about their business ethics, or actually the complete lack thereof, the hard way. If I'm bitter towards the S. Korean big business, I have VERY good reason. |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 12:39 am: |
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Isn't this all a bit academic seeing as no one's ridden a Fischer yet?
I mean it might look good on paper where-ever the parts come from (and who builds vehicles with exclusively their own parts these days?)but it may be an absolute pig.
It wouldn't be the first time we've heard this story over here, look at Hesketh (who?), Munch, & many others. Some go to the wall, some survive as niche manufacturers, & some go on & up, Bimota, & yes Buell for example.
I wish Fischer all the best as competition & innovation drive the market.
The only thing any one can say with certainty is we'll have to wait and see.
Like most things in life (with a few exceptions)
"Don't knock it til you've tried it"
Personally I'm a trier, I always had jap bikes & never wanted a lumpy unreliable Harley, & a sport bike with a teased up HD lump in it, you got to be kidding! til a friend & I went and tried an S1W, and I changed my opinion, now I got an M2 which broke the day I bought it. My FJ1200 is 11 yrs older but will rip the Buells head off in a straight line & I can ride it all day in comfort. I love them both!
3 words for you all, "open-mindednes", "peace", & above all "tolerance",
Nothing works with zero tolerance, ask any engineer.
Cheers all, Grumpy |
Ferris
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 12:40 am: |
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...A turbo 12S sounds great but I'd prefer a V twin with belt drive twin cam 4 valve hemi heads coupled with a 6 speed transmission.
sign me up, Rocket. 
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Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 12:51 am: |
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Me too |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 01:29 am: |
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Uh guys... Ducati? |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 03:22 am: |
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So what Ducati? one of the most innovative producers on the planet, but nothing to do with Fischer except they use some of the same component suppliers, wonder why that is.
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Rocketman
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 05:49 am: |
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Ducati as in belt drive twin cam 4 valve hemi heads coupled with a 6 speed transmission. Just because its architecture already exists somewhere else is no reason not to build it yourself. More reason to build it so it's in the bike you really want. Hell, I wouldn't mind Buell building an IL 4. All engines have good points and I love the way IL 4's blur your vision. I love the way powerful V twins pull like a freight train. Two strokes like to be kept cooking, dancing through the gears and turbo's are like having acceleration wound up on a spring then you let go. They all feel different and they are all great in their own right. Time for Buell to try something different is my Buell wish, and I'm not talking Blast, more world beating.
Rocket
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José_quiñones
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 07:33 am: |
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So you used to swallow? I can see why you are bitter.
edited by josé_quiñones on February 23, 2004 |
Glitch
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 07:51 am: |
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They all feel different and they are all great in their own right.
Well said. That's why I love my Buell, I feels different, just the way I like it. The Fischer will be different also, that's why I hope they do well, there's plenty of room in the different department. |
S320002
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 09:12 am: |
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"...A turbo 12S sounds great but I'd prefer a V twin with belt drive twin cam 4 valve hemi heads coupled with a 6 speed transmission.
You mean something kinda like this?
http://www.motorcycle.com/mo/mcken/hh_tech.html\
Another bike that looked very promising but then faded away. |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 12:41 pm: |
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Grumpy,
Rocket is describing his Ducati 916. You want one, you can get a 916/996/998/999 pretty darn easily. That is all I was saying.
JQ,
Conned, exploited, raped and robbed was more like it. I'm still not able to joke about that unfortunate business. |
Bomber
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 05:26 pm: |
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nothing keeps South Korea from building a world class anything . . .their drive (as a people) and capabilities are world class . . . . .
I won't however, be the fikrst to buy any new product from them, for the same reason I'd be leery of buying the first of anything from someone . .. . . biz ethics in that part of the world are not ours' no doubt about it, and many who've done business there have been burned . . .. this doesn't take away from their ability to produce great products (you'd likely be surprised at how many you have in your home), but it's gonna take em a while to get up to speed, if you will, on making motorcycle engies. . . reverse engineering will only get ya so far, and then knowledge (bought or base on experience) is necessary |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Monday, February 23, 2004 - 09:11 pm: |
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Gregg, that will do and I hear what you're saying. Are HH out of business? If so I'd consider it cooler than cool in the exclusivity stakes. Spare parts would be hell though!!
Actually Blake I was using Ducati in general and not thinking of my 916. Please don't think I'm putting Buell down because Ducati build the kind of engine I described nor because I have a 916. That was not my point.
In the automotive world belt drive dohc 16v hemi heads are common place. Saab have perfected this type of engine since the late 70's. First in their rally cars then from 1984 to the present, all be it with chain drive. As Colin Chapman proved years ago, a 4 cylinder twin cam is formidable at producing good horse power.
Rocket |
S320002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 08:51 am: |
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Seann,
Don't know if they are still in business. Last I heard Paul Hallam (the engine designer) had left and the company name had been changed to Hunwick Harrop. As far as I know the X1R never went into production. Someone had decided that the cruiser model should come out first. It was about that time that Hallam left the company. |
Glitch
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 09:53 am: |
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So where does this fit in?
750cc's, 8 CYLINDERS, 4 CAMSHAFTS, 32 VALVES AND 13,000RPM...
I know it's not American, but neither is the X1R.
Would this satisfy yer need for speed?
