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Hootowl
Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2013 - 09:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Oh, and if we're worried about the oceans warming, why are we dumping waste heat from nuclear reactors into the ocean?
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Sifo
Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2013 - 10:45 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Acidification is real, and the best way to deal with it is to clean up coal & bunker oil's sulfur emissions into the air.

I agree, even if the term sounds inherently bad to most people. I might propose pH change as a better term that is less emotionally charged.

While the change is real, you have to ask, is it good, bad, or indifferent. The big fear I hear of is that more acidic oceans will cause crustaceans to have calcium dissolved from their shells and will die off. It sounds right on the surface. I got into this discussion with a geologist, who held this view, at one point. I really didn't know much about the issue, but wanted to know the facts surrounding it, so I asked some questions. First, what did we know about the history of the oceans regarding pH levels? He quickly came up with data going way back into history. Then I asked, what do we know about the history of crustaceans in the oceans? Again, he knew where to quickly find such data. I then found myself asking what seemed an obvious question that set off a firestorm between us. That was, why did crustaceans first come to be during a period of time when the oceans were much more acidic than current levels, or even levels that are feared in our future. He had no answer to that, but was infuriated that I would even question science that stated crustaceans would be wiped out in a matter of decades if we didn't take action now.

I won't claim to know the answers to this, but it seems clear to me that many others who claim to have the answers, don't.
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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2013 - 07:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Skip the big words like "acidification" and "catastrophe theory".

It does not make sense to shit where you live.

Cows shit where they live. It's fertilizer, and they don't seem to smell all that good anyway. It works for them. ( we do, after all, breed them for dumb. )

Predators, cats, dogs, etc. tend to want to hide their scat. It's also a survival trait, since they Do have good noses, and the smell of Carnivore shit scares off prey.

And even if we were just talking literal shit, we make so much that cities have always been a disaster waiting to happen. Rome's greatest triumph may be the aqueducts and sewage system, not the wars on Carthage.

Modern sewer systems have done more to prevent mass death by plague than antibiotics. There is considerable room for improvement. Once NYC dumped it's shit in the river. I assume they now treat that, and truck it somewhere.... I hope. The next generation will need better systems.

Since we insist on houses, cars, tvs and cell phones, we make a lot of waste. We have to keep our planet reasonably clean or the dire warnings of the eco-nuts will, indeed come true.

It's just irony the direction the eco-nuts push is the wrong one sometimes.

Rationing, living poor, etc. makes things worse. See Russia. China. Most of the planet in fact. Being high tech, rich and smart gives you the beauty of the English Countryside, West Virginia, Upstate New York, etc. etc.

I object to those who lie to try and save us. I really object to those who lie pretending it's to save us, but really to make themselves rich. Like Al Gore.
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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2013 - 07:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Torquehd, Wrong thread for religious fanatics trying to rule the world with lies and violence....

No, hold it, I DO bitch about that here.

But the Jihad against Western Civilization, while they do make eco-nut noises to suck in the idiots, leave behind messes that are only exceeded by the Soviets and Communists.

Don't believe me? Go for a boat trip on the Aral Sea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aral_Sea

Anywho, you want the "truth" thread to bitch about that groups sexual practices. Personally, I draw the line at "consenting adults", and don't think rapists, especially child rapists belong in prison.

That subject is a big chink in my attitude against Capital Punishment. Without details, let us just say I know a few people who are lucky to be in prison. ( not that I would do anything illegal, but there are relatives of the victims...... )
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Sifo
Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2013 - 07:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It does not make sense to shit where you live.

Agreed. As you point out though, we aren't talking about literal shit. That means interpretation of what shit is? Is CO2 shit? Al Gore and others will tell you it is. I tend to disagree. Sulfur, I'm not so sure about. There are some real nasty issues from burning coal, such as mercury. To me, that's the real shit.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, October 12, 2013 - 10:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The sulfuric acid rain issue in Upstate NY and New England was, IIRC, from high sulfur coal burned in the Ohio region, using uber tall stacks ( to limit local pollution ) and the prevailing wind patterns focused it, with bad results.

In Germany, it was again a large scale micrