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Court
| | Posted on Friday, February 21, 2003 - 06:30 pm: | 
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>>>>I am living proof.
Okay...but only three in Australia. I'll ignore, for present, the book I proofed and reviewed for Amazon on New Zealand.
Besides, you were predisposed to ultimately end up in the company of folks like us. You are T-R-O-U-B-L-E !
We were having a good chuckle, with some folks from London, last week about the "transoceanic phone patch" wherein Vickie held the cell-phone to the home landline at 180o thus patching you with Fiona some 17,000 miles away.
The great story was how I bribed the Quantas luggage guy at LAX to find you.
Twinxt playing GPS for Losties (Lost Aussies) and Solicitor for Wayward Dutch Secret Agents, it was a busy time for me.
Any explanation why Paul is, in comparison, so quiet and reserved.
Tell me you are booked for this year???
Court |
Groundscrew
| | Posted on Friday, February 21, 2003 - 07:57 pm: |
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Tooslow,
I too am 6'2" and 220 and have owned a Blast. It was a fun bike, but after getting my S3, I realized how beat I was after riding the Blast. My brother also had a Ninja 250 and a M2. Ninja was also fun, but did not hold a candle to the M2. I know, different kinds of bikes, but I have to agree with the board ride the M2. This board has never steered me wrong and for that I am grateful.
Matt |
M2me
| | Posted on Friday, February 21, 2003 - 10:22 pm: |
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I'm a former Sportster owner who "graduated" to the M2. I think the M2 is what the Sportster should have evolved into but Harley just wouldn't do it because of tradition or whatever. Luckily Buell did it. The only time I miss my Sportster is for cruising around the parkways at parade like speed. The M2 shakes more at idle and has too much torque right off idle for that type of riding. But, for everything else the M2 is superior in every way. |
Crusty
| | Posted on Saturday, February 22, 2003 - 01:11 pm: |
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I've owned several Sportsters. My wife has an '84 Iron motor. I love Sportsters. A Cyclone is a Sportster that does EVERYTHING better. Acceleration, cornering and braking are all better. To borrow a quote, "Just ride one." |
Mikej
| | Posted on Saturday, February 22, 2003 - 01:36 pm: |
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The Buell is what the Sportster should have become. But it took Erik going off on his own to make it happen. IMHO. |
Bomber
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 08:44 am: |
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another view would be that Buells (especially the Ma Duece, IMO) is what the "bob jobs" would have evolved toward had they not fallen into the hands of the fashion-focused, and turned into what are laughingly called choppers today . . . . . I admire the worokmanship on many of those bikes, but can't for the life of me see how thay might be ridable |
Newfie_Buell
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 09:29 am: |
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I agree Bomber,
I can appreciate the work and craftsmanship of these machines and some are just beautiful to admire but how can something that is raked out so drastically be comfortable to ride at all. Some of them look like medevil torture devices.
Just my thoughts. |
Road_Thing
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 10:51 am: |
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>> I admire the worokmanship on many of those bikes, but can't for the life of me see how thay might be ridable
Dead on, Newfie and Bomber! When I look at the craftsmanship and attention to detail on some of the choppers I see, I think "wow, what if he'd decided to build a real live motorcycle instead of a rolling piece of sculpture?"
I guess some it comes from too much time in the shop and not enough time on the road!
r-t |
Bomber
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 10:55 am: |
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my mind keeps going back to something like the Crocker . . . . damn near coach-build bike that (if reports are correct . . .I've never ridden one) beat the pants off the standard road bikes of the time . . . .. lots' of room for that in the market (sorta kinda like the born again Vincent we've seen lately) . .. . .
but Kandy Tangerine bikes with neon lights and 12-inch wide primary drives get more press, and stand out at the Highland House/Rock Store/Marcus Dairy . . . . . . . |
Tooslow
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 12:11 pm: |
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If the M2 is a bob job, what the heck is a XB9-s?
By the way, you guys have evolved my thinking (for the better?). I've dropped the Sportster idea. I suppose for very leasurely rides, I do still have my '72 Moto Guzzi.....lots of fun at any speed below 70MPH.
I'm now fully on the Buell path. Though I fear that, before I drop that much money on a tube framer, I'll need to try an XB9, as well. So now I'm at M2 vs XB9s. If you guys didn't think that I was nuts before.....
I can't wait for the weather to clear so that I can get in a test ride. Also, my SV650 sold on Sat, so I'm itching to buy, more than ever.
If only I could afford one of each.
-Mike |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 02:23 pm: |
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Quote:"If only I could afford one of each"
Boy did you hit the nail on the head with that one. I love my M2, and would love to get an XB9s, but don't know how I will be able to bring myself to part with my Cyclone.
