| Author | Message | ||
     Rick_a |
Come on now, anyone who's taken a fairing off a sport bike knows that it takes a lot more than just taking stuff off to make it look naked and not dissected. That's a lot of wiring, components, and plumbing to hide, and a lot of small pieces of body work to integrate. I'm not a fan of most naked bikes of today as far as styling. The best looks are timeless. The futuristic, faceted, stealth bike look is not for me. | ||
| Trojan |
It really is impossible for you to say anything good about EBR; right Matt? I'd say good things if I liked it, or do you want me to just spew out meaningless compliments that are untrue? I am just a bit underwhelmed by a bike that has been teased to us for over a year that's all. It lacks imagination in styling (as do a lot of modern bikes) compared to some that are available in my view. Compared to the KTM Superduke, New Ducati Monster, MV Brutale and even the Kawasaki Z1000 it looks very dated, but then the BMW S1000R looks extremely similar, is dated stylistically too yet sells well). I'm sure they can sell every one they can make, but I wouldn't be rushing to buy one at the price it will be over here. I'm a huge fan of the 'old' Buell ethos I'm afraid (which pretty much died with the release of the 1125), and which incorporated everything I wanted in a bike including a relatively agricultural, simple air cooled engine that I could work on combined with good handling. I haven't seen anything from the 'new' EBR that would make me choose one over any other sportsbike manufacturer yet. I'm sure Erik could sell many many 'revived' Xb models at reasonable prices but has decided to go down the sportsbike route....Good luck to him, but it is just not for me. | ||
| Court |
___________ % of time spent on Compared to the KTM Superduke, New Ducati Monster, MV Brutale and even the Kawasaki Z1000 forums. ____________% of time spent on EBR, that are "just not for you" forums. Help me understand. | ||
| Trojan |
____________% of time spent on EBR, that are "just not for you" forums. This isn't an 'EBR' forum, it is a Buell forum, which is something entirely different (in every sense). I love the air cooled Buells, have owned 7 of them and built a succesful business catering for their aftermarket needs. I have no particular want for a complicated 180bhp+ liquid cooled sports bike of any brand thanks (with or without a fairing), although I am though still allowed to voice an opinion on a forum surely? As for the other brands. I don't spend time on their forums as I am not a KTM/BMW/Ducati enthusiast (although I do look at other forums/sites for general bike stuff). I wouldn't buy any of them to be honest because none offer what I want in a bike, I was just comparing styling (or lack of) between bikes. Or is that banned too now in EBR world? Is it now a case of the Emperors new clothes? Only oohs and aahsand happy clapping allowed? | ||
| Court |
That helps. I, like you, have no interest in 180hp bikes and have also spent years in the business. In addition, you are right . . .this is a Buell, as opposed to an EBR, forum and I expect . . .you'll soon be seeing more divergence in terms of owners groups, events and so forth. I owned a KTM, BMW and Yamaha until a couple years ago and spent (other than to search for technical info from time to time) no time on their forums. Just no soul. Your Emperor's clothes comment is the type of cynical comment that's robbed you of your credibility. Watch this again . . . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14CbyKe-eNA I feel bad for the folks at EBR . . . even the video of the intro yesterday shows they, at the moment, have a tiger by the tail. But there's a lot of talent their and a lot of focus . . . . I love the movies where you think the jets going down with the President and the hero grabs the controls and saves it. I'll be eager to watch EBR sales, and race performance, over the next couple years. Carry on . . . I'm off to ride. | ||
| Reindog |
Trojan, I agree with you about 180HP bikes but sometimes it is better to be silent. | ||
| Malott442 |
My two favorite naked bike front ends were the xb9/12s and the speed triple (1997-2010). My main concern is the ergonomics. I always loved how comfortable the xb and 1125 series was. Is the x series going to follow suit? (Message edited by malott442 on June 12, 2014) | ||
| Skntpig |
There's always a few of same type of person on any car forum I've visited. Some folks must like the attention received by continuing to spout negativity at a place where enthusiasts have disscussions. It seems like they would eventually fall off but they rarely do. I like the products from Trojan but I don't understand all the negative effort. Doesn't make good business sense to me but what do I know. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
"Trojan, I agree with you about 180HP bikes but sometimes it is better to be silent." why? I like it ok, but not super thrilled on it. My biggest gripe about the 1125CR was that it was just a 1125R with different nose on it (yes, I know there were other small differences, but from appearances I mean). This is the same thing. Its a RX without side fairings, essentially. I agree with Trojan, it took them this long to take some parts off? Look forward to seeing the price and seeing how having two models that are essentially the same will affect the price points on both. Also interested in seeing if the scoop would work on a ZTL2 easily | ||
