| Author | Message | ||
     Smokinjryan |
I ordered the front Isolator and bolt kit from Al. What I would like to know is do I have to replace the bolts to the motor mount itself or can i just leave them and just replace the bolt and nut to the isolator itself?? Also what are the torque secs on these bolts? Thanks | ||
| Whodom |
John, I think you'll be OK reusing the two small bolts. All they do is keep the isolator aligned with the hole in the frame. If both of them somehow failed the isolator wouldn't go anywhere; it sits on top of a mounting plate welded to the frame. The bolts just hold it in position. I don't have the torque spec handy, but I'll say this: if you can figure out how to get a torque wrench on them without removing the engine and/or front mount you're a smarter man than me. I gave mine a good calibrated wrencher's hand torquing. | ||
| Djkaplan |
Yeah... kinda pay attention to how much it took to loosen, and work your way backwards. That's the only thing I could figure out. | ||
| Mbsween |
John, Just did the same procedure on a 2001 X1, reused the bolts, Its about an easy procedure. I put a touch of anti seize on the bolts upon reuse. I was able to torque one side via a crows foot. The other side was a gear wrench ratchet and the old torque "arm" Working fine for 2600 miles and lots of wheelies | ||
| Littlebuggles |
It is recommended to replace the bolts passing through the motor mount to the engine. Seems like a high number torque, 85-110 ft lbs maybe, I replaced mine last September. I'll check it for you in the morning and post before I go to bed. I agree with the others on the isolator hardware to the frame and can also get that spec. Crows foot on the right side IIRC. -Bug | ||
| Smokinjryan |
littlebuggles, So does anyone know why it would be recommended to replace the bolts into the head via motor mount? Should I do this...I was thinking I shouldnt mess with them what's the consensus? The side bolts I will reuse and just tighten it to my best. Main isolator bolt is I think also torqued to 110 ft lbs??? Also if I must replace the motor mount bolts those are also 110 ft lbs??? any feedback would be great thanks guys for the help! (Message edited by smokinjryan on June 23, 2006) | ||
| Littlebuggles |
If you can just remove the iso bolt and leave the two going into the engine alone you won't need to replace them. I don't think you have to pull the mount from the engine to replace the iso unless there are clearance issues. I had done my new rocker covers and put in a new motor mount when I did the job so details blurred a bit. I get off work 0600 so I can check the manual when I get home 0615ish and let you know then. If it looks complicated I can scan the pages for you and shoot you an email but it's pretty basic. Have you removed the old iso yet? -Bug | ||
| Djkaplan |
The service manual says the mount shouldn't be removed and doesn't give torque specs. I'm not sure the bolts were ever the problem in the front mount failures, but checking the torque on them certainly wouldn't hurt. I replaced the one on my Cyclone and got the torque spec from Al at American Sport Bike. I wrote it down in the manual but I'll be darned if I can remember it... give Al a call and he'll give you a great dissertation on what may (or may not) be causing mount failures. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Section 3 (Engine) pg. 3-4 lists torque specs for Isolator Bolt, Front as 100-110 ft-lbs. Front Isolator to Cylinder head bolt 73-78 ft-lbs, loctite 262 (Red). The stock motor mount is labeled "DO NOT REMOVE". I have not found that statement regarding the mount in the manual yet. Also still looking for the torque value on the little side bolts for the front engine iso. -Mike | ||
| Bomber |
no need to distrub the mount-to-head bolts to replace the ISOs -- me, I wouldn't even check their torque if they weren't loose (YMMV, of course) -- sleeping dogs, and all the mount-to-head failures have been discussed and analysed from hear to there, with, I believe, no definative answers as to their causes -- touchin them is part of my pre-flight, but that's all i've ever done to em | ||
| Djkaplan |
"I wouldn't even check their torque if they weren't loose" How are you going confirm if they're loose without checking the torque? If it's to the point they're loose to the touch, it's probably too late. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