The plan now is to just keep riding the Cyclone for another 3 to 5 years, when (hopefully) some good XB9s's will start showing up in the $5k range, and just keep both bikes.
You could easily take the same approach. Nice used M2's are showing up at the $4-5k range, which is a heck of a lot of bike for that money.
I think both the XB9S and the M2 both have their place (at least while the M2's are $4500 and the XB9s is $8900... if prices were similar the M2 starts to look pretty weak... which is no doubt why Buell ain't selling it now even though it does not have a direct replacement).
The only real reason to take the XB new now is reliability. If you are going to freak out about rocker box gasket leaks and broken exhaust mounts or other minor issues, don't get the M2, and go buy the XB.
Me? I... much to my amazement... suddenly get the whole "Harley" engine thing now... perhaps more even so then a great many new Harley riders. I would rather have an engine that feels and sounds right then one that is 100% reliable but sounds wrong. I don't care about peak horsepower or peak speed, I just want a bike that is flexible and fun to ride, and looks and sounds cool. I really like riding a bike that I could strip down to the cases in an afternoon. I want a bike that snorts when I open the throttle. I would rather have one carb that is easy to maintain then 4 tiny carbs that are impossible to remove even if it is only 95% as powerful. I want a belt that I only have to touch every 30k miles, and I don't want to be constantly scraping greasy goo off my back wheel, even if it does cost me 2 horsepower. I don't want my clutch bathing in my engine oil. I want a motorcycle that I will be able to get new engine parts for 25 years from now. I (or a member of my family) fully intend to be riding the bike at that point.
I owned both my Buell and a 600cc UJM inline four, and I (literally) had more fun working on the Buell then I did riding the Yamaha. Naturally, riding the Buell versus riding the yamaha was no contest... it never got ridden except when I had too in order to keep lots of little carbs to get clogged up with varnish.
Motorcycling is about the experience, and the experience is richer with a quirky machine designed by small group of focused genius's with a narrow vision. I fail to be inspired by machines designed by a comitee to be the best on paper that are nearly indistinguishable from 50 other competing models. |
Tooslow
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 07:46 pm: |
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I got that "Harley engine thing" back in 1981, reading the Rider test of the original Harley Sturgis. Then editor, Tash M*&^%$ (I don't recall how to spell his Japanese last name), did as fine a job of describing the "soul" of the machine, in that mag, as you did above. And that Black Shovelhead Sturgis, the first Harley with belt drive, BTW, was gorgeous. I don't think that Willy G has ever topped that effort. I remember that mag like seeing my first Playboy.....
Anyway, I haven't negotiated yet, but, between the new M2 and the XB I figure that there's about 2500 to $3K. I'm a pretty good 'wrench', but don't enjoy working on things as much as I once did, so the reliability of the XB, as I've heard from you guys on this site, is a factor. And, you don't have to squint too hard to see that some things are better designed on the XB (rear suspension, belt change accessibility), though a few things are worse (where do I put....anything!)
"pretty good wrench" = farm boy + aircraft mechanic for Uncle Sam + working my way through school fixing lawn mowers, chain saws, and weed eaters + some car restoration + presently being an engineer (just like you, Bill, but electrical)
I am concerned that the XB will be missing some of that Harley soul vs the full 1202 cc M2. I hope the test ride will reveal this. If it feels like my SV650, I'll cry. I have a mental picture of the M2 being a more amusing beast than the XB. A little more rowdy and uncivilized, but also less serious. Right or wrong, I hope to find out. Your opinion is valued, if you’ve tried both.
The extra cash for the XB is, of coarse, also a BIG factor.
BTW, this should be on the exhaust topic, but will I definitely have studs/clamps breaking with the M2? I've read in the exhaust section that, with the M2s cams, the factory exhaust and intake work almost as good as aftermarket (other than the areas of aesthetics, weight, and sound quality). So, I will probably leave the exhaust stock (I don't like to stir the neighbors). Should I still expect exhaust reliability problems? The rocker box leaks sound easy and permanent to fix, but I don't want to have an ongoing fight with breaking exhaust clamps, studs, etc.
Thanks
Mike |
Crusty
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 08:14 pm: |
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If you get a new M2 with the upgraded exhaust hanger, you should have no worries. I put the upgrade on my 2000 last year, and have been problem free ever since.(10,000 miles) |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 08:55 pm: |
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Mike:
It's a win-win deal. I'd weigh the economics in and if the situation dictates, I'd have little reservation going with a good used M-2 which can be had in the range of $5,000. Well documented and pedigred M-2 abound and can be expected to provide many miles of trouble free operation with only the routine Buell maintenance.
