| Author | Message | ||
     Hugie03flhr |
I ordered the gear from AmericanSB & I received an Email stating, I must take the rear rocker box off to release the pressure on the rear cam lobe (Can't you just rotate the engine to TDC after the lifter bleeds down) and if I need gaskets they have them. When I did a search I did not see anything about pulling rocker boxes or side covers. I read 4 bolts drop the pump. SOOO WHICH IS TRUE??? | ||
| Chasespeed |
are you changing the gear on the oil pump? Or the drive gear? I have removed the oil pump several times without pulling the side cover.. though, with the oil lines on, it can be a pain. I recommend checking the condition of your oil lines, and replacing if needed. BUT, if you are doing the gear inside the cam box.. then yes, you need to put the front cyl on TDC, pop the rear rocker box, remove the header... and CAREFULLY remove the cam cover. You want NO, or as little tension as possible, on those cams when you pull that cover... Chase | ||
| Hugie03flhr |
The Oil Pump Gear CHASE. Thats the gear that is recommended to be changed RIGHT??? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
To replace the gear you have to take off the exhaust, timing cover, the rear rocker box (I took off both so I could polish them while I was in this deep)and the gear case cover. If the gear case cover has never been off then you NEED to replace the paper gasket with the new coated metal style (I would recommend new rocker gaskets and exhaust gaskets as well). You also need a locking tool from American Sport Bike so that you can remove and retorque on assembly the pinion gear. Everything was under $200. Not cheap but you don't want that to fail and you don't want to do it twice. It is not difficult but it is time consuming. I replace mine because I was in there anyway because it was leaking. Sounds like you need a service manual too. | ||
| Hugie03flhr |
Scott, I have a service manual and it doesn't sat anything about locking tools and pulling the cam case cover. I"M CONFUSED??? CHASE said, THE PUMP COMES OUT W/OUT PULLING THE CASE AND YOU SAY IT DOESN'T! I looked in the manual and I don't see anything on the cam, side cover or case that would stop that pump from sliding out and in like a chevy V8 distributor. AM I WRONG? | ||
| Ratbuell |
The bronze drive gear does not mount on the pump, it mounts on the flywheel snout. To get to the flywheel snout, you have to unload the cams (rockerboxes off), remove the cam cover, remove the flywheel locknut (can be done without the locking tool by putting it in gear and using a 2x4 through the rear wheel, bracing against the swingarm to "lock" it), removing the #2 cam and removing the oil pump drive gear. Again. Did you get the oil pump DRIVE gear (the bronze updated one), or did you get a new oil pump GEAR? GEAR = drop pump, install. DRIVE gear = remove cams, etc. | ||
| Aaomy |
the gear you want to replace isnt on the pump. it is in the cam case, and drives the one on the pump.,, hope this helps | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Sorry William, the pump comes out without the gear. You can replace the gear without dropping the pump, but not without doing all described above. You may get the nut off with an impact, but you won't be able to torque it anyway so you need this tool. http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/16082.html By the way, mine was showing the beginning signs of wear, so it is worth doing, doing right, and having the peace of mind that comes with that. | ||
| Sportyeric |
The gear that is on the oil pump (which comes along when you remove the pump) is not the problematic one. That problem gear is the one that operates on that oilpump gear. And to get that drive gear out, you must remove the cam cover. Some people have removed the cam cover without taking off the rocker boxes (both). But since the cover supports one side of the cams, it is not recommended as there is a large levered load put on the inner cam bushings by doing so. To undo the nut holding it on, you would have to stop the engine from turning. I would think that that could be done by putting it in gear and using the rear brake but I haven't any experience on that end of things. | ||
| Sportyeric |
Fast guys around here this morning. | ||
| Akbuell |
You do not need to pull the cam case cover to remove the oil pump. That being said.... If the gear you are replacing is the oil pump drive gear (item 12 on Fig3-62, page 3-42 in my X-1 service manual) with the new, heavy duty drive gear (p/n 26391-06, replaces 26318-88A, drive gear, oil pump, again my X-1 manual) which is on the crankshaft, then Yes, you remove the cam cover. Which means taking off the rocker box, to relieve pressure on the cams. And the locking tool is worth its weight in gold when it comes to torquing the pinion nut back on, not to mention getting it off. Not a difficult job, but it does take a while. Easy, w/the manual to refer to. I managed to cram the 5ish hour job into about 3 mos (LOL), but hey, it was winter! | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I would always recommend calling Al to place an order when you are doing a job for the 1st time. He will make sure you get everything you should and will also give advice for getting the job done right. | ||
| Sportyeric |
Ooops. Back rocker only because at TDC on the front, there is only lifter pressure but the rear will not be at TDC and so will have valve spring pressure. Its taking me four years but I'm doing some other stuff while I'm in there. | ||
