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Crusty
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 04:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)



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Tootal
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 09:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

On the radio news this morning they had interviewed a Japanese woman who was 10 years old when the bomb hit. She survived and was talking about how this should have never happened. I'm sorry she had to go through that, losing her parents at that age must have been horrible. However, she didn't mention all the people that lost their lives at Pearl Harbor. How many parents were killed during this sneak attack? Japan got what they deserved and we should never apologize for it. One of my old bosses was a "Frogman" before there were Navy Seals. He was in training for the invasion of Japan. He loved that bomb, it saved a lot of lives!
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Hughlysses
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 09:48 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Iíve also read that not only many more Americans would have died if weíd have had to invade Japan using conventional weapons, but more Japanese would have died too.
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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 09:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

My Uncle Rusty was a Seabee waiting to Invade Japan when the Emperor surrendered after Nagasaki.

The Generals tried to kidnap him to prevent the shame and keep the war going. The Emperor, I mean. It was a Japanese submarine that torpedoed my Uncle's ship and killed all but about a hundred on board.

Rusty was thankful for Hiroshima too.

If the Invasion of the Main Islands had taken place, casualties would have been in the millions, mostly Japanese peasants, and the Occupation would not have dragged Japan into a Democratic Modern society, in an enlightened way we seem to have forgotten.

Instead Japanese would indeed have become a language spoken only in Hell. https://en.m.wikiquote.org/wiki/William_Frederick_ Halsey,_Jr.
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 10:07 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

When you read the history of the Manhattan Project, it is truly amazing what was accomplished, and how quickly it was done.

As ghastly as the aftermath was, the Japanese military of that time is guilty of horrific war crimes in china and various places.

The bombing was justified.

BTW the B-29 "Bocks car" is on display at the USAF museum in Dayton Oh. Well worth an after noon if you are in the area, and they have a scale mock up of both bombs and some photos of the aftermath
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Tpehak
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 10:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

August 6, 2020

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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 10:33 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

All of WW2 qualifies as incredible tragedy.

It's a miracle that Nagasaki was the last city atom bombed.

You have to remember the history, lots of history, to prevent the next city from burning. Not just that Hiroshima was bombed, also the years of greed, conquest, and slaughter leading up to the end of WW2 AND the fact that August 1945 was just a punctuation of the now over a century long war, ongoing, between Leftism/National Socialism/Communism and Western Civilization.
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 10:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It's a miracle that Nagasaki was the last city atom bombed.

After Nagasaki several things happened.

We were running short of materials for more bombs. ( the earliest weapons were hand built by the scientists and engineers who developed the tech )

President Truman got more involved with the program and learned more about the effects of the weapon. ( at the time most of the after effects were unknown or poorly understood )

They were waiting on the Japanese response to the bombings.

Please Note:
The citizens of Nagasaki were warned well ahead of time, leaflets warning of total destruction of the city, and urging the populace to surrender.

also unlike Hiroshima, the bomb was about 5 miles off target, and was much less effective.

The target cities were chosen from a list of "un bombed" cities. President Truman had insisted that the targets be military & production centers.

Nagasaki was a ship building and steel production center.
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Tootal
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 10:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

This is from the Illinois State Rifle Assn.

ISRA Thursday Bulletin - August 6, 2020




Executive Directors Message
Richard Pearson

On August 6, 1945, the United States dropped the first of two atomic nomads on Japan. The first was on Hiroshima and the second was August 9 on Nagasaki. Japan surrendered the next day. Being the eternal history fanatic, I watched a special on those two events a few nights ago. It followed the same pattern of a couple of others in previous years. There was a Japanese woman talking about how terrible it was. Since there were no American soldiers who talked about how terrible the Japanese were, I will.

My father was a WWII veteran who fought the Japanese in the South Pacific. Growing up, he never talked to me about his experiences. All I knew was that he had nightmares nearly every night about fighting Japanese soldiers hand to hand. As a child digging around in mom and dadís closet one day, I found two Purple Hearts. In the last six months of my fatherís life, he talked about some of his experiences. One of those was a recovery mission to find American pilots that had been shot down by the Japanese but had parachuted out of their planes and had been captured. They found them alright, in a cave, beheaded, and their bodies mutilated. That was one of the experiences he dreamed about. While in New Guinea, American troops would find some of the natives that the Japanese would just torture and kill for fun. While there are more stories, you get the idea.

My first understanding of how ruthless the Japanese were came in my first year in college. I went to Eastern Illinois University my first year. I took a class in Far Eastern geography with Dr. Ying Ching Chang, who better right? I got more than I bargained for. Dr. Chang grew up in China and fought the Japanese in China in WWII. He was a college student in Nanking (now known as Nanjing) in 1937 during the Rape of Nanking by the Japanese. He saw and he lived it. He helped save the Chinese Library in Nanking by loading the entire library on barges and floating it down the Yangtze River. The Japanese wanted to destroy everything Chinese. The Japanese killed, raped and mutilated somewhere between 220,000 and 300,000 people in one of the greatest war crimes in history.

