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Victory
Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2020 - 09:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Get the Bar or get the big Motor Mount?
Going 1275 Big Bore
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/784976.html?1462661223
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Red93stang
Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2020 - 11:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You know my answer will be biased but........

I would be glad to do another run of these.
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Dck996
Posted on Sunday, November 29, 2020 - 10:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm interested in a bar for new style isolator. I managed to completely miss your earlier run.
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Red93stang
Posted on Sunday, November 29, 2020 - 05:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

No problem
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Monday, November 30, 2020 - 08:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Always wanted one of those. I assumed I'd try to make one someday, but know that without a press, I'd probably break my vise or at least come out with a bar that doesn't have a clean bend and looks horrible. Probably safer to just buy one. If the price is reasonable I'd likely buy the real deal from you.

Victory: Can I just recommend both? I think if I was only buying one, for the cost I'd just buy the stenzel bar, but if you're already investing in the 1275 kit, one of those nice new engine mounts would certainly top it off nicely! Another cheap option if you can find one, is the old S2 engine mount. They were a bit bulkier than the later mounts, don't think I ever heard of any of them breaking, and had a polish to them that looks a bit nicer than the normal mounts. One of the bolt holes needs drilled out, but otherwise I think it's a cheap upgrade if you can find one. Make sure you replace the mounting bolts with new ones of the correct grade, whatever you end up doing.
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Victory
Posted on Monday, November 30, 2020 - 01:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ill pass on the S2 mount. Its missing Heim hole!

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/47623/515920.html

(Message edited by victory on November 30, 2020)
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2020 - 08:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

ah, I should've looked at your profile to see what bike you had. It was only the later tubers that had that heim joint. I know my S1 doesn't use it anyway.
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Victory
Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2020 - 08:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Welp not going big bore now. Will just be freshening up the top end. Leaning towards the brace now.

Lets just say the 97 S1 I demoed was up in the air as soon as I got out of the dealer drive way. All I did was move the throttle just a little to move the bike. Lucky to survive that I dont think we let it warm up long enough either. Its hard to believe the factory let the motor mounts get smaller.


Not telling what happened for the next hour after that!
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 11:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

What was done to the S1? Standard heads with an exhaust and air filter? When I got mine it had a forcewinder and an exhaust, and it didn't take a lot of work to get the front wheel off the ground, but you had to be deliberate about it. Now that I switched back to the stock exhaust(still have the forcewinder), the front wheel really prefers to be on the ground. Without using the clutch I've gotta get to the good RPMs, preload the forks, give it a serious handful of gas and a good tug on the bars for it to come up. Someday down the line when the bike gets a refresh I'm planning on a 1250 kit and headwork that is at least comparable to the 98+ thunderstorm heads, nothing over the top. For this kinda bike to be what it's supposed to be, I shouldn't have to work that hard to get the front wheel off the ground haha.

What happened to the plans for the X1? did the S1 test ride convince you the big bore wasn't necessary or was it something else. I'd be surprised if an S1 with standard heads was pulling harder than an X1.
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Victory
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 12:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Sorry about confusion. S1 statement was a reminiscing of a demo ride when the S1 was new. I am not involved with an S1 right now.

Its winter in the great lakes. Because of the need to build a map from scratch for the 1275 too, the build has been scrapped. 1275 is the new 1250 build too. The Fuel Injection requirements for mapping start at Square 1 right now for anyone. For 1250 Twin Cycles has a starting point but logging and full adj is going to be required.

The good news is that I was able to secure newish STD bore parts so the X1 will live on.

(Message edited by victory on December 02, 2020)
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_buelligan_
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 03:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Have you tried talking to Hammer Performance and see if they have any maps already for you? They have a bunch of race Buells, I'm sure they probably have a map or at least could modify one enough for their 1275 Kit and your setup.
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Jayvee
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 04:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

So if no motor mount is needed, you going for the Stenzel bar copy after all?
I'd love to get the 1275 kit for my M2, maybe someday.
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Victory
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 04:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yes talked to Hammer. Hammer specializes in the Harley / Buell Carburated Sportster not Buell FI. There is a big difference. Buell FI 1275 market is teeny tineeeeeey.

I will install the Bar now. There are 3 left on Ebay.




(Message edited by victory on December 02, 2020)
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34nineteen
Posted on Wednesday, December 02, 2020 - 04:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

What was done to the S1? Standard heads with an exhaust and air filter? When I got mine it had a forcewinder and an exhaust, and it didn't take a lot of work to get the front wheel off the ground, but you had to be deliberate about it. Now that I switched back to the stock exhaust(still have the forcewinder), the front wheel really prefers to be on the ground. Without using the clutch I've gotta get to the good RPMs, preload the forks, give it a serious handful of gas and a good tug on the bars for it to come up. Someday down the line when the bike gets a refresh I'm planning on a 1250 kit and headwork that is at least comparable to the 98+ thunderstorm heads, nothing over the top. For this kinda bike to be what it's supposed to be, I shouldn't have to work that hard to get the front wheel off the ground haha.

I'm working on a 1275 kit for my S1 as well. I'm just sticking to stock cams and the original Lightning heads, but had Hammer do their Impact porting on them. I also have the billet mount, and was curious about the "stenzel bar"
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 08:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I saw there were stenzel bars still listed on ebay, and from what I can tell between the pictures on the listing and the pictures on the old 2016 Badweb post where he was selling them here, it appears they're the same exact part, is that correct Jeff? The price is a little higher on ebay, but that's to be expected after ebay/paypal fees, and general inflation.