If the $1Ok falls under the impediment threshold, go with the XB9S.
Either will be infinitely more rewarding and smoother to ride than the Sportster and you are going to meet a great group of friends.
Whichever you purchase, be sure to put in for vacation from September 19-22, 2003.
If you need info/manuals to borrow and take a look at before you buy, just let me know. I have the owners manuals, service manuals and parts books for every Buell ever built and they are available to any Badwebbers to borrow, when needed.
Don't buy without taking a proper test ride. "Proper" doesn't mean it has to be fast or "at the edge of adhesion" but rather it should be your style and pace to allow you to evaluate the bike. There are plenty of folks here who can help you get a ride lined up.
Court |
Road_Thing
| | Posted on Monday, February 24, 2003 - 10:16 pm: |
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>>>(I don't like to stir the neighbors).
...wuss...
r-t |
Newfie_Buell
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 25, 2003 - 08:13 am: |
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I know my neighbors really don't appreciate the sound of the S1 with the Vance & Hines idling at 2000rpm as it sits in the driveway warming up early in the morning. Seeing the houses are about 30 feet apart and the driveway is right in between. That sound really booms at 7am.
Who Cares, I just love the Bike"
The thing with neighbors they eventually may move!!! |
Djkaplan
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 25, 2003 - 12:58 pm: |
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Tooslow,
I have a 2000 M2 with over 17,000 miles and I've had no trouble with exhaust stud breakage or any problems with the stock exhaust in general. I've had the troublesome V&H muffler for over 10,000 miles and never experienced any problems with it (the neighbors don't like it though - perfect). I don't have the updated front muffler mount either.
Except for routine oil changes, clutch and primary chain adjustment, and checking fasteners for tightness, I haven't laid a wrench on my bike. Hell, I've only adjusted the belt twice in 17,000 miles. I'm not sure why some people think Buells are high maintenance bikes; there's nothing to maintain. I have to look for stuff to do on it.
I think your assesment of the M2 being amusing, rowdy, uncivilized, but less serious, is spot on.
I couldn't have said it better myself. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 25, 2003 - 07:33 pm: |
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My stud breakage was a direct result of the trashed bushing from the original front exhaust mount. The updated mount made all the problems go away, though I still treat the whole system with kid gloves. A Buell exhaust is not a thing to be trifled with 
When my stud broke, a local dealer (cough* eastgate buell in Cincinnati *cough) had just done the shock upgrade on my bike (flat out lying to me point blank on 4 different occasions). They claimed to have not heard of the goodwill on the front exhaust mount (that a good dealer at that time would have done when doing the shock recall). But they somehow had the upgraded part in stock. Suprise suprise. They also failed to note that the stock front bushing was completely shredded and no longer doing anything, with lots of metal on metal contact and wear.
That front exhaust was one of only three things on my Cyclone that I can say were genuinely forseeable design defects (the second being the primary chain tensioner, the third beeing the speedo sensor). Two of the three were corrected by the factory before I had a problem, and both would have been addressed before any problems developed if I had had an even remotely competent local dealer.
So I would have to say all but one of the problems with my M2 but one (speedo sensor) were dealer issues more then factory issues. All in all, I think that is a pretty good record for a mechanical platform as complex and demanding as a high performance sporting motorcycle with an aircooled pushrod 45 degree twin.
TooSlow... My undergraduate is actually EE, not CS. I was a year from graduation and looked through the help wanted and saw 20 CS jobs for every 1 EE job. Decided to take a couple years of grad school and go CS (which I actually was a lot better suited for then EE anyway). I still do some EE stuff just for fun, and in the CS field it is really handy to understand the actual electrical foundations of what I am breaking
Bill "keeps letting the smoke out of those little black things" Kilgallon |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 25, 2003 - 09:00 pm: |
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>>>My stud breakage was a direct result of the trashed bushing
Mine was from partying in college. |
Rick_A
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 12:35 am: |
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I had the rear strap break on my 'Trapp a few days ago. An automotive clamp and hanger will ensure they hold FOREVER I think |
Sfarson
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 12:51 am: |
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I'm fortunate enough to have several nice makes in the garage and absolutely adore the M2. I have the opportunity to compare all the time and come away knowing the Cyclone is special and a keeper.