Dropping the atomic bomb saved both American and Japanese lives. I get tired of hearing about civilian casualties. In total war, there are no civilians. Although it is not something we like to think about, it is a fact.
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Ourdee
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I will celebrate again in another 3 days.
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Ratbuell
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Agreed.

It's called the "deterrent effect" - if the leaders think the consequences will be too much, they back off. If the leaders don't think the consequences will be too much, sometimes the citizens need to remind them, and encourage them to back off. Yes, there were huge losses those two days...but compared to the potential loss of life, as well as the horror of dragging out the conflict for...how long? THAT would exact an even larger human toll than just outright death - the extended suffering is unthinkable. It was the right decision, at the right time.

I'll resist the urge to compare to today's world, I know all of our minds are sharp enough to make the connections to the concept of "deterrent effect".

My father as well, had nightmares about his time in Korea (four campaigns). Never talked about his service, despite having a young son who thought it was TOO COOL to have a dad who had served in the US Navy. Towards the end, he did start to discuss a bit. I have the utmost respect for him, and those who serve. I now have dad's "fruit salad" everyday ribbons, dress cover, and retired military ID on display in my living room, and mom has his burial flag with his dress insignia and ribbons, dress white gloves, and active duty ID in a display at home in Florida.
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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0820/hanson080620 .php3
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Dropping the atomic bomb saved both American and Japanese lives. I get tired of hearing about civilian casualties. In total war, there are no civilians. Although it is not something we like to think about, it is a fact.

When this subject comes up with the "poor survivors" the firebombing of Tokyo is never mentioned. Thousands of tonnes of incendiary bombs were dropped on areas of Tokyo with huge areas reduced to rubble, and significant casualties.

By that time the Japanese ability to wage war was greatly diminished ( to the point they could not defend the home island from air attacks ) and yet they chose to continue to fight.

They brought it on them selves.
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Truman was at Potsdam when the first weapon was tested. He told the sailors on the Indianapolis ( the ship he was on returning home ) after the first use of the weapon.

Many of the sailors were said to have tears in their eyes in realization that they would survive the war.

I was fortunate My father was in the Navy in WW2, and was a navigator on a PBY Catalina flying boat ( SAR & Recon ) Near Pearl Harbor. And was spared many of the horrors of the pacific.

Our WW2 vets of all theaters endured some of the most horrific events in human history.

I am going to try and make sure that my grand child understands this.
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 11:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Lite reading on the subject

Bill Oriley's The day the world went nuclear.
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Ourdee
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 04:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I often ask, will 300 years arrive with people so ignorant that they think there was a peaceful solution to a society hell bent on destroying another for an emperor? Will rape become acceptable? Will people no longer think for themselves? Will it only take a hundred years?, Maybe 25?, Or 6 months?
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Ratbuell
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 05:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

...depends how long it takes the Muslims to take over. They already condone rape...and they certainly hate the rest of us...
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Tpehak
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 05:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

We need to start peaceful protests against nuclear weapon brutality as soon as possible.
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Crusty
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 05:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

We need President Trump to say that Atomic Bombs are bad, and then the liberals will fall all over themselves saying we should use them!
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Ourdee
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 05:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I was taught to love the bomb and hate peace protesters.
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Oldog
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 05:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The fertilizer blast looked to be close on a kiloton.

The news reports say that a ship load of ammonium nitrate was off loaded from a Russian ship.
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Tpehak
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 06:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It was off loaded many many years ago and they did nothing with it.
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Uncle
Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2020 - 09:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Some of the worst human experiments of the war were committed by the Japanese Unit 731.
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Ducbsa
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 05:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Another good article:

https://thefederalist.com/2020/08/06/75-years-late r-its-clear-truman-was-right-to-drop-the-atomic-bo mb/?fbclid=IwAR33ZV9Zd-iJOA3x5jYvXnwcoRPiZTNAGrvQg Hta4GKXNHBB-TPZ38E5vt0
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Blake
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 07:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Jim (Oldog):

Wasn't the Indianapolis the ship that delivered the first bomb to the airbase at Tinian? Then as it was returning to base was sunk by a Japanese sub, the crew largely surviving the sinking, about 1/4, roughly 300, going down with the ship, then as they endured days in the ocean awaiting rescue, around 600 more were lost to sharks, just 316 survived. Recall the famous scene from Jaws where "Quint" tells the tale.

(Message edited by Blake on August 07, 2020)
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Blake
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 07:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMl1NbR0h_A

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Ourdee
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 08:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yes it was.
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Blake
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 11:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

So not the ship Truman was on returning from Potsdam then?
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Ourdee
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 11:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Truman traveled on the USS Augusta.
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Ourdee
Posted on Friday, August 07, 2020 - 11:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)



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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, August 08, 2020 - 11:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2qnge8e588

Brief history of the Indianapolis.
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