| Author | Message | ||
     Davegess |
Newfie is right on the money, let them get you on the road and than finish the fix when all the parts are in. I think it is unlikely that the frame is bent. Those things are pretty stout. | ||
| Blake |
Todd, What Henrik and Mike said! Those yours may be fine, a frame can be bent pretty badly without the paint cracking. These guys are screwing you bigtime by not providing you a loaner. Suggest you marshal your resolve and get the situation set right. These people are not your good friends, they are not your family, it is simply business, and after wrecking your motorcycle, rather than treat you as they should, they are bending you over the barrel whether purposefully or through unfortunate ignorance or a combination of both. My first Cyclone was totalled, mainly due to the frame being bent. It exhibited absolutely no cracked paint. | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
Todd, In a way we are all giving you proper advice on this, some of us are recommending more aggressive negotiation tactics than others which are fine when being nice simply does not work. Once again falling back on my experience as a claims adjuster (thank God I am out of that hell and now just into Commercial Insurance Marketing/Sales), I always felt it was so much nicer to deal with a Lawyer or other pertinant professional than to deal with a screaming irate client/third party. By threatening legal action it could be a blessing to the dealer because all they will do is put it in the hands of their lawyer then it will be dragged out for a much longer duration and the only ones comming out on top are the lawyers. Much better to sit down, be firm in your demands and negotiate this to a reasonable resolve. If the dealer is refusing (maybe you have not yet discussed this component of the repair) to have the frame measured then bring to their attention the liability they could face IF the frame is bent and as a result of their oversight another accident occurs. Also, as per Court's advice put it in writing to the dealership and outline the whole experience right from the first minute you arrived at the dealership to have the bike serviced. Include the reason for being there, person who rode the bike, details of the crash (if known), and details of any negotiations that have been made with them. Include you demands and request that they respond in writing to your demands. Also ask for their response in writing. Either hand deliver and have a copy signed by the person taking the letter or send registered mail. This will indicate to them that you mean business. If that fails then resort to either mediation or lawyers (I could give you my opinions there but I would piss off the legal community-especially the ones capitalizing on accident & injury situations) Talk to others who have dropped their Tube Framed Buells and see how bad the frames have been damaged. Unless the bike actually hit a solid object other than just skidding along the ground due to their engineering and construction I would think it would be pretty hard to bend one. I could be totally wrong on this comment. There is a thread on this BBS on Crashes & Mishaps go there and get the names, e-mail them for their experiences. Like I said, its a lot easier to deal when your reasonable but firm with your demands than being outright irate. Keep us all posted on your progress. | ||
| Davegess |
Todd, correct me if I am wrong. Dealar is saying they will fix the bike better than new. They have ordered the parts to do this. They are saying that they cna get you up and running with out some of these part right now and will fix the others later. They are also saying that the bike is worth $4000 on trade in on a new bike and not that they have a $4000 limit on how much they will spend to fix it? This does not sound unreasonable. Unless the bike is really trashed and seems unsafe to ride Not having seen the bike (post a pix if you can) it is hard to say. As far as the $4000, if that is the trade in value I am not surprised to hear such a low number. It's a used bike and the dealers really don't want them on the floor. I bet you can get much more for it selling it to a private party. BUT you will lose money if you sell it, it is not a harley. Bikes are far worse than cars in this regard. If it was me I would probably ride it assuming that it is in pretty good shape with just your usual cosmetic damage. I have dropped my Honda a couple of times. Tore up the foot pegs, handle bars, mirrors, turn signals , etc. but fortunatly no bodywork damage. I just pick it up and ride it. | ||
| Stormfool |
"Contact the Harley Davidson Dealer Affairs Folks" Hmmmm, guess that's different than Buell customer service, eh Court? And where exactly might one get a hold of that phone number, please? | ||
| Henrik |
