| Author | Message | ||
     Ft_bstrd |
Well, it seems that his minions and allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo! The bill that is being pushed in 18 states (including Illinois and Indiana ) requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers. Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 unless the ammunition is coded. Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $2.50 or more! If they can deprive you of ammo they do not need to take your gun! This legislation is currently pending in 18 states: Alabama , Arizona, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Washington . To find more about the anti-gun group that is sponsoring this legislation and the specific legislation for each state, go to: http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.ht m | ||
| Babired |
lets hope the bill doesn't pass, even if it fails the price of ammo is going up! | ||
| Jaimec |
I hope it does pass. It's not taking away anyone's gun. It's just making their use more easily trackable. If you're afraid, just wear a pie tin as a hat when you go out shooting so the government can't take over your brain. | ||
| P_squared |
C'mon Santa! I've been good, so please bring me that reloading equipment & supplies I've been asking for! I'll be sure to get rid of all of it by 7/1/11. Honest. At least Texas isn't on the list. | ||
| P_squared |
For folks such as myself, who like to make real small holes in paper & varmints from long distances, taking away the ability to load my own rounds is virtually the same as taking away some of my guns. There's a reason they're capapble of shooting sub-MOA groupings, and part of it is due to the rounds I meticulously load for them. They shoot like crap w/ every factory loaded round I've tried. Now where's my pie tin hat? | ||
| Babired |
Jaimec if you shoot a revolver the casing stay in the gun. If you shoot a pistol you can pick up the casings. It doesn't make any since. Then I know a lot of guys who reload for competition shooting to get the best accuracy. | ||
| 4cammer |
"I hope it does pass. It's not taking away anyone's gun. It's just making their use more easily trackable. If you're afraid, just wear a pie tin as a hat when you go out shooting so the government can't take over your brain." Jaimec, I assume that you are not a gun owner or a shooter. I also assume that you have no problem with eroding rights as long as it does not affect you. Why does the government need to TRACK my use of a legal firearm? There is no reason to serialize every round of ammunition EXCEPT to make it harder for law-abiding people to exercise their RIGHTS. What do you think this proposed law will actually accomplish? | ||
| Just_ziptab |
I used to have to keep records of black powder sales and the stuff was coded with a tracer mixed in the batch. It's ID number on the batch was recorded to the buyer...........even tho hundreds, if not thousands of cans had the same ID number. This was enacted to find the source of bombs made with black powder. The law was dropped after a few years of it not working. How are they going to code ammunition.....and not have it destroyed on impact? Ammo collectors are going to be pissed if they have to destroy a lifetime collection with no compensation. Billions of rounds produced and fired every year..that's a lot of data to keep track of. | ||
| 4cammer |
"Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.)" For the life of me I can not grasp why a large part (but not the majority...) of this country desires to make felons out of law-abiding US citizens but refuses to acknowledge that existing laws are strong enough to attain their goal of reduced gun crimes. That IS their goal right? To reduce (elimination is impossible) crimes committed w/firearms? By criminals? | ||
| B00stzx3 |
I can see making it a requirment for crime and tracking purposes, but the destruction of already bought ammo is ridiculous. | ||
| Bott |
These idiotic laws have almost NO effect on street bought guns used to commit crimes. It's getting ridiculous... "if ammunition is outlawed , only outlaws will have ammunition" | ||
| Babired |
My 2009 range badge is ready so I can go and spend the day shooting with friends. Last Friday I had 3 other friends at the range with me and we had a lot of fun longarms to shoot. And we just sweep the casing off into the grass, none of us reload. What's to stop someone with bad intent from picking up casings if they were marked? K | ||
| 4cammer |
"I can see making it a requirment for crime and tracking purposes, but the destruction of already bought ammo is ridiculous." Would you also be comfortable w/the elected government installing "black boxes" on our bikes to let them know when a speed limit is broken? Difference is we all pretty much speed, very few of us commit crimes with our legally owned and Constitutionally granted firearms. The requirement for serialized ammunition is not for tracking crimes, but to make the legal ownership and use of firearms as inconvenient as possible. We have enough guns laws....not enough jails. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
It appears that they are seeking to code the bullets not the casings. This means that it doesn't matter if you are using reloads or coded ammunition, the casings are untraceable. That said, why would criminals not smelt their own rounds and reload them with black powder purchased and have rounds that were "untraceable"? This ONLY hurts law abiding citizens. I believe it will be challenged in that forcing citizens to destroy legally obtained ammunition without due process or remuneration I think would be challenged as unconstitutional. If you find a deal on ammo and stock up, will you be getting a visit from the ATF for "suspicious activities"? If someone breaks into your house and steals your ammo, how will you prove it? When that ammo is used in the commission of a crime and you have no alibi for your whereabouts at the time the crime was committed, how will you prove your innocence? Will there be a maximum limit of ammo allowed within a certain period of time to prevent "stockpiling"? What happens if you buy a caliber of ammo for which you have no registered weapon? How will you prove that you don't have an unregistered weapon? Will you need a special license to purchase ammo? Since ammo isn't specifically addressed under the 2nd Amendment, what prevents the same process, which prevents someone from obtaining a cannabis sales tax stamp because they aren't available, from making purchasing ammo impossible? I have ammo. It will NOT be destroyed. I have unregistered weapons. They will NOT be surrendered. I claim the same status of rebel that our forefathers did. | ||