| Reepicheep |
You can *inspect* that gear with 4 bolts... but if you want to replace it, then at least one rocker box should come off. I pulled both, as Al had not enlightened me on the trick to safely remove just one yet. I got the rest done with no special tools or heroic effort. | ||
| Hugie03flhr |
Amer.part#17118 I ordered. I'm pretty sure it is the (oil pump shaft) bronze gear. (upgrade that everyone advertises to take care of the gear being wiped out) All the pictures I have seen are the pump gear NOT the drive gear coming off the cam. Is their something I'm missing here? Did I order the right gear? THANKS FOR THE INPUT GUYS!!! | ||
| Ratbuell |
17118 on American Sport Bike is the oil pump gasket. The bronze drive gear is 17126, and you have to remove the cam cover and all the other stuff to get to it. You'll have to trust me. I've done it. This (17126) IS "the gear everyone replaces", not the gear on the pump. As far as I can tell, the gear that is actually ON the pump, is pressed onto the pump and is not servicable. http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/17126.html (Message edited by ratbuell on April 23, 2008) | ||
| Werewulf |
picture here.. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/350434.html?1208741146 | ||
| Hugie03flhr |
Thanks Ratbuell & werewulf for the pics. I misunderstood which gear needed to be replaced. I GOT IT NOW  I will pick up cam cover & rocker gaskets. I have two questions, is the bronze gear pressed on or is it splined? 2) Should I use HD gaskets or is their an aftermarket gasket company I should use? THANKS EVERYONE FOR GETTING THIS THOUGH MY THICK HEAD! | ||
| Buellistic |
"i" will be changing my OEM Oil Pump Drive Gear PN 26318-88A to XB UP-DATE Gear PN 26391-06 this weekend ... My engine now has 103,184.5 miles as of the last ride ... Checked the Oil Pump Drive Gear at 60K miles and it looked like brand new ... Very interested to see what it looks like now ??? Know you BUELLers will want PICTURES of it and "i" will try to provide them !!! | ||
| Ratbuell |
The gear is keyed to the flywheel. Usually you have to pry it off, but putting it on is as simple as a long socket to get it most of the way seated, and torquing (USE LOCTITE) the main nut on top of it. The manual is pretty straightforward on it  | ||
| Reepicheep |
Factory gaskets are now pretty good. They sucked in the tuber days, but they have since been fixed (metal rocker box gaskets, metal primary gaskets, etc). So now factory gaskets are a good bet. You may need the oil pump gasket as well, unless you try and reuse it (which you probably could if its one of those silicone coated rubber ones). It is not pinned on, I believe you remove a nut, remove the gear that drives the cams, and it slips off. It's keyed on the shaft, I don't know if it is a problem to re-use the key. I would think it would be fine. The cams are all marked with timing marks and position indicators. So if you have to pull them its not a big deal to get them back (at least if you have both rocker boxes off). If you use Al's trick of just putting the crank in the position that unloads the front rocker box and then just remove the rear rocker box, I don't know if the crank is in the right position to line up the timing marks. Anyway, it should just slip on and it is keyed.. just don't loose that little key. | ||
| Naustin |
Buellistic: I'll be very interseted to see those pics! Just the fact that your gear made it all the way though 100K miles makes me feel better. | ||
| Werewulf |
103k miles thats quite an endorsement for the motor... | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
You may need the oil pump gasket as well you do not need to remove the oil pulp to change the drive gear. | ||
| Chasespeed |
I am still on the original drive gear, between 55-60K.. .looks fine. I was thinking about doing it when I did the cam cover gaskets...but, still looked good... I will check the gear periodically... Chase | ||
| Reepicheep |
Some bikes eat them, some don't. Good point about the oil pump and gasket... I pull mine to inspect the gear, so it's already off at the point I need to decide to go in there. | ||
| Sloppy |
I'd recommend to NOT replace unless you ABSOLUTELY need to. Good idea to purchase in case you do need to do it. Otherwise just check at every oil change if you're worried about it. Then you can build confidence once you see your rate of wear. Search Knowledge Vault -- there are many excellent write ups of the procedure. | ||
| Buellistic |
What "i" recommend is a RETURN LINE OIL FILTER !!! Have a tool to cut them open which "i" do after each oil change ... Recommend replacing the OEM -88A(replace with a -06) no mather what the mileage is on your "TUBE FRAME" ... As in all IDIOT Lamp/Lite applications, when the GLOW STARTS the "OIL PRESSURE" is way below "SAFE" !!! My "PROOF in the PUDDING" is "i" have a 103,184.5 miles on the 1997 S3T as of the last ride ... | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I'd recommend to NOT replace unless you ABSOLUTELY need to. So let me understand - you have the engine apart and you have the part in hand, but you are not going to put it in unless it needs it? Then since you haven't replaced it you need to continue checking it? Your logic escapes me..... | ||
| Hugie03flhr |
I would think, if the gear starts wearing it will wipe out fairly quick. Similar to a flat tappet cam wiping out. |