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S320002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 02:08 pm: |
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One thing I have noticed is that some peoples' horse power desires seem to fluctuate wildly depending on bike brand. Anyone else notice this??? |
Wyckedflesh
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 02:52 pm: |
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The image I got reading Rockets layout above was a cross between the big twin TC engine, the MaxT 4 valve heads and the XB engine...in other words I read it as...belt drive, twin cam, 4 valve... |
Blake
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 03:55 pm: |
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Greg,
Yep, and the XB9's do a lot better than 77 BHP at the crank. More like 92 BHP. |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 - 07:29 pm: |
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As V8's go it would have to be the Norton Nemesis. Al Melling, an engineer from Rochdale, designed the motor. He also designed TVR's own AJP V8 modular motor (straight 6 and V12), the letter 'A' standing for his part in the design. Funny how that Nemesis motor looks similar to TVR's motor.Did I mention the Nemesis had perimeter brakes before Buell too <grin>.
I know it didn't make production but at least two were built and sold to someone in Hollywood but I don't know who.
Rocket |
José_quiñones
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 07:48 am: |
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from riderreport.com
Bike News
Fischer Plans Cycle Release
Ehlert Powersports
Rider Report
Friday February 27, 2004
Former AMA racer Dan Fischer told Powersports Business he hopes to introduce the industry to his motorcycle, the MRX, at the Dealer Expo in Indianapolis, Feb. 14-16, and said he wants to begin deliveries of the 2005 model later this year.
Fischer first publicly revealed his plan to build what he called the MR1000 in December 2002, but said that the bike, now coded as the MRX, has undergone a complete redesign since then.
"The MRX features a new engine, a new chassis and new styling (compared to the MR1000)," Fischer said from his office in Chicago. "Plans to use the original 1000cc Rotax powerplant had to be shelved after objections from Aprilia. But, instead of finding a direct replacement, we signed a deal with Korean manufacturer Hyosung to use their 650 V-twin coupled to a supercharger."
Performance, Fischer says, should be "similar to the one liter, but in a lighter package."
The frame for the MRX was developed by Gemini Technology Systems, the company that worked on Harley-Davidson’s VR 1000 program, and Brit designer Glynn Kerr shaped the bike.
A final design sketch Fischer sent to Powersports Business shows the MRX’s styling is narrower and sharper than the previous bike’s design.
A price for the supercharged MRX has not been announced, but Ficher said plans call for the bike to be offered alongside a more affordable naturally aspirated version that will sell for under $10,000.
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Glitch
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 09:44 am: |
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Good for them.
The super charger looks like it may be the thing to help 'em make it in the sportbike market.
Does a super charger boost straight away, or have lag like a turbo? |
Tucsonxb9s
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 09:57 am: |
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My understanding of how a supercharger works is that it is driven directly by the engine where a turbo is driven by exhaust gasses. On a passenger car the SC is usually belt driven right of the crank pulley, so the faster the crank spins the faster the SC spins. I'm definitely not an engineer so someone else can elaborate. |
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 08:37 pm: |
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But, they are not releasing a model with a supercharger. At least that is what Mr. Fischer said at the debut, right? Sounds simple... bolting a supercharger onto an existing V-Twin. Somehow I doubt that it would be as easy as it sounds. That might be one cool bike if they ever do it. I wonder where they would fit it and how much weight it would add to the existing 650. |
José_quiñones
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 08:41 pm: |
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Blake, read it again just in case you did not understand it:
A price for the supercharged MRX has not been announced, but Ficher said plans call for the bike to be offered alongside a more affordable naturally aspirated version that will sell for under $10,000.
edited by josé_quiñones on February 28, 2004 |
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 09:44 pm: |
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I guess it depends on which report you read JQ.
When was the report above written? It talks about introducing the bike at "at the Dealer Expo in Indianapolis, Feb. 14-16". Funny that already happened, was reported upon, and stated nothing about a supercharged version other than the fact that the tank label on the show prototype/model bike entitled "Supercharged" was incorrect and would not be on the production bike. But whatever, I know you want to believe, so feel free. I hope they come out with a supercharged version too, I really do. I'm just being objective. That and I missed your last paragraph.  |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 08:51 pm: |
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Fischer claim to be developing their own supercharger probably gear driven rather than belt.
The supercharged machine is claimed to be Fischer's first model with n\a versions available at a later date after initial SC models have sold.
Rocket |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 10:12 pm: |
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That is one of the stories they've told. I think that one came right after the story about a Rotax based liter twin. You like stories? |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 11:08 pm: |
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No Blake I just think you're being a little harsh on Fischer.
Fischer wanted the Rotax motor, it was Aprilia that stopped Fischer getting it. Where you get your info from is bewildering sometimes. I got mine from Claudio Castiglioni but please don't tell him I told you <grin>
Rocket |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 04:27 am: |
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The Fischer dealer here is not doing great but they are having a degree of success.
I shot my mouth off a year of so ago with some stupid "talk is cheap, there's much more to starting a motorcycle company than just saying you're going to make a SuperZoomer VL Deluxe.
Now each time I pass a Fischer on the streets (although I have only actually seen 3 of them) I eat my words and am reminded to be a bit more cautious when I share my wisdom.
Got me on this one, they did. |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 06:05 am: |
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Despite your sarcasm Mr Canfield, one would be a fool to write off a new venture into motorcycle design and production before said venture has had a chance to show its metal.
I'd suggest that 'fool' comment would apply more so to someone with insider knowledge of motorcycle manufacture.
I've ridden at least 6 Fischers, 1 of 'em around all 86 counties of the UK, and I have the helmet to prove it!
Rocket |
Blake
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 03:02 pm: |
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I don't follow that last sentence? You know six girls named "Fischer"? And what happened to your "helmet"? Is it sore? |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 07:25 pm: |
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Is this a Korean thing?
Rocket |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 12:15 am: |
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You talking to me or your helmet? |
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