34nineteen: Very interested to hear how your bike compares after that. What I'd like to do with mine is at minimum get my bike back to feeling like it did with the V&H on it while I keep my stock exhaust, but wouldn't complain about a little extra. I know it's silly to want to do engine work to a bike and leave the stock exhaust on it, but the noise gets to my head a bit.
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89rs1200
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 10:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have installed Stenzel bars on all five of my and families S3s. What one will find is noticeably decreased vibration at all RPM. This reinforces our belief the bar has reduced harmonic vibration of the motor mount, which leads to longer bolt life.
I believe the cost was justified by the decrease in vibration alone.
American Sportbike replacement bolt kit included the explanation that there is a harmonic vibration of the stock mount which causes stress on the Left side bolt. It continues to explain that not just any bolt will be strong enough. Thread length, bolt grade, and installation procedure are very important.

Have had several head bold failures:
~ All have been the Left side bolt.
~ All failures have been of the stock bolts, (Rust was found on all original bolt shafts where they passed through the mount).
~ Replacement kit bolts have not failed nor have they rusted like the stock ones.
~ Had one failure where the bolt head did not fall off. It was held on by part of a thread, but the increased vibration told me that a bolt had failed.
~ All but one failure was before installation of the Stenzel bar.
~ Fortunately bolt removal is quite easy with a drill and easy-out.
~ Follow installation directions exactly, to include oiling the washer, Locktite, backing out and torquing twice!!
~ !!! Indication of failure is an increased vibration at all RPM!!!!
~ Lessons here:
~~ Ride a lot and learn your rides vibration signature.
~~ Check bolts before and after every ride.
~~ On long rides, carry a bolt kit.
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Victory
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 10:36 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

So what was the American Sport Bike Bolt replacement procedure? Hell Bells I don't think I have the Updated mount instruction sheet either! Also just saw something about suggesting the bolts be replaced if the mount brace is removed. True or Not where do we buy the correct bolts at now? Al!!!

(Message edited by victory on December 03, 2020)
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 11:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Not having to worry about the front engine mount breaking would be nice, but trying to reduce vibrations was my primary reason for wanting to try the Stenzel bar. Oddly some people report is reduces their vibrations, other people report that vibrations got worse, which is odd, but I still think it's worth trying because my bike vibrates a lot.

Also curious where the best place is to buy a new bolt kit now that American Sport Bike isn't an option.
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34nineteen
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 11:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

St Paul and Twin Motorcycles sells the bolts and washers. When you consider the motor is being held up by those two bolts up front, and what the consequence of them breaking is, also the risk of this ruining a cylinder head, and the hassle of extracting broken bolts from the head, replacing those expensive bolts and washers dont seem so bad.



(Message edited by 34nineteen on December 03, 2020)
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Screamer
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 12:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Agreeing with 34nineteen that the bolts should always be replaced. The bolts are considered a one-time-use because they “stretch”.
Things I’ve mentioned before:
The condition of mating surfaces of the head and mount also needs to be confirmed.
Most importantly, clamp load needs to verified by measuring distance from underside of the bolt head (or washer) to the mounting surface on the head - when the bolt is installed with light torque, but without the mount. That distance needs to be less than the “thickness” dimension of the mount.
Recall 0810 kits included washers to spread the load under the bolt head - and provided a method to shorten the shank of bolt. This helped insure the bolts would not bottom out before full clamp load on the mount was achieved.
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89rs1200
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 12:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Saint Paul Harley-Davidson has the bolt and washer. They may have a kit, but I did not find it. Call them;
https://st-paul-harley-davidson-buell.myshopify.co m/search?q=front+mount+head

From Badweb;
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/853983.html?1563247967
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/727760.html
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/disc us.cgi?pg=prev&topic=47623&page=686883
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/667504.html
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/338976.html
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89rs1200
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 12:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Motor Mount Bolt Kit instructions from American Sport Bike;


Motor_Mount_Bolt_Kit-American_Sport_Bike.jpg
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_buelligan_
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 12:55 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The new updated bolts are Grade 9 bolts made by F911, you can order them from St. Paul HD but you can also order them from your local HD dealer as well. Every Harley dealership can now order available remaining Buell parts since 2017, not saying they will cause some are still sour pusses but they can. If not you can get them from any hardware store that carries F911 bolts.
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89rs1200
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 12:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

twinmotorcycles.nl also has the bolt.
https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/artikel.asp ?mc=1&aid=126
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89rs1200
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 01:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Motor_Mount_Bolt_Kit Buell_Recall_B018.pdf

application/pdfMotor_Mount_Bolt_Kit-Buell_Recall_B018.pdf
Motor_Mount_Bolt_Kit-Buell_Recall_B018.pdf (499.5 k)
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Victory
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 06:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks 89RS . Ill add this. When mine broke I got the bolt kit from American Sport Bike and i just ordered what Al recommended. A Left handed carbide drill bit and the strait splined extractor. Got the stuff from Mcmastercar catalog. Mine was easy and started turning with the drill bit. I just looked for the extractor and its MIA.
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Red93stang
Posted on Thursday, December 03, 2020 - 10:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You are correct Josh! Yes that’s me. I still produce them in small batch form and have sent them all over the world.

89rs1200 this is what I have been telling people for years. The reduced vibrations through the RPM’s and at cruise speed is unbelievable and you would think it would be the exact opposite. Thanks for your post and testimony!
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34nineteen
Posted on Friday, December 04, 2020 - 10:36 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I may have to look into one of these. As I see it, reduced vibrations is a good thing for longevity of these parts that are getting hard to find in some cases.
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Friday, December 04, 2020 - 12:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'll definitely buy one eventually, I'll try anything I can to damp some of these vibrations. I planned on waiting till I had some time to get into more stuff with the bike, but if the price is any lower if it's a bigger batch order and you're not dealing with the ebay fees, I'd consider just grabbing one now and hanging onto it for when I'm ready. They look worlds nicer than what I'd manage to come up with on my own haha.
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