| Author | Message | ||
     Glitch |
http://www.photoreflect.com/scripts/prsm.dll?event thumbs?event=0DAE008O I didn't want to hi-jack the "Check out Killboy" thread with this, so here goes. What do y'all think happened? I think he was going in too hot, didn't know how to hang off the bike, the front end washed, and he lost it. Also it looks like it's all brand new, gear and bike, so he may not have known his bike well enough to try what he did. Or was it as simple as a bone head move in front of a camera..."Hey look at me!" I hate seeing these kinds of pictures, but at the same time I seek them out, it keeps me in the real world. I also watch "bike crash videos" for the same reason. I would much rather learn from someone else's mistakes if I can. | ||
| Djkaplan |
My theory is he came in hot and let go of the throttle at full lean. It pitched the bike forward and overloaded the front tire so fast, he couldn't gather it back up in time. No telling, really. I bet he's not sure of what exactly happened. | ||
| Navygunner |
To me it looks like speed overwhelmed him. If you notice the photos before the wipe out he is not looking through the turn. Kind of odd the direction the front wheel is turning up to the point of loosing it. If he had been countersteering the wheel should have washed out the other direction. | ||
| Djkaplan |
"If he had been countersteering the wheel should have washed out the other direction." Huh? On second thought... nevermind. | ||
| Hughlysses |
It looks like he's already in marginal shape for the curve in the first photo. By the second photo, he's leaned so far he's about to run out of tire AND touch hard parts. It looks to me like the back tire lost traction and started sliding out. Note he never touches either brake through the whole sequence. | ||
| Rum_runner |
I'm fairly new at riding and not sure what you guys are talking about coming in to hot. Does that mean going to fast. And what does overloading the front tire mean. I'm sorry im a tard. I just don't want to do what he did. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Rum_runner: Too hot = too fast. Overloading the front tire is referring to the weight transfer if/when the guy completely rolled off the throttle. Going fast in a turn leaned over like this, both tires are close to the limit of traction (just about to slip). If/when he let off the throttle, more of the bike's weight transferred onto the front tire, which was already at its traction limit, causing it to lose traction and start sliding. | ||
| Dsergison |
no obvious mistake, just "too much" riding for a highway. things just go wrong sometimes. shame he couldn't just dust off the kitty litter and head to the pits. | ||
| Bcordb3 |
The first photo and fourth photo show it all. Throttle control is the key, sometimes more is better. | ||
| Glitch |
I'm with you Hugh. I think he just went beyond the tires. Note he never touches either brake through the whole sequence. That's not necessarily a bad thing. The last thing you want to do leaned over in a turn is grab a handful of brake. | ||
| Hughlysses |
The last thing you want to do leaned over in a turn is grab a handful of brake. Totally agreed, especially in this situation. I was just expecting that he might have grabbed some brake and caused this, but he didn't. | ||
| Glitch |
I'm thinking if he had grabbed the brake, we would be looking at a high side. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Hand full. no. Trail breaking. I do it all the time at the Track. Don't suggest doing it in the rain though!! | ||
| Rocketsprink |
This was the end result of the above.  | ||
| Lake_bueller |
I have no doubt this guy knew a thing or two about riding. You don't take a bike like that with race slick to the street w/o knowing how to ride. Being that we can only see the bike, we don't know all the conciderations. He could have been spooked by another bike or car. He could have had a momentary "brain fart" (been there, done that). But in looking at those later pictures, he's VERY luck to still be alive. He didn't miss that tree by more than a foot!! Just one more reason to keep the crazy stuff on the track  | ||
| No_rice |
thats what i was thinking. went in to hot on top of hard parts touching down and unloading the front tire. | ||
| Jb2 |
Ding, ding, ding. Bcordb3 nailed it. Picture four shows the front tire lifting. My guess is for whatever reason he had the bike over too far and lifted the front by digging or dragging the left peg into the pavement. Another thing photo four shows is the fork is NOT loaded or compressed. It also appears in the other photos the fork is not bottomed out especially when you go back and forth between 3 and 4. Guys that are used to dragging their pegs often get fooled when they lay one down. "It just took off sideways!"  | ||