Father Gess, I disagree; until the fog lifts, and a clear picture of what the dealer is going to do is formed, I'd leave the bike with them. I disagree with you about the frame as well. Frame strength and straightness: when MCN tested the SV650 a few years ago, their newbie rider (a good tester for that bike) had a low speed, rather mild mishap on the bike; a few scrapes, bent bars ... the usual. Since they at the same time were doing a story about Computrack, they sent the SV out for a check-up. Forks were straight, swingarm was tip-top, bike looked and felt ok when ridden. The frame was bent! Now, if Todd had dropped the bike himself, it'd be up to him to decide whether to check for straightness or not. Since the dealer should be the one to take charge and make sure everything is intact on the bike - I don't see how there can be any question whether the frame should be checked or not. There is no question whether the front motor mount bolt should be replaced - right?? If the bolt snaps and the motor drops - really bad things could happen. If the frame is tweaked, the bike could handle unpredictably in a turn - and really bad things could happen. I fail to see the difference. Newfie - I must not be expressing myself very clearly  I'd get my own insurance Co. involved and have them make the necessary contacts to achieve what I wanted. They'd be paying big bucks if I had an accident that could be even remotely be connected to defects from this previous crash, and should as such be very interested in getting everything checked and fixed. And I'm sure you're right, everyone else involved would be more comfortable dealing with professionals Henrik | ||
| Kerryx1 |
I'd contact my insurance agent and absolutely and adamantly request that my motorcycle be removed lock stock and barrel from that incompetent freaking unbelievable dealership. Post the name of it so I can personally pay them a visit, deck a couple of assholes on my way to petition Milwaukee to revoke his Harley franchise. Add to that a charge of open lewdness when I'd stand there and piss on the owner's desk in plain view. I don't care if the bike has to go a hundred miles away to be fixed correctly, You're NOT locked into having incompetents repair your motorcycle! That will hit him in the pocket big time! Right now he's fixing it at dealer cost and apparently that's slipshod. Let him know he'll recieve the repair bill and transportation charges. Take it away from that place before they screw it up even more. Consult with your insurance carrier's attorney. Convey your wishes and make demands. And by the way, E-Mail me the address of this dealership. Paybacks are a bitch in my travels! | ||
| Stormfool |
Hey Kerry while your at it stop by Fort Lauderdale--I'll introduce you to some other "typical" HD/Buell techs! If you'd like we can "prime the pump" with a gallon or two of your favorite brew!  | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
Henrik, I agree the frame should be checked by an independent third party professional. Like I posted earlier, Todd should put his demands in writing to the dealer outlining what he is expecting and request a response in writing to include the frame being checked. Give them a time frame to respond then take the matter to the next level. Assuming liability rests with the dealership his own insurer may not get involved as that adds up to expenses, besides his own insurer may not get involved due to the fact it was in the hands of a servicing professional. Up here on the island if your vehicle is in the hands of a professional that is repairing your vehicle then your own policy could deny any claims and the repairing mechanics commercial insurance would be the primary responding policy. The insurance laws are different from state to state and province to province and without seeing the wordings I would not want to comment. The principles are basicaly the same though and insurance companies sometimes can be a real pain in the ass to deal with. Kerry, After your stint in Florida come on up and I will fill ya with some Canadian Beer then give you a list of people that could use a real dousing. | ||
| Toddm2l |
well, they don't have to give me a loaner... I guess I will just have to grin and bare it. I don't think it is right but, after talking to a lawyer, he said they have to fix it to new, or pay me the worth of the bike before the wreck. They offered $4,000.00 fixed. 2002, said it was because they didn't make it anymore. 5800.00 would be fair not what it is worth, but fair. I don't trust them really... They are waiting for paint i think. But, don't the tanks come pre painted with decals? Who knows... But, this is a fact. I will not do business with them anymore. Also found out that I was lucky, because if I would have signed a service agreement, They would not have to fix the bike. It's going to cost them an extra 600.00 or more to have the computrack done in Atlanta. 600.00 being the minimum amount for shipping and the actual check. I would like to thank everyone or the good advice. But, I was told you don't always get what you want. Everyone have a great new year! | ||
| Dynarider |
Paint? You tell them "fuck you, I want a new tank", not some bondo job they will perform on it. Who the hell is this horseshit dealer? | ||
| Toddm2l |
should i be able to keep my old parts? | ||
| Blake |
Yes. | ||
| Court |
>>>>should i be able to keep my old parts? The operative word being "MY", they belong to you. | ||
| Bads1 |
Dyna's right they should be giving you a new tank not repainting your old one. Besides that if they do repaint they will have to play around with the paint alittle because it won't be identical match.PPG PAINT #DBC-61876.I've bought this paint 2 seperate times and 2 different places and white had to be mixed in both times to get the match just right. My bike is also blue streak.So if you decide to let them paint make sure its spot on when there done even check it in different light its a 3 stage paint it can be deceiving.Still insist on all new parts though. Have a Happy New Year Todd. | ||
