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Buell Motorcycle Forum » Old School Buell » Archive through April 29, 2009 » Polished aluminum turned green!? « Previous Next »

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Pkforbes87
Posted on Thursday, April 16, 2009 - 11:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Just got my cam cover and primary cover back Tuesday from getting polished. There was still some dust from the polishing compound in little crevices and the shop told me to just give them a good cleaning with a hose.

I cleaned them off real well with a garden hose and they both started showing weird patterns and spots like water spots but they were still wet. Now they've turned a greenish hue that is pink/purple in areas if you look at it with light hitting it at the right angle.

Absolutely no chemicals were used on the surface while I was cleaning them - just water. I've tried Mother's carnuba cleaner wax to get the finish smooth again and it doesn't appear to have any effect.

WTF happened!? The finish is still very reflective, but I was kind of hoping for an aluminum colored reflectivity - not this weird ass green!

before washing, when they still looked good:


these were all taken after spraying them down with a freakin garden hose - NO chemicals









excuse the double post on QB.. I'm kind of panicking right now. polished green shit won't match my orange paint very well >insert nervous laugh<
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Phelan
Posted on Thursday, April 16, 2009 - 11:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Rather than mothers wax, try mothers aluminum polish and see if that makes a difference. If not, maybe there was heat, or high friction that caused a lot of heat, that caused a blueing effect?
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The_italian_job
Posted on Thursday, April 16, 2009 - 11:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

the best product now in the market, a little pricey but definitely worthing the money it costs, is Mothers Billet Metal Polish.
go with that and you'll see that the covers will get back nice and shiny as they were.
sometimes depends on the water as well, it might be too hard and leave some stains.
go to advance auto parts and buy that product, is the right one to keep your covers nice and shiny in the future too...
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Brinnutz
Posted on Thursday, April 16, 2009 - 11:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Phillip,

I think your covers are defective. I will send you all of mine as trade to take care of your problem.

There, I solved it for you!
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Pkforbes87
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks Edoardo, I'll pick some up tomorrow.

Whatever the polish costs, I'm sure it's more economic than paying for a polish job then ending up with these hideous covers!

Question about polishing - should I be rubbing it in a lot when I apply the polish? or simply go over the whole surface real quick then spend a lot of time when buffing it off?

When I was using the carnuba wax to try and get the finish back to normal I was getting plenty of residue off onto my microfiber towel, but no visible difference in the finish

This sucks.
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The_italian_job
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

the best way to use that product: apply it with your finger and keep rub it with the finger until you see the white cream turning black (that's the dirt coming off your part, but you shouldn't see dirt this time).
then take off the cream with a regular towel and buff it up with a microfiber towel.
you won't need to rub the covers since they're freshly machine polished. you have just water stains, don't worry.
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The_italian_job
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

oh, and the wax is for paint, not for billet polished metal: it doesn't work on that! LOL
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Phelan
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:49 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That black isn't just dirt, but any impurities that are stuck on/in the metal. I usually use about about a quarter size for ~12"x12". Rub it all over, then rub the heck out of it, even after it turns black, then wipe the acces off with the same towel and use a clean microfiber towel to buff it. I don't use the finger method because it dries out your skin a bit.
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Phelan
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

BTW, I've never heard of Mothers Billet Metal Polish. I'm guessing it's different than Mothers Aluminum and metal polish? I get mine from Wal-Mart for $4/can.

(Message edited by Phelan on April 17, 2009)
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Joesbuell
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 03:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Autosol is the bees knees!
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Eshardball
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 05:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Your primary has been substituted by the same aliens that abducted my S1 fuel tank.They haven't mastered the duplication process yet
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Eshardball
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 05:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ditto on the Mothers. Great stuff. The only Aluminum on my S1 that isn't polished are the engine cases
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Pkforbes87
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 12:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I took the covers back to the shop doing some work on the cases, as well as the shop that they had do the polishing. The verdict from the polisher is that the covers may have a small amount of zinc content, or the more likely option is that my drinking water has some zinc content. When I washed the covers off yesterday with non-distilled water the zinc, aluminum, and water all reacted to cause the weird change in color. Apparently you're supposed to seal the surface before exposing it to ANY other chemicals (including the shit in my drinking water)

The polisher hit the cam cover real quick with some compound and a buffing wheel and the finish quickly went back to a beautiful polished look. He said he felt sorry for me and has never seen this type of discoloration from any kind of aluminum corrosion before, so he will buff them back out for free.

Well I learned something today. Mission accomplished. AND I have Mothers Billet Metal polish and Mag Aluminum polish standing by to keep things pretty from now on.

I'm gonna keep this in mind though for my next project. The discolored finish on the covers would look great on an old-school themed bike.

zinc + aluminum + water = artistic corrosion
(I seem to remember something from science class about cathode, anode, and electrolyte?)
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Wardan123
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 02:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

My sister is a metal artist (current Master's student at The Ohio State Univ.)- patina is what you have struck upon. She has all sorts of ways to make metals look cool as hell.
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Hootowl
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 03:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Did the polisher tell you what you can seal it with to keep this from happening again?
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Pkforbes87
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 03:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

he said applying wax this time before exposing the surface to anything else should prevent it. If I want to spend the $$ he suggested zoop seal. it's some sort of chemical treatment that fills the pores in the metal and is advertised to maintain the same polished finish for 2 years with just normal cleaning - no need to repolish.
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Pkforbes87
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 04:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

this stuff is really interesting!

I definitely want to use some "patination" on my next project.

This is brass! :


The idea has crossed my mind before this to use some copper trim peices on a bike and allow them to get the same surface as the statue of liberty.

Thanks Wardan for letting me know what this process is called. Do you happen to know of any websites or other resources that would show examples of various metals and processes and what type of appearances they produce?
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Friday, April 17, 2009 - 05:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Be careful with using copper on an aluminum bike!
Drive through salty water and you're making a battery!
What happens to battery plates?
That's right.
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Olbolt
Posted on Tuesday, April 21, 2009 - 09:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Not all aluminum is the same...as you have found out. Yes, in products, ~ 92 - 97% is pure Al, and the rest is composed of 'trace elements'...and this is what gives the alloy particular characteristics generally required for the forming process intended. 1) Wrought aluminum like PM wheels are formed from a sheet which has been hot & cold worked without cracking. Wrought Al takes a polish well, and keeps it. 2) Billet Al is wrought also, then machined all over..very polishable. 3) Forged Al is generally formed from a hot billet in a closed die. All the above are from Primary Al, from bauxite, & specific 'trace elements'.
Now, Aluminum is probably the most recycled metal, other than steel, and recycled Al is also called Secondary Al. 4) Virtually all high pressure Die Casting is from Secondary Al + additional trace elements including Silicon & Zinc. Automatic trans cases, valve bodies, side covers, rocker covers, intricate as-cast shapes with some machining. Production DC dies are very expensive, and so is the casting equipment, so it is used for high volume precision parts.
Here is the issue with polishing HP Die Cast parts...they can be polished, and will shine, but not as highly as wrought, and they will tarnish when exposed to air / water. I believe it is the reaction of the trace elements with air / water.
5) There is another class of casting processes involving gravity pouring into sand or iron molds. Both Primary and Secondary Al are used. This generally polishes well, but not like wrought, due to different trace elements.
The mfg. process establishes what trace elements are needed to economically convert from molten to final shape. Trace elements determine how long a polish will retain on a part.
Good Luck...If I had to maintain the polish on a part, I would look into applying Zoops. Olbolt
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