| Author | Message | ||
     Reindog |
The Federal Government is exponentially spiraling out of control and is probably irretrievably broken. The Framers knew this could happen and provided a way to restore the government in Article V of the US Constitution. South Carolina, Florida, and Virginia have requested the Convention of States to correct our out of control government. This movement has a high probability of gaining traction and this thread might become as vital as the "President 0" thread. I have not decided for myself that this is a good idea but the Fourth Estate is controlling America despite who is in power. We must return to our roots or perish. Here is a FAQ from a website given below. Educate yourself and debate. I am not sure where I stand on this but it provides a modicum of hope despite the danger. Frequently Asked Questions Why Do We Want to Call a Convention of States? Washington, D.C., is broken. The federal government is spending this country into the ground, seizing power from the States and taking liberty from the people. It’s time American citizens took a stand and made a legitimate effort to curb the power and jurisdiction of the federal government. The Founders gave us a tool to fix Washington, D.C. – Article V of the U.S. Constitution. We must use it before it is too late. What is a Convention of States? A Convention of States is a convention called by the state legislatures for the purpose of proposing amendments to the Constitution. They are given power to do this under Article V of the Constitution. It is not a constitutional convention. It cannot throw out the Constitution because its authority is derived from the Constitution. How Do the State Legislatures Call a Convention of States? Thirty-four State legislatures must pass a bill called an “application” calling for a convention of states. The applications must request a convention of states for the same subject matter. They submit these applications to Congress. Can Congress Block a Convention of States? No. As long as each States applies for a convention that deals with the same issue (i.e., limiting the power and jurisdiction of the federal government), Congress must call the convention. Congress can name the place and the time for the convention. If it fails to exercise this power reasonably, either the courts or the states themselves can override Congressional inaction. How Do States Choose Their Delegates? States are free to develop their own selection process for choosing their delegates--properly called "commissioners." Historically, the most common method was an election by a joint session of both houses of the state legislature. Despite how many delegates are sent, each state has one vote. What Happens at a Convention of States? Commissioners from each state may propose, discuss, and vote on amendments to the Constitution. Amendments the convention passes by a simple majority will be sent back to the states for ratification. Again, each state has one vote at the convention. How are Proposed Amendments Ratified? Thirty-eight States must ratify any proposed amendments. Once States ratify, the amendments become part of the Constitution. How Do We Know How a Convention of States Will Work? Interstate conventions were common during the Founding era, and the procedures and rules for such conventions were widely accepted. Thus, we can know how a Convention of States would operate by looking at the historical record. Dr. Rob Natelson has done extensive research on this topic, and more details can be found in the Handbook. Is a Constitutional Convention Safe? Yes! The ratification process ensures no amendment will be passed that does not reflect the desires of the American people. Additionally, there are numerous safeguards against a “runaway convention,” all of which can be found in the Handbook. If the Federal Government Ignores the Current Constitution, Why Would They Adhere to an Amended Constitution? When the Founders wrote the Constitution, they did not anticipate modern-day politicians who take advantage of loopholes and vague phraseology. Even though the federal violation of the Constitution is obvious to all reasonable Americans, Washington pretends otherwise, claiming the Constitution contains broad and flexible language. Amendments at a convention of states will be written with such politicians in mind. The language they use for these amendments will be unequivocal. There will be no doubt as to their meaning, no possibility of alternate interpretations, and no way for them to be broken. In addition to this, it should be noted that the federal government has not violated the amendments passed in recent years. Women’s suffrage, for example, has been 100% upheld. What is the Convention of States Project’s Plan? The COS Project's plan is twofold: 1. To call a convention for a particular subject rather than a particular amendment, i.e., to limit the power and jurisdiction of the federal government. Instead of calling a convention for a balanced budget amendment (though we are entirely supportive of such an amendment), our convention would allow other federal limiting amendments to be brought as well. (Term-limits, Tax reform, etc.) 2. To energize the grassroots support! We are building a grassroots operation in a minimum of 40 states, getting 100 people to volunteer in at least 75% of the state legislative districts. Volunteers will contact their State legislators, show up at hearings, and support the campaigns of those legislators who support COS. http://www.conventionofstates.com | ||
| Panhead_dan |
This may be the most important thing I've read is at least 5 years. I need time to digest it. | ||
| Pwnzor |
I also need time to digest this, on the surface it seems to be just what we need. | ||
| Zane |
Very serious idea. Like Dan and Pwnzor, I have to think this one through. My initial reation is yes it may be needed but do I really trust any modern day politician to touch my Constitution? | ||