| Rick_A |
Painted tank? I'd be raising hell! They just don't want to see the $300+ it'd cost 'em for a replacement. If you're gettin' $$ for the bike they should give you the current value and cost of any additional non OEM parts... remember, don't wreck 'em, restore 'em  | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
As for the old parts they may be considered salvaged parts and where the dealer is replacing with new or good as new they may be considered theirs at that point. Not sure how the insurance or legality for your state but thats how it would work north of the border. Todd, fill out your profile it would help. | ||
| Cowboy |
Please post the dealers name and city. I would hate like hell for one of my hard earned dollars to end up in his pocket. | ||
| Nevco1 |
Todd... At the risk of repeating myself for the third time, get your insurance company involved. They can turn your dealers Gonads into Rocky Mountain Oysters. Based on this thread, it sounds like a lose-lose transaction so far. | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
Todd, The thing with insurance companies you have to realize is that unless you have some kind of limited waiver of depreciation endorsement and up here its not available for recreational vehicles then the basis of settlement is usually Actual Cash Value and they also usually offer repair or replacement for parts, meaning that if the part can not be properly repaired then it should be replaced. Sounds like you got some kind of agreement worked out. Why not post what they are doing for you?? AND SOME PICS | ||
| Toddm2l |
My insurance would not get involved, because of my limited coverage. working on the pics. How long does it take to get OEM parts? Like a all the plastic bodyparts? | ||
| Court |
>>>> How long does it take to get OEM parts? Like a all the plastic bodyparts? Buell has been saying within a week. Some folks are still off on holiday, so I'd add a week. | ||
| Bads1 |
Todd i've ordered body parts and have gotten them in about 5 to 10 days but it could take alittle longer. Being I'm right here in Wisconsin it might be just alittle faster for me. | ||
| Rick_A |
Just ride it without any body work for a while...it'd look BAD-ASS | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
I have ordered parts way up here in the North Atlantic and its only taken about 10-14 days. Don't forget that I am also 30 minutes ahead of all you. | ||
| Nevco1 |
Sorry to learn your insurance company, by merit of your limited coverage, will not assist in the matter. Looks like you are on your own unless you employ an attorney which will most likely cost more than the R&R to your bike. Bummer. | ||
| Dynarider |
I fail to see what the hell his insurance company has to do with this. The dealer screwed it up & they have or at least are supposed to have insurance to cover just such an event. Its up to his dealer & his dealers insurance to right this situation. | ||
| Mikej |
If the victim of an accident is unsatisfied with the opposition's insurance company's actions one can utilize their own insurance policy and then let the two insurance companies fight it out. This is partly what I have done due to a less-than-fair offer. If he can get a more comfortable resolution from his own carrier, which it appears he can't, then he might be better off bailing, but this seems to be a moot point. In my case the difference between valutions of my bike was over $3,000. | ||
| Nevco1 |
Thanks Mike! Dyna, I do agree with you concerning it being up to the dealer and their insurance carrier (at the dealers discretion) to right the wrong. However, I always consult my insurance carrier before settling with the perp or their carrier especially when they come up with a quick settlement offer or disagree with my quotes. They can advise you if you are getting a fair deal or a screwing. Furthermore, in many instances, I have just turned the whole thing over to my insurance carrier as they will expedite the repair at a shop of my choice and then collect from the perp's carrier. This also leaves the door open for medical issues (if applicable) that may arise later. However, for some reason this owners carrier does not want to get involved. Limited coverage, liability only, no comprehensive, age discrimination, poor driving record, there are so many variables that could cause this to happen and none of those mentioned could apply to this incident. | ||
| Dynarider |
Bill, I am sitting here trying to figure out what Todd means by limited coverage. Is it as you guesstimated & he only has liability? If so thats pretty damn stupid on his behalf to have a 2002 M2 & really have no insurance on it. I mean liability on a bike is almost pointless, how much damage does a bike usually cause to another party? Does Todd even have any insurance at all? That is sounding more & more like the plausible explanation. He kept saying it was going to cost him. Not if you have insurance it wont. Too damn many variables that we dont know & for some reason Todd simply will not tell us the whole story. |