| Ridrx |
Why would you carry that much lean angle and still have your butt on the seat? If he had been hanging off a bit he would not have been dragging parts, leveraging his front tire skyward. | ||
| Ulywife |
it keeps me in the real world I think this is why I didn't do the "wife thing and loose it" after picking Carlos and the Uly up in Maryville. I had made it through the Dragon in my Suburban towing a trailer (thanks to some Aerosmith) without incident. The Uly was actually in pretty good shape after it's little adventure and Carlos was standing there waiting for me. Lots to be thankful for. I hope the other rider is OK. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Rocketsprink... nice picture of some Italian sausage  | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I think he just went beyond the tires. Nope, I think he just went beyond his ability, or limits, call it what you will. How many of us have NEVER done that? | ||
| Xbullet |
Why would you carry that much lean angle and still have your butt on the seat? EXACTLY!!!! keep the bike more upright and maintain some use of your suspension! there's always the possibility of a little sand or loose gravel in the road, too... | ||
| Danger_dave |
My first thought was 'What happens when you treat the road like a race track.' | ||
| Dbird29 |
CSI Badweb? | ||
| Glitch |
Crash Scene Investigation (Message edited by glitch on April 08, 2007) | ||
| M2nc |
It wasn't me. Got Winch?  | ||
| Slaughter |
He exceeded the limits of his abilities AND those of the machine. There are loads of possibilties that can escape "analysis" in photos. When the front end tucks, you have a half second to recover - whacking the throttle open or lifting/unloading it on your knee. In tighter/twistier bits, it's much more sudden with less time to react than larger radius turns. I'm always looking for spares for my racebikes so these topics are always of interest when they're about recent crashes in the SO CA mountains. Once in a while you can get some really sweet deals on salvage bids. If you're going to go canyon racing, dress appropriately and keep your insurance paid up/current. Get me your contact information. I'll pay up to $2000 for an XB9 or XB12. | ||
| Glitch |
 I couldn't resist! | ||
| M2nc |
 The flight is not the problem, its the landing. | ||
| Slaughter |
I'm an unabashed, unashamed salvage vulture. I actively encourage street racing since there's no way to convince people to tone it down, I figured I may as well reap the benefits. | ||
| Toe_cutter |
It seems what ever issue it was occurs between photo 4 and 5. If you compare the two you will see the backend is kicked around, why I don't know. Caught a peg maybe? | ||
| Roadrailer |
I have no doubt this guy knew a thing or two about riding. You don't take a bike like that with race slick to the street w/o knowing how to ride. I don't think either is any indication of rider skill. It's not uncommon for the squids to mount race takeoffs on their supersports. I agree w/ Hugh; he looks out of shape from the start. Just too much speed for his skill level. Damn lucky he didn't nail that tree. Hopefully he scared himself to the track. | ||
| Krassh |
Either that our his bike payment exceeded his paycheck and it was on purpose. Hello insurance. | ||
| Xb9 |
Kinda hard to tell in the pics but looking at the first few he may have had too much air pressure in the tires.(look at the contact patch) Doesn't look to be much sidewall deformation which you will see running race pressures, he should be running lower pressures riding that aggressively. | ||
| Rick_a |
...and sometimes you can do both and still end up on your back. Riding hard anywhere has some risk...just more so on the street. | ||
| Slaughter |
Rick_a - you got that right! I've lost the front end about 5 times on the track - only saved it twice. Once with whacking the throttle and driving my knee down on the ground, the other time I stood the bike up and rode off outside the turn into the dirt... kept her up and came back on the track. I'm just too a-skeered to go that quick on the street. You just don't have options on the road except HOW you crash (hint, keep your arms tucked when you tumble) (Message edited by slaughter on April 12, 2007) | ||
| M1combat |
I think BCord got it too... It doesn't look like he was back on the throttle. Maybe that turn tightened and he figured he'd just stay off of it and lean it in just a hair more? Maybe the tires were too hot? Don't know though . Also... That bike in Sprink's post is definitely not the end result of that particular crash... If that's what you meant Rocket? Oh and yeah... hang off a little... sheesh. Trail braking in the rain works just fine Rocket... Only use the front though and use it sparingly. (Message edited by M1Combat on April 12, 2007) |