| Hughlysses |
I agree with Trojan, it took them this long to take some parts off? I'd guess it took them this long mainly to get their production line (and their suppliers) working well enough to support 2 different models. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Perspective might play a big part in this as well. Myself, and many others (perhaps Court), have seen the ugly underbelly of large corporations. The power these institutions can bring to bear is necessary (I think) for solving large scale problems economically. That same leverage, however, lets politics, ego, and individual self interest do normal stupid things but amplifies them to the tune of adding 6 zeros to the mistake. We have sat in meetings where we see the right thing to do, but we know we can't do it, first because of the power amassed by people who don't see it, and secondly because we know that if we did start it, people would likely derail that also and make it even more of a disaster that the bad idea being proposed. So you go down a safe but stupid road of mediocrity and group consensus and count on the scalability of a large enterprise to make it work anyway. We look at a little company of really smart and aggressive people like EBR, recently escaped from the borg ship and half drunk on freedom and possibility, and giving everything and then some to make this work. We are, like Court said, rooting for Mr. Smith gone to Washington. And not in a shallow "Go Seahawks" type way... more in a way of "this is the kind of thing that gives us hope for the future" kind of way. In that context, when I see something like the plucky but struggling WSBK effort, or the odd kind of "why not?" new bike rollout yesterday, I can recognize the lack of "polish and planning" that went into it. But it doesn't bother me in the least, as I recognize so much of that polish and planning as corporate navel gazing to satisfy the expectations of the status quo, and ultimately a waste of time. Instead of 9 months of product planning meetings with marketing, a PMI certified project manager, two auditors, $300,000 in smoke machines, and lots of liquor for journalists, and a ridiculous looking staged show, I just picture 5 people in a conference room getting together because the RX is already on the assembly line and they never got around to announce it. 30 minutes later, they decided they better throw a production bike into the back of the truck and find a place to invite some journalists to show up at and let them see it. Oh, and make it pretty close to Wisconsin, because we have had "John" the truck driver on the road a lot lately and his daughters birthday party is this weekend, so it would be nice if he could get back home by then. Forget the smoke machine, let the bike speak for itself, it will be in journalists hands and demo trucks soon enough anyway. I get the perception of the lack of polish, but to me, it just makes me smile. (Message edited by reepicheep on June 12, 2014) | ||
| Sifo |
I'm both awestruck and unimpressed with EBR at the moment. They have accomplished incredible things with a very small company. They have struck incredibly close to what Ducati has been able to achieve as their state of the art superbike. The problem is, incredibly close can also be seen as a little bit short. IMO that's where they hit in many ways. That's still OK with me though, I have no designs on ever being able to ride a superbike anywhere near it's abilities. What I am interested in is a good street bike, that has touring capabilities, at least for a single person. I can make a lot of bikes work for that as long as I'm reasonably comfortable for hours at a time. I have little need for 180 HP. They have done an amazing job at delivering a performance engine that also give great economy though. They claim better MPG than most bikes at half their displacement! That's incredible! To have to pay in the $20K neighborhood kills all though of the money I'm saving on gas though. Will the AX have a saddle that is good for all day riding? Should a sport/touring/adventure type bike even have a race bred engine? The reality is, there's a nice selection of bikes available for a lot less cash, that can fill the bill of a mere mortal rider. Right now EBR is not targeting my needs. I do recognize that they can only do so much, and they have done incredible things in a short time. The reality though, is they have put themselves into a boutique market place. I wish Erik the best with that. I really do. I can't however pretend that any of this translates into what I want in a bike though. To be honest, if it did fit my needs, I would likely go with a Ducati at this point. YMMV. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
I feel bad for the folks at EBR . . . even the video of the intro yesterday shows they, at the moment, have a tiger by the tail. But there's a lot of talent their and a lot of focus . . . . I love the movies where you think the jets going down with the President and the hero grabs the controls and saves it. I'll be eager to watch EBR sales, and race performance, over the next couple years. Carry on . . . I'm off to ride. You know Court, when you put it like this no one would feel comfortable offering criticism. Even when it's deserved (necessary)! Rocket in England | ||
