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Buell Forum » Old School Buell » M2 Cyclone » My new old cyclone killing my savings... 1 step forward, 3 steps back... « Previous Next »

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Resinears
Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2016 - 03:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I bought a 2000 cyclone locally (Canada) that read well - Mikuni HSR 42, carbon fibre parts, baker chain conversion, etc. etc. etc. Lots of scabs and warts on this bike, but I wanted something to "fiddle with".

I sure got my wish, as this thing has cost me dearly just keeping it going. 1st issue was with the petcock - running out of gas with a half full tank. Next issue was the gas cap - solved with eBay billet solution $. Next problem was the choke cable collar breaking when I was finger tightening it after playing with the jetting. Then I decided to take the primary off to check the clutch and tranny (skipping out of 1st gear when pulling away). This resulted in the clutch cable nipple breaking where it goes into the primary (wasn't anywhere near tightened yet). Now I'm looking for threadserts to repair a stripped footpeg bolt, experienced when putting the primary back on. This is while looking for a replacement exhaust (vance and hines is rotted out), and perhaps a new front end, as the cost of a new replacement rotor (mine seems warped) is big compared to maybe a new front fork assembly off a donor bike.

Lastly, the front isolator bolt on the driver side has snapped off in the head (don't know if it's gonna come out or not, and it took a couple of threads worth of head with it.) All stuff that I can probably deal with, but the lack of replacements is making this trying.

Where do I get the replacement isolator to head bolts? Any ideas for Canada sources?

Cheers,
Resinears
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Lakes
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 12:47 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hi Res , sorry about your problems
I too got a used M2 2000 about 4 years back. But i have owned a number of harleys and knowwith muotor & gearbox. But my M2 was bone stock sutouck CV40 stock headers jjst sport muffler had tge ra e kit ( US gearing carbon aircleaned, lightning ignition module )
I found one bolt on front engine mount (2 bolts to front head, one broke off ) so it held motor up and removed the front engine mount, once front engine mount was removed i could see part of tge broken bolt was showing & just enough to get vice grips onto it. So first i sprayed WD40 onto tbe broken olt and i left it to soak in, then fitted the vice grips & turned roken bolt ba , & forth with care, then it came out easy enough i then cleaned up tge thread, i cleaned both threads. Then ordered new Buell engine mount bolts also ordered a billit engine mount & new top isolator & a stenzel bar. I also noticed the lightning ignition module had a very agressive advance timming, so ordered a Dyna adjustable module so i could retard ignition timing & set my own advance curve.
Also noticed the stock CV had very lean settings, so as i had a Bobby Woods CV43.5 that i had used on a twin cam dyna & had owned & loved for many many years it had the Woods K3 fuel curve & Bobby had put a larger air bleed & set up the idle so could run lean but idle perfect ( found all this out just looki g at carb) so i got an S&S sportsted G manifold made adaptor to fit the woods carb
Worked perfect with same jetti g as had on T C88 Dyna, well thats been runi h sweetly for tge past 4 years now as it has 100,000k's 60k mile, i'm going to do an upgrade as i like ridi h this bike. Hope your luck improves
Sounds more like poor maintanance by owner you bouht from.
Good luck
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Lakes
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 12:49 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Sorry for some of wordi g its the pad i'm useing & fat fingers
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Reepicheep
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 07:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

If it were me, I'd pull both heads, put them in bubble wrap, and send them to either Pammy (CycleRama) or Dan (NRHS) and ask them to remove the broken bolt, repair the damaged boss, clean and port them, and replace any worn valve train parts.

There is a lot of wisdom buried in the archives about that bolt breaking. I know it will do it if it is loose, not sure if there are other causal effects you should address before putting it back together.
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 09:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Sounds like the bike is making you work for it!

I bought my S1 last spring under the assumption that it needed a gas cap ring, front turn signals wired in(came with mirrors with built in signals), and the front breather bolt was missing. Easy right?

It was gross and rainy when I bought it, so even though I took it for a test ride I couldn't really get on it, and the bike was already gross and wet from the guy driving with it in his truck for a while. Once I got to riding it I found out the right fork seal was shot, the front rotor was worn, the choke didn't work, it has a sputter at 3k rpm, the trip odometer wouldn't reset, the petcock had been rebuilt upside down so the lever pointed up and was impossible to reach while sitting on the bike, the clutch cable housing is cracked and drips near where it screws into the primary, the isolators were completely shot, the front brake switch didn't work, the brake lines were rusted, the front MC was jammed and the lever wouldn't return on it's own, the turn signal switch in the handlebar controls wasn't working in one direction, the turn signal flasher was dead, the shifter and break lever bushings are shot, one of the fittings on the oil tank has a slow leak, and the sidestand switch was faulty, which left my stranded the second time I tried to ride to work and my wife had to come pick me up in the truck.

So.... I know how you feel

Aside from that, I still love the bike more than any other bike I've ever owned. My only thought at this point is that I wish I had known how much I'd have to spend on spare parts, and would've just spent an extra $500-1000 on one that was closer and already in great shape, instead of thinking I found a great deal only to spend the extra money and have to do all the work myself(honestly I like doing the work). Just think of it as "it can only get better from here" as you work through things one at a time.
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Reepicheep
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 10:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

And just for encouragement, I bought a 1978 Kawasaki KZ-400 in a bucket for $300 just for fun. I've restored it to a rat bike runner, mostly, and am still chasing problems with it.