| Oldog |
Thank you Jeremy, Unfortunatly this kind of thing is going to become more prevelant If passed into law I will become a fellon as I have a considerable stash of 45 acp ammo I wish folks would think about this kind of thing just a minute, and realize that there are 2 things that must happen to cause a country to fall, 1. disarm the populace 2. wreck the currency any one see an alarming trend? Or is it just me and my koolaid. Perhaps when they take our guns, bikes, airplanes, cars we can all live in a safe sterile world, like the one portrayed in demolition man. "Hi I'm Associate Bob, how may I assist you" | ||
| Reepicheep |
My 1945 Mosin Nagant was a great cheap gun... it was $80 to buy, and I got a great big "spam can" of ammo loaded in 1960 something for $60 or something (for like 1000 rounds or something). My intent is that my kids, and probably grandkids, will be shooting that gun with ammo from that can... 1000 rounds of 7.62x54 goes a ***long*** way. Sounds like its time to start sending some money to the NRA again (in spite of the fact that I generally find them fairly annoying). | ||
| Babired |
It appears that they are seeking to code the bullets not the casings. How are they going to read the code on a used bullet if they mark the very back of it? | ||
| Miamiuly |
Chris Rock on Bullet Control | ||
| 86129squids |
Allright- my 2 cents as a non- owning pacifict: We need more balls, not laws. With the latest global evolution of Islamist nutjobs doing their thing, I've been seriously re-evaluating my self-defense capabilities. Once upon a time, I visited a shooting range with a friend, shot pretty good for a noob. Leave out the weapons, I feel pretty good about mano-a-mano. Of course the thieves and nutjobs are gonna look at it a different way... Peace is a becoming more scarce- y'all have some, ya hear? | ||
| Midknyte |
That IS their goal right? To reduce (elimination is impossible) crimes committed w/firearms? By criminals? nah. Their goal is two-fold - 1) siphon as much money from us as they can and 2) make you think [feel] that they are doing something for you. They're getting better at doing both at the same time... | ||
| Bott |
Commercial Airliners are heavily tracked , recorded , reported , and controlled. That way , no law abiding pilots would crash them intentionally into World Trade Centers or Pentagon Buildings. Feel safe , fellow Americans....this Legislation will protect us. /sarcasm off... | ||
| B00stzx3 |
I am pretty scared. it went from Bush spying on our phone calls and email to Obama starting bullet control. I just might vot Libertarian, even though there nutty to. | ||
| Bott |
Meanwhile in Knife-Free Scotland. . . From an essay in Pittsburgh Live: After 1997's almost complete ban of handguns in England, Wales and Scotland (after a school massacre in Dunblane, Scotland), there is the belief a decade later that there are more handguns on the streets. Now, The Scotsman newspaper reports on the Safer Scotland amnesty project. Last summer 13,000 knives were turned over to authorities, no questions asked. Afterward, knife-carry offenses increased. A government spokesman warned not to make so much of those statistics. "We also stressed when we launched the amnesty that it alone would not deal with the issue." Looks like the amnesty didn't deal with it at all. The only "bans" that work are ones where you ban the violent criminals. You do that by building more jails and then locking them up for ever. Everything else is just posturing. | ||
| Ceejay |
For the life of me I can not grasp why a large part (but not the majority...) of this country desires to make felons out of law-abiding US citizens but refuses to acknowledge that existing laws are strong enough to attain their goal of reduced gun crimes. 4cammer Ditto-and one of the best sentences I've read in awhile. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Look if I really wanted to start some shi@t and civil unrest, its one coke bottle and 19 cents of gas and a wash rag. Ammunition keeps your stupidity on your land, bring it to my house and well, I can get real inventive to protect myself, my property, even with out your tracked, taxed and short supply rounds. The hell I could raise with a cool whip bowl, shards of glass, rubbing alcohol and surgical tubing will give even tactical crews shivers. | ||
| Danger_dave |
Australia de-armed its population 10 years ago. The govt put all the guns in a crusher and destroyed them. Society neither collapsed nor descended into chaos and we haven't had a mass murder since. edit - bad apostrophe. (Message edited by danger_dave on December 04, 2008) | ||
| P_squared |
And last I looked, I didn't live in Australia. No offense Dave, but I grew up with firearms. It's that whole 2nd Amendment thing. I have "issues" when someone decides it's better for me to not be allowed to have & use them lawfully. Of course when I was in High School, everyone either had a .22, shotgun, and/or deer rifle in their vehicle in the school parking lot. Taking them to woodworking class to make new stocks was common. 1 week for pheasant season, and 2 weeks for deer season were included as an "excused absence" reason during the school year. Long story short, leave my rights alone. I earned 'em thank you very much. | ||
| Kyrocket |
I just wrote my representative to see what he thinks about the legislation. I'll post back to let everyone know, if you're wondering what the law makers think. | ||
| Babired |
Is the country India de-armed too? | ||
| Ratyson |
Dave, is there anything, or was there anything in your constitution or bill or rights that guaranteed the citizens a right to bear arms? O.P. - Luckily in Alabama, the bill is dead... for now. We are keeping an eye open to see if and when the try to reintroduce it. (Message edited by ratyson on December 04, 2008) |