| Court |
Just went for a lovely ride . . . . . and thought to myself . . . . What would Motus do? They had a bit of a head start on EBR . . . I think I'll wander down the Motus dealer and check on a demo ride. | ||
| Reepicheep |
And at twice the prices of the 1190RX, I'm sure the Motus is twice the bike. Given recent Motus WSBK podium finish, you will somehow magically be compelled to buy one Court. Or maybe you will be compelled to buy one because they didn't even try WSBK racing because they knew they couldn't win, so that irresistibly compels you to buy one. I'm not sure which, I get confused sometimes. Meanwhile, though I had no real desire for an RX test ride, that SX looks like a heck of a lot of fun to try out. I'm still waiting for the AX, and still won't be able to afford it when it does come out, but I do want to try the SX. Maybe the owner of the local shop will be in, if I show up when Mr. Pegram isn't off chasing his "racing hobby"... | ||
| Sifo |
Here's where I'm at. The Triumph Speed Triple is IMO an incredible bike. Stupid amounts of power on hand, I like the styling, and I'm very comfortable on it. Local dealer is selling them for $12,799. Is the new SX going to be competitive with that? Based on the price of the RX I have my doubts. Does the RX bring anything to the table beyond the Speed? Realistically, for me at least, very little. Of course it probably more fair to compare the Speed Triple R at $14,699. $15K is going to be a psychological barrier for a lot of buyers. Can EBR deliver the SX below $15K? I guess we will find out fairly soon. Anyone know yet? | ||
| Court |
>>>Anyone know yet? There have been . . . I suspect . . conversations that sounded very much like your soliloquy. The good news . . . for folks like you and I . . . is that The EBR joins some REALLY good bikes. If you buy that Triumph, you'll never be sorry . . . it's a hell of a bike and I'm thrilled to see an Eld on board as CEO of Triumph North America. But . . . I feel compelled to warn you . . . Triumph has not entered WSBK competition. That may sour your choice. | ||
| Sifo |
I too suspect that conversation has been had among those in the know. No Triumph has not entered WSBK competition. To me, that means nothing, especially when looking at a naked bike. In fact I want it tuned like a street bike, not a WSBK. That is one place where I like the EBR over the Ducati. I'm not sure it will help them in their WSBK results though. That may be bad for them for those who actually are swayed by WSBK results. One thing I will say... I hope Erik is really enjoying life right now. I'm sure he is. He is doing what he truly loves. Far be it for me to tell him how to do it better. He just may not have me in mind with his choices. That's OK!  | ||
| Court |
>>>That may be bad for them for those who actually are swayed by WSBK results. Those folks are the cousins of the Easter Bunny . . . everyone has been lectured about their existence and import . . just no one seems able to find them. (Message edited by court on June 12, 2014) | ||
| Ratbuell |
...or consistently market to them... | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Triumph haven't attempted to build a bike for WSBK racing, but they have been incredibly successful in top flight racing these past few years. This conversation has become increasingly silly, it having no bearing whatsoever on EBR. Rocket in England | ||
| Jon |
I actually like the customer styled "Typhoon" better. I like the old fly screen and dual headlights. It's a cool bike, though. Very cool. Well done, Buell. | ||
| Jon |
Triumph is at the salt, though. | ||
| Rick_a |
There is a quite a difference between a WSBK tuned bike and the Ducati street bike you can purchase at a dealership... | ||
| Crusty |
Here's a link to Cycle World's take on it: http://www.cycleworld.com/2014/06/11/2015-erik-bue ll-racing-ebr-1190sx-naked-bike-first-look-review- and-photo-gallery/?cmpid=enews061214&spPodID=020&s pMailingID=20985569&spUserID=NzM4NjMxNDI4NDkS1&spJ obID=340668358&spReportId=MzQwNjY4MzU4S0 | ||
| 2kx1 |
I think EBR put this bike together relatively fast, and yes I do like it. It has taken BMW 4-5 years to make the s1000r and they dropped out of world superbike. This bike will prove itself as versatile as a 1st gen Tuono with more of everything. | ||
| Trojan |
But . . . I feel compelled to warn you . . . Triumph has not entered WSBK competition. They did manage to win a TT last week though, and are leading the BSB Supersport series, and won the Daytona 200 this year..............If only they were as successful as EBR they'd be happy  | ||
| Gregtonn |
The SX? Not my cup of tea. I won't comment on looks until I see it in person. I also had an idea. Rocket and Trojan should make a movie about themselves. They should call it... Glum and Glummer  G | ||
| Gregtonn |
Those MVs are flat ugly like a hooker trying to wear everything she owns and still hang it out. Now this is pretty in a black bikini.  G | ||
| Wolfridgerider |
Is EBR going to have a Demo truck at the AMA Vintage days? I'm working the event on Friday, July 11th and it sure would be nice to take one for a spin. I'll be one of the "Fan Track Lap" escorts.... come on out and do a lap with me! |