| Elsinore74 |
Will the Federal Gov't pay more attention to following the Constitution if changes are made to which they disagree? Seems they have an "ala carte" attitude toward it now ("I'll have some of this; I don't like that...). | ||
| Reepicheep |
Kind of like Occupy Wall Street... but by the grownups.  | ||
| Reindog |
Keep posting your thoughts as my mind is not made up, but leaning towards COS. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
I DO like this idea as a positive alternative to whats going on right now but..... I also think we should move cautiously and carefully with intelligence to insure, as well as we can, a good outcome. That means, I believe four basic things. 1. A totally agreed upon subject. 2. Plenty of intelligent research. 3. Slowly enough to be sure of the outcome and 4. And this I believe is very important; wait until after the 2016 elections and see what direction our country takes with a new president and regime to let this country work as it has succeeded for most of its life. And I say again: "vote very carefully in these upcoming elections" And a last note: the very thought of a "convention of states" is going to really get these politicians thinking. I believe the Tea Party has had a positive effect on them also. | ||
| Reindog |
Any tyrannical, un-American amendment is blocked by 14 states. There are 17 states have the most common sense but no guarantee that they would do the right thing. Here is the latest Vegas line. Can you find Waldo, the missing State in this list? Probables: 17 Texas Wyoming Oklahoma Kansas South Dakota North Dakota Idaho Utah South Carolina Alabama Tennessee West Virginia Indiana Mississippi Nebraska Arizona Kentucky (?) Maybe: 15 Ohio Florida Georgia (unless Pwnzor is the delegate) New Hampshire Pennsylvania Maine North Carolina Wisconsin (I am having trouble with this one but they did keep and retain Governor Walker). Alaska Montana Colorado (?) Louisiana Iowa Virgina (?) Missouri Hopeless: 17 California New York Illinois New Jersey Massachusetts Michigan Connecticut Maryland Delaware Vermont Rhode Island Minnesota Hawaii Washington Oregon New Mexico (?) Nevada (?) | ||
| Sifo |
I certainly prefer this to where I see us heading, BUT, and you knew there has to be a but, it sounds too much like passing even more gun laws because the criminals just aren't following the current gun laws that are sufficient to cover everything you want to accomplish. The problem isn't with the Constitution. The problem is with the politicians who don't follow the Constitution. The problem is with our courts. The problem is with our schools. The problem is with the people who support it. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Living in Ohio, I think you will see it flip back to being more conservative. | ||
| Buewulf |
We could potentially get enough applications to call the convention, but I doubt there would be enough consensus to ratify anything meaningful. This would have to be a very focused effort with some clearly defined objectives to have a chance at affecting anything. I hate to be a pessimist, but I suspect the best result we could hope to attain from this would be a metaphorical statement. The most realistic outcome I think we would see is the US Congress begin pork barreling special projects / initiatives to buy off the swing states though there are probably enough "hopeless" states to not even need to bother with that. | ||
| Macbuell |
Sifo, the idea around this is passing amendments that the a-holes in Washington have no interest in passing. Things that make common sense but they won't pass because it hurts them. The two that are most talked about that almost every American would support are: A Balanced Budget Amendment Term Limits This Convention is a good thing and would be a huge step in the right direction for the citizens to take their country back from career politicians who only want to protect and expand their power base. | ||
| Court |
>>>>but they won't pass because it hurts them. Like them and their staff falling under the same obamacare law you and I do. | ||
| Gschuette |
Thanks for bringing this to the attention of the board. Very interesting. | ||
| Sifo |
Sifo, the idea around this is passing amendments that the a-holes in Washington have no interest in passing. Things that make common sense but they won't pass because it hurts them. The two that are most talked about that almost every American would support are: A Balanced Budget Amendment Term Limits I hear what you are saying. Politicians are getting quite brazen about ignoring the laws that constrain them though. Unfortunately, they have found, correctly so, there is no penalty for them ignoring these laws. What is there to enforce them following a Balanced Budget Amendment when they are already ignoring the law stating they must pass a budget in the first place. I hope you can see how this is like the gun laws thing I posted. Term limits are something that would much harder to ignore. I hope they would never get that brazen. There are those who are rumbling that this should be ignored for the current pResident though. We'll see soon enough. This would be a hard one to ignore though, especially for one who isn't the top politician. It's not that I'm against it. I'm just skeptical that it will deliver meaningful change. I'm not that familiar with how it works, or would work in our system, but I'm curious what happens in other systems that allow for a "no confidence" vote on their government. Might be something worth discussion. | ||
| Macbuell |
Term limits alone would make a huge impact. We need to get rid of Career politicians and put people in Washington that actually have their constituents and the will of the people in mind and not only reelection and expanding their power base. | ||
| Fb1 |