I look back at it now and think "cool bike, cool project, but the time and money would have been MUCH better spent bringing back an old M2, becuase an old M2 is SO MUCH BETTER than a 1978 KZ-400".
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 11:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I repaired the threads on a front motor mount with a time-sert. They are full steel inserts, unlike a heli-coil which would be a very poor choice in this application....

The kit comes with all tools and 4 inserts,

For a blind hole you need an insert .25 inch shorter than full depth of hole so that it can be fully inserted.

I have had no issues whatsoever since fixing it this way.

I have a full write up on the forum under an S2 build.


http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/728956.html?1388882476
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 11:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Bolts are F911 stamped bolts...

http://web.archive.org/web/20081121162707/http://w ww.f911.com/fore2.html
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 11:47 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have replaced most of my front rotors with wave rotors.... I've recently moved and still don't have garage fully sorted but I might be able to locate a stock 6 pin front rotor.....
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 11:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The stock clutch cable has a very weak threaded insert to screw into the clutch housing on the primary cover. You have to completely disconnect the clutch cable from the lever and the cable guide at the frame... it needs to thread in and out for install and removal in a direct line with no load or it will break...even the aftermarket heavy duty cable should be installed and removed in this manner to prevent damage.

Replace the foot peg, or try a time seat in that as well

I've even used time-serts in the derby cover to repair bad threads..

I've bought some really rough tube frame bikes and brought them back to nice examples....

I've learned to never be surprised by the damage done by previous owners....
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Reepicheep
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 11:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Wasn't part of the problem with the front mount bolts snapping either the head machining, or the mount machining? I can't remember which.

The boss broke on Resinears, so I think he is past the point where a timesert will help him.
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Resinears
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 01:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I haven't had the opportunity to completely remove the isolator from the head yet, because there is now snow on the ground, and the car has to live in the garage too. From what I see, the bolt snapped about 1-2 threads into the boss, which caused the outer face of the boss (about 1/16") to come off. I have the piece, so I'm hoping that after I remove the broken bolt from the boss, that I can jb the face of the boss back on, and then use a time-sert to put it all back together. I'm really hoping to do this all with the engine still in the frame. If any part of this repair is not successful, I'll have to take it out and will look at less "barnyard" methods. Unfortunately, I don't weld, so it will be expensive.
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Resinears
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 02:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hi folks!
Jolly, Reepicheep, Upthemaiden, and Lakes,
I appreciate the comments and observations. I was attempting to answer and post via my email, as per the directions that appear in my email notifications), but it seems that was not successful.

Jolly, if you find the rotor, I'm interested! I have tons of spares with the bike, but not a rotor.

Do you happen to know the actual dimensions or sku numbers for the 911 bolts? I'd like to order some, but not sure about the size/length. I think that was what was in there, so the broken one should be fun to get out. a cobalt bit should work...
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Brother_in_buells
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 03:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Some helpful info about bolt sizes here,
http://badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/47623/3 38976.html?1205261911
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Resinears
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 03:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks Brother!
Just what I needed.

I googled and searched, but that one didn't come up.
Cheers
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Brother_in_buells
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 05:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Your welcome!

i did google F911 bolts for buell
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Resinears
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 09:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I hadn't heard of F911 bolts! I googled front isolator bolt size for cyclone M2, and found lots of references, but no actual sizes.

They don't seem to exist locally, so I'll be looking for a source online willing to ship to Canada. Funny how I can buy stuff from all over the world at reasonable rates, but get bent over with shipping from the U.S.

Thanks again for the help!
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 09:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'll start searching for the rotor...

I don't recommend JB weld for the face of the head. It's CRITICAL that it's a perfectly flat face on plane with the other bolt mount point.

If it's damaged at that level it should be fixed by the people that have done this before and have the tools, jigs, and machines to do this perfectly.

Something else to think about, once you pull the head you should pull the cylinder and replace base gasket as well, extremely high probability that once you loosen the torque on "the stack" and you end up with a leak at the cylinder base.
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Jolly
Posted on Wednesday, May 03, 2017 - 08:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Just "found" this thread again... what's the update?? Is all well and you're riding this season?
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Resinears
Posted on Wednesday, May 03, 2017 - 10:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I did repair the broken flange on the head with JB weld, only to hold the 1/8" portion that flaked off back on. The broken bolt was removed and the balance of the threads seemed to be sound. Hopefully that will hold. I had an extra front mount which I used, as the existing one had deflected somewhat from supporting the front of the engine by only one point.

A few rides and now I have a much better appreciation for how the suspension is also affected by the "soundness" of the engine mount. The whole bike is much tighter.

Yesterday was the 1st day I rode to work, and was pulled over on the way home and ticked for $310 for having an expired drivers license. (Birthday was last week). Kudo's to Edmonton's finest for keeping our roads safe!!
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Upthemaiden
Posted on Wednesday, May 03, 2017 - 10:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Glad to hear you made some progress and have actually gotten out on the bike. I agree with what people said about the engine mounts needing to be perfectly flat, but in all honesty, I probably would've fixed mine the same way you did. I'd just keep an eye on it, take a look at it after every ride, and maybe keep an eye on ebay and the classifieds for a used head in the mean time, so you'll have it if the mount ever cracks for good.

Tough luck about the ticket though. Sounds like he might've been having a rough day, because I feel like most cops would've seen it just expired and given you a couple weeks to get it renewed. What can you do...
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