| Author | Message | ||
     Garrett2 |
who is using one and what sorts of results? this would be for a drag bike and looking to have multiple maps for different time indexes etc etc i know they are no longer sold new and thats a bummer | ||
| Buellsrule |
They're junk. Get ECM Spy and cable. You will be satisfied. BR. | ||
| Garrett2 |
why do you say 'they're junk' many many people use them on all sorts of bikes and no one ever really complains abotu them | ||
| Tom_b |
the problem with using them on a fuel injected buell is they fight with the factory ecm and frequently have to be retuned. Have had several friends have them on buells. They ALL removed them and are much happier. They work great on a lot of japanese bikes. just something with the buells. or at least the tube injected models | ||
| Beachbuell |
Power Commander is a problem waiting to happen. I couldn't tell you how many I have ripped out of HD's and Buells. Them seem to work OK with import bikes. But, they are very bad for HD/Buell ECM's and wiring systems. The PC basically tricks you ECM and piggy backs off of it. Just get the good/factory stuff. Other wise you will be buying a new ECM and more in the long run with the PC. They will toast your ECM. | ||
| Guell |
Garrett, i thought you carbed your s3 | ||
| Brettx1 |
I had one on my X1 and the head buell mechanic said to lose it, but if your dead set on having one I'll sell ya mine for 100 bucks plus shipping. | ||
| Garrett2 |
have a mikuni, was almost on the bike and then i decided to hold off the more i think about it I want to stay FI but i want more power and want to be able to tune with other modifications (shaved head, valves, etc etc etc) | ||
| Chasespeed |
Use ECM Spy... period. the software is free, you need to build a cable(there is possibly one available from Buell).... I have a PC3 on my Sporty... works great... I have a PC3 for my buell... in a box, NOT being used. It is useless on the buell. Period. That is why PC discontinued it.. Chase | ||
| Firemanjim |
They work fine --- if you remember to not try and tune in the area that the stock ecm "learns". If you do it skews entire map. We have a bunch and can tune em no problem. | ||
| Beachbuell |
Its your bike and you can do as you wish with it. I'm just telling you what I know and have seen with my own eyes. PC's screw with your ECM and will eventually fry it. I've uninstalled dozens of them. Best of luck to you. | ||
| Garrett2 |
what can ecmspy do? datalogging? multiple maps? how much can things be adjusted? | ||
| Oldog |
All table values and possibly the soft ware as well all common diagnostic functions data logging load and save tunes [ engine setings ] and best of all the price of admission is the cost of the connecting cable ~60$ or less, the software is free [ thanks to the Buellers that built it it is the shiznits! ] | ||
| Jstfrfun |
Not to step on yer toes Jim,but these guys are right. The best thing to do is a race ECM and VDSTS or ECM spy if you want to dig into the settings and change things up. The bottom line (unless you figured something out) is stay away from a PC on a Buell! | ||
| Firemanjim |
Just another urban myth like using syn oil will make your roller bearings not spin. PC's will work fine but you need to understand how the Buell FI works and the "learning" area in the fuel map.Most did not and as a result scrapped the PC cuz they could not get it to work. Course it is a function of the IMO poorly designed FI set-up on the Buells that leads to this problem. | ||
| Oldog |
I know and have seen with my own eyes. PC's screw with your ECM and will eventually fry it. Fry the ECM please expand on that? I had the PC3 and it added fuel just too much. I zeroed it out and ran it for quite a while. I could see burning out the injector outputs, or damage the TPS input or the 02 input? IF the wires were damaged. what else could it do? IIRC it stretched or shortened the injector pulses to over-ride the ECM based on a map and an auxilliary 02 sensor (heated) I am having trouble getting my head around what mode it fails in. Jim. (Message edited by oldog on August 16, 2008) | ||
| Garrett2 |
will ecm spy work with standard ecu? | ||
| Oldog |
yes In the earlier ECM's the standard and race were built from the same part set as I have it from a factory source, Al @ American Sport Bike indicated that a revised race ecm was built later when the parts were exhausted and this ECM is different as far as the pieces go. Garret check the ECM spy threads for the link to the tuning guide & software there are sellers on E-Bay for the cable assembley (Message edited by oldog on August 16, 2008) | ||
