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Big_jim59
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2018 - 02:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have a Vance & Hines muffler on my 2002 Ms Cyclone. I noticed that the pop rivets had all vanished from the front after a long ride. The holes are now wallowed out. Does anyone have any suggestions? Should I pull the muffler and replace the pop rivets with new or will they just break off again?


Vanc & Hines missing rivets
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Ocbueller
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2018 - 07:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Shouldn't just break off if everything is properly supported and secured. Disassemble and repack, making sure the perforated tube inside the muffler has not broken its welds. Some washers may help where the rivets wallowed out the holes.The rivets should be stainless steel and fit snugly. Rebuild-able, but a little fussy. Good luck.
SteveH
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Big_jim59
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2018 - 09:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks Steven H. I think I did use aluminum pop rivets before and that might be why they broke so fast. The vibration is mighty hard on components. The more I looked the more it looked like a disassembly and repacking job. Thanks again for the reply.
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2018 - 10:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Buell mufflers are a really tough application.
Since they have to move with the engine, everything has to be massively overbuilt.
Any tiny looseness cascades into broken shit in short period of time.
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Mike_lee
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 05:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I purchased a kit for my ss2r from Bristol Core. drummer recommended them. got a nice sheet of steel wool, steel rivets, a screen to wrap wool, SS zip-ties, as well as packing. was like 65$ if I recall. Morgan is the guy to talk to.
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 07:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I would definitely go with steel rivets. If you need to, because of the wallowed out holes, you could always drill them out a little bigger and use some wider rivets so they're less likely to break.
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Williamscottrobertson
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 08:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I think the key to keeping these mufflers going is a repack every 4-5k miles and the wishbone front mount. I had a vh pipe with 3500 miles on it and 90% of the packing was gone.
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S1owner
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 05:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

There is a particular method for attaching and securing these exhaust. Pm me for Buellistics exhaust 101
That being said I do know the the can you have is known for falling apart
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Mike_lee
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 05:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The wishbone front mount works with these ss2rís?
if i ordered the kit from st pauls ( https://sphdonline.com/collections/s1-lightning-mo dels/products/s1001-01a1-buell-header-support-kit- fits-most-tube-frame-models-l19d )it would have everything i need? Prob dont need the regulator plate, or could i still use that? I thought that was for the x1
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S1owner
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 05:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The wishbone is the same for all tuber. You should be able to use the reg mount you have but not sure
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Mike_lee
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 05:55 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

But i dont have to use it?
Im just interested in the exhaust mount.
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S1owner
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 06:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Only if your regulator is there. I am not super familiar with the m2 stuff as far as reg location
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Big_jim59
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2018 - 09:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I got the muffler out and it fell apart that the head pipe rivets. All the rivets were gone. The head pipe holes are wallowed out but since it is mild steel I was thinking of just having them welded up and redrilling them. The holes in the outside aluminum case are shot too but I was thinking of cutting them off, making the muffler shorter by 1/4" and drilling new holes.

I used to be a Norton mechanic back in the day. We had no end of muffler and exhaust pipe breakage due to owners solid mounting their mufflers. On the M2 Buell the forward mount is fine but I don't think the rear mounts are not actually isolated. There are rubber pieces in the two rearward mounting positions but the bolts that hold them in place negate any flex. I am going to see if I can rectify this in some way
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Tuesday, December 04, 2018 - 09:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You don't need the regulator bracket. If you're not using it, the instructions say to use a washer in it's place. I don't think it came with the washer, but I just went to lowes and grabbed a stainless one.

The only thing you might have to pick up is a spacer. The stock exhaust has 2 steel plates about half an inch apart. The V&H just has one, so you just put a steel spacer in to fill the rest of the space. It doesn't have to be anything exact, the rubber bushings in the dogbone mount move in and out to fit whatever size.

Your plan for the muffler definitely sounds good. If you're redrilling, that would even give you the option to put more rivets in that what was originally there so they hold a little better. The rear mount does let the can slide forward and back, so cutting some of the aluminum off should work perfectly fine. You'll just have to make sure the exhaust will slide up far enough to make up for what you cut off. If nothing else, you might have to file out the holes in the top bracket to let the exhaust move a little further. Another option if it's steel, is to have some nuts welded inside the can. Then you can use some button head bolts and won't have to worry about the rivets.

The front and rear have rubber bushings in them. The rear bushings press into the castings on the bottom of the engine, so everything should be able to flex.
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Mike_lee
Posted on Tuesday, December 04, 2018 - 10:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

those bushings can be found here...
https://sphdonline.com/collections/s1-lightning-mo dels/products/s1157-k-genuine-buell-muffler-mount- grommet-kit-95-02-s1-x1-s3-s2-m2-b5h
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Big_jim59
Posted on Friday, December 14, 2018 - 11:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I got the Vance and Hines rebuilt and repacked. I used over sized stainless rivets and repacked the can with new fiberglass packing. The stainless pop rivets were a real pain. I had to buy a heavy duty rivet tool to cope with the added stress and even then it was still tough. It took all my strength to pull them through. When they popped it shot the spent rivet center so hard it stuck in the ceiling of the shop. I changed the oil and I am ready for spring!
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S1owner
Posted on Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 12:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The stainless rivers are tough. I always use a pneumatic rivet gun with them
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Ft_bstrd
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2018 - 02:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The V&H cans are way to fragile for Buell use. You can patch and repack and repair, but you'll be fighting an uphill battle.

Last one I'll ever own disintegrated all over North Georgia.

Switched to a SuperTrapp and haven't had a single issue. Much better made.
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