These videos will answer a lot of questions about the Convention of States, and will also illuminate the depth of Michael Farris' knowledge of the Constitution: http://youtu.be/Y_AyUiEsEBY http://youtu.be/1Rw5QfSWRdM | ||
| Aesquire |
Interesting. I've long been told that a Constitutional Convention is a sucker's game for us Citizens, as the Progressives and other authoritarians would use it to increase their power, and screw us. Then again, that may be from people invested in the status quo. I'm skeptical on the idea above.... | ||
| Baybueller |
I watched the video by Mr Farris. Wow, a constitutional lawyer that speaks for 42 min. without a teleprompter and not once the phrase aaaaah. One state, one vote will scare the crap out of all dems, some repubs, and the media. The vilification will commence shortly. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Need to add limitations to the lifetime healthcare and other benefits given to any who serve even a minimum term in Washington too. The money we spend on them is ridiculous. Maybe we can have them use the VA, might force some improvements in the standard of care for vets... I like the Convention of States idea. While I understand the perspective of those saying it wouldn't get us anywhere, I wonder what could be worked out if there were enough right minded folks at this convention. | ||
| Blake |
This is a good idea. Mark Levin has written an entire book about this, and has been pushing the idea relentlessly on his radio show. He's tough to listen to for me, but on the way home from the office, I'll tune in. Just wish he wasn't so shrill and always wound up so tight. | ||
| Reindog |
The COS would probably be limited in scope to the "application" by the 34 State legislatures. Whatever is in the application has a good chance of passage as it only requires three more state commissioners to agree. That is an attainable goal. Getting 37 commissioners to agree on anything else probably is doomed to fail with our divided country. As an aside, this is a good argument for Colorado and California to divide into two states each. This would provide a louder Conservative voice to save America. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
He's tough to listen to for me, but on the way home from the office, I'll tune in. Just wish he wasn't so shrill and always wound up so tight. It's hard to remain calm when you see what's going on around you. | ||
| Fb1 |
Reindog, hope you don't mind me posting this here; it seems relevant to the thread topic.
We the People are definitely in a crisis situation. Our Republic stands on the brink. I hope the Convention of States is successful; we have precious few other remedies. | ||
| Reindog |
A reasonable, achievable goal of a COS would be term limits of all members in the Legislative Branch, and a balanced budget mandate that is enforceable. | ||
| Fb1 |
Term limits for Congress would be HUGE, as would a Supreme Court made up of 50 Justices appointed by the States, NOT by the President. And yes, term limits for the 50 Supremes, too. | ||
| Zane |
I have a question about term limits. While on the surface I like the idea, doesn't it in fact just change who has the power. Instead of the 5 term congressman and the 3rd term senator, doesn't the power shift to the staffers that brief the congressman/senators and run thier offices? They'd be the only ones around with the experience and contacts. Wouldn't the staffers become the new "old boys network", each pushing his/sher own agenda on their rookie congressman/senator? (Message edited by Zane on December 06, 2013) | ||
| Bob_thompson |
In all these threads; 2nd Amendment, President O, Health.gov. is not working and a few others, a single thought keeps coming to mind for me and that is "education". It seems we are becoming a nation deeply involved in many things that are really not relevant to our well being as a nation. Now granted we need to focus on family, earning a living and many important things to us as individuals but we really need to be educated in how our nation works and exactly what is good or bad for us when we practice our right to vote.......intelligently. I think, here on BadWeb we have some of the most learned posters I have read on the web, thanks guys, but I'm highly concerned about all those, mostly younger people who vote and do not have a clue. We see them on Jay Lenos "Jay walking" and Fox network "Jesse Waters" interviews. And I might ad those who have a single purpose or agenda, like older people JUST concerned about social security or medicare. Many are on the web just to play games or gossip about frivolous things. Now I do not have much of an idea as to how we can educate these people when they are not very concerned but for me I talk about these "important" things whenever I find someone, young or old, with an open mind, who will at least listen. I try and plant the seed, without a personal opinion, and without preaching and let them think. Maybe enough will come around soon enough to save this greatest of countries of ours. I already see a profound change in intelligent younger folks who are turning against Obamacare. That's a great sign. Hopefully its not too late. End of rant.....again. Gotta go fire up the 1125R before it freezes. | ||
| Elsinore74 |
Bob, I hear you loud and clear. 99% of my fellow students are just the kind of folks you reference. You wouldn't believe how out-of-touch a generation that's online 24/7 can be. I'm not one to bring up politics at school, but if the subject is already on the table, presenting what I believe is a logical, reasoned viewpoint (which tends to be conservative, libertarian-leaning) is the responsible thing to do. Critical thinking isn't dead, but it could use more exercise in some halls of higher learning. Judging from an unscientific survey of bumper stickers in the school parking lot, you might be surprised the number of people who share the views expressed here. |