Want to mention a number of wild turkeys are in the vicinity of my central Colorado home, typically coming by everyday. The M2 idling outside the garage, with the bellowing V&H can, simply drives the tom turkeys nuts. They come from all over thinking they are being challenged for the harem, fanning their feathers, gobbling, strutting. Revving the bike really sets them off. Look forward to it everytime I reach for the M2 keys. |
Newfie_Buell
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 08:26 am: |
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LOL at Court,
Apart from the front mount on my Vance & Hines breaking (they did replace under warranty) and the front exhaust mount was also replaced I have had no problems with it.
I think the trick to keeping the exhaust trouble free on the Buell is to make sure that all the mounts are square (lined up properly) so there is no unequal stress placed on the parts. When I took mine apart I noticed that the mount was not perfectly straight and I think this caused the problem. When it goes back on I will make sure everyting is straight and true before torqueing to the proper values and tightening each fastner a little at a time.
I could be totally wrong but just my thoughts. |
Tooslow
| | Posted on Sunday, March 09, 2003 - 08:49 pm: |
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So, Friday I picked up a black ’02 M2 for $6700, and some change, OTD. I'll blame this on you guys, but I've actually wanted a Buell since the early days. I just needed your input to get past the cold feet. Thanks !
During my quest, I saw ’02 M2Ls for as low as $5700 + TTL, brand new ! I didn’t bite because I’m a tall guy, and because, it was worth a few bucks to stay with my local dealer. ‘Call me a fool…. The M2Ls are in Florida and Indiana, if you check trader.com.
Due to several factors that I won’t go into, I wasn’t able to arrange a test ride prior to buying. My M2 is the first Buell that I’ve been around, with the engine running ! I’ve got about 250mi on it now. First impressions:
At idle, there isn’t nearly as much shaking as I envisioned, either with the motor vs the chassis, or with the chassis vs the rest of the world.
The first 50mi were painful ! Trying to keep the engine limited to the dictated 2500RPM made for none too pleasant riding.
The world is a much better place now that I can run to 3000 RPM (and an occasional zip to 4K.)
‘Bike needs bar end mirrors in a big way.
The lean pilot jet is obvious. Thanks to you guys, I left the dealer with a #45 pilot jet, and a maint manual on order. The jet went in this evening. I haven’t tried it out yet.
The front brake makes my SV650 brake look weak.
The bike doesn’t seem to handle as precise as my SV, but I’m sure that it will, once I get in some real saddle time to get used to it.
Yes, 5th gear is somewhat of an overdrive. I rode home on a dark, dear infested road, last night, in 4th. I can't imagine the European pulleys.
The engine is not happy below 2500 RPM, unless it is in a low gear, and then it’s not too happy, but “the Harley engine thing” is definitely there, and it’s good.
There’s no real impression of the machine after only 250 break-in miles, but I think that I can tell that this bike is going to be a lot of fun. Here’s another big thanks to all for you for your advice. I’m off to China in three days, so I get no more miles for two to three weeks (I'm assuming that I get back in one piece)
Thanks Again
TooSlow (but probably destined to be at least 5 to 10 MPH faster than I used o be) |
Racerboy
| | Posted on Sunday, March 09, 2003 - 09:22 pm: |
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"TooSlow (but probably destined to be at least 5 to 10 MPH faster than I used o be)"
We all knew that and didn't want to let you in on it until you were hooked...Anyone else betting it will be more than five or ten...
You did good on the price thingy, Mike...Isn't the www wonderful...If no one has told you before, go to Buell's web site and click on the BRAG area and we'll see you soon at a rally...V2WIN and I are planning on Safford, AZ in the fall...
Stay safe,
Bob |
Hans
| | Posted on Monday, March 10, 2003 - 01:57 am: |
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CONGATULATIONS. Man that did cost us hard labour for that difficult deliverance: But what a healthy baby: Looks exactly like its brothren. Black is beautiful. If it grows up and the dip in the torque curve is stretched and shocks and springs have been adjusted it will change its character totally and will soon be your best playmate during coming years. Happy future !
Hans |
Bomber
| | Posted on Monday, March 10, 2003 - 08:22 am: |
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Slow . . .. figure on 15 - 20 faster, Mike . . . ..
good deal . . .have a great time with your new toy, and, as others have written, adjsut the suspension, get the jetting dialed in, and keep giggling! |
Djkaplan
| | Posted on Monday, March 10, 2003 - 01:09 pm: |
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You're gonna love that bike!
Did anyone tell you about the wheelie clause when you ride a Buell? They're mandatory.
If you think you can't do one, wait until your first wide open powershift into second..., you better be hanging on. |
Newfie_Buell
| | Posted on Monday, March 10, 2003 - 01:19 pm: |
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Can do it in third too?
Just roll on the thorttle hard in 1st or 2nd and the damm front end lifts.
Congratulations on the newest edition to your family!! |
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