The same torque value table as above shows "Isolator bolts, side" as 100-110 ft-lbs, also ref'd loctite red. Initially I thought this was for the rear iso's but then I found on pg. 2-4 (Section 2, Chassis) the spec for "Swingarm isolator bolts" is listed as 100-110 ft-lbs, and ref to loctite 271 (also red). So that would indicate the little side bolts also get the 100-110 number as the hardware that passes through both the rear and front iso's. Hope this has helped clarify. post script: when I did the front iso I just used a bottle jack to support the front of the engine, it fit nicely between the shock and exhaust. Having my tank off gave me a bit more room to work but is probably not required to do the job, you could prob unhook the tank from the frame and turn it around to rest on the seat without unhooking the fuel lines... | ||
| Littlebuggles |
I like to check vital torqued hardware bits for "snugness" using an appropriately sized wrench periodically but figure if I used loctite using a torque wrench is gonna be a waste of time, and as Bomber said, might wake up that sleeping dog... -Bug | ||
| Bomber |
deej -- you're clearly correct -- what I did was put a teeny spot of enamel paint on the edge of the bolt/mount interface -- if the bolt walks out, even fractionally, there's a clear visual indicator of said walking . . . | ||
| Djkaplan |
Maybe... but I'm wondering how much clamping force the fasteners loose to stretch after a few years of heat-cycling and vibration. The stock front mount is a pourous casting that probably gets squashed into inelastic deflection easier than forged billet, too. All this could happen and the bolt head would stay in the same location. Of couse, there is a slight chance that none of this could be correct. (I've never found one of the bolts losing torque, btw, but I never checked them until I installed the new mount last year.) | ||
| Bomber |
deej -- again, your metaluric knowledge is very likely right -- we all decide, consciously or unconsciously, what to spend our worry budget on -- this budget allotment alters over time, and with new data, certainly you could very likely be right, and I could suffer a catastrophic failure this afternoon at the end of the driveway ;-} | ||
| Djkaplan |
Everything I know about metallurgy could fit on the head of a pin and my worry budget has been in deficit since the "Duck and Cover" days. | ||
| Bomber |
ROFLMAO, Deej -- I'm tryin to NOT worry, and to be happy! | ||
| Road_thing |
 What, me worry? | ||
| Smokinjryan |
ok cool I got all the info I need to tackle this! Thanks I am just waiting on parts now. I will let you know how it all turned out thanks. | ||
| Bomber |
Ryan -- I sorta forgot you started this thread lookin for assistance -- thanks for the hint to cease and desist ;-} | ||
| Smokinjryan |
ok I got the job done with some help everything went smooth! I used a lift to hang the bike from some straps and used the jack underneath the shock mount worked like a charm! Thanks for everyone who helped answer my ???? Thanks! | ||
| Xldevil |
The service manual says the mount shouldn't be removed and doesn't give torque specs False! Referring to page 3-21 of my OFM 2001 M2: If front isolator mount was removed,install as follows. a. Clean residual LOCTITE from threads in engine with a suitable nonflammable solvent and dry with compressed air. b. Apply LOCTITE THREADLOCKER 271 (red) to threads of new front isolator mount bolts. c. Apply a thin film of clean HD 20W50 engine oil to both sides of new thick washers and to bottom of bolt heads.Exercise caution to avoid mixing oil ton washers with LOCTITE on bolts. d. Position front isolator mount and secure with two new front bolts with new thick washers. Tighten bolts to 60 ft-lbs (81 Nm) initially and then loosen each bolt one full turn.Tighten bolts again to 60 ft-lbs(61 Nm). Ralph (Message edited by xldevil on July 01, 2006) | ||
| Djkaplan |
I finally got a chance to check my 1999-2000 M2 service manual, and I was indeed wrong about the torque specs not being stated. I stand corrected and humbled. | ||
| Kc_zombie |
This site is simply the best. Saved my ass once again, it's very easy to misinterpret the front isolator torque values. It's great to be able to search and refer back to a conversation which took place 13 years ago! There's no place like home... Awesomeness! |