| Jstfrfun |
For his particular application, that being 1\4 mile passes at a time, the race ECM and Spy-ware would be best for it, small changes per pass and lots more direct tuneability.IMO As always, advice is worth what you pay for it. | ||
| Sloppy |
I don't think it's that Power Commander's suck, it's just that there are FAR better options: Race ECM is tough to beat if you have a "standard" race package - header, filter, etc. It's tough to get a better turn key package than this ECM. ECM Spy is not only a good ECM system but doubles as a service / diagnostic tool. | ||
| Futureengine |
So if I have ECM Spy then I can pull out my power commander (that is giving me problems) and program the stock ECM to Race ECM specs? | ||
| Oldog |
in essence yes if you have the Race ECM map for that bike. | ||
| Jstfrfun |
Jim, you may be right,however most DIY techs aren,t as savvy as you, thereby the common problems. And Dog your application just shows how tricky the PC system can be,it's just not right for the early ECM on our tubers. The race ECM I got from Al was much smaller in dimention than the stocker, and I went to it because the 2k X1 which had a PC3 on it would not run because the fueling controll side of the ECM was dead(I parted the rest of what was left of the bike out, and getting ready to build a softail mutant for shows and some short rides like Laughlin)even after the PC was disconnected the bike wouln't run with that ECM till I put the 99X1 ECM on it and it ran great...ergo,dead ECM by PC. Just my 2 cents, I wish Jim would have been available to help down here, but then he does have a life. See you next time at the American Sport Bike picnic or just lift a couple at the Firestone brewery. | ||
| Oldog |
I understand WHY you say that the PC3 killed the ECM, But could it be that the ECM was bad? and the PC had nothing to do with the failure. its difficult to prove or disprove the assertion that the PC3 killed it from MY POV the ECM uses a transistor of some discritpion to trigger the fuel injector an open circuit (mechanical problem) OR a burned out transistor ( electrical ) caused the no fuel issue The PC3 could also have had an internal failure or in the harness damaging the output of the original ECM. if the ECM and PC3 are in spec they should work to some degree, never failing the ECM outputs. I agree that once the mixture gets skewed the bike runs like crap! I loaded a dyno jet map and ran with it my guess is that the ECM did as FMJ outlined and attempted to correct and the mixture went way rich, so I zeroed out the fuel table I rode it for a while and decided to live with it for a while till I got the race ecm. IF ECM spy were not available and I were going to major hot rod that motor then I would consider it. Thats why chase has it now, in that he has ECM spy well now the PC3 its just a paper weight. its more academic than any thing else with ecm spy there is no need for a PC of any flavor and like in my profession the more pieces in the system the more things that can break. thanks for the comments, interesting discussion. | ||
| Ttlord |
garret i have a pc you can buy 75$ | ||
| Chasespeed |
Thats why chase has it now, in that he has ECM spy well now the PC3 its just a paper weight. Yep. Soldered all the wires back up... and it sits in a box currently. Chase | ||
| Jstfrfun |
Thats my take on it,It's less likely to screw it up for the DIY guy to laptop and race ECM for the application of dragstrip passes or fine tuning on the dyno. If you can get it right and avoid the bugs built in it may work for some, in your case I'm glad you got it knocked...ride. BTW I like your collection and your girl model, nice set! | ||
| Buellsrule |
Last time I checked PC doesn't make a model for any FI Buell anymore. Wonder why? Exercise common sense. I say they are still junk. Next. | ||
| Xodot |
So if I have ECM Spy then I can pull out my power commander (that is giving me problems) and program the stock ECM to Race ECM specs? Future Engine : If you want the fuel maps from a race ECM, PM me and I'll sent them to you in a Word document. It is then a matter of checking and adjusting each one of the 128 cells to make your fuel maps the same. I just did this yesterday and it took me about an hour - but I started with a stock ECM and came away with a race ECM and a very different Buell than what I started with. I am kinda hooked now and intend to continue to change and experiment with the fuel maps just for fun  It's an easy way to tune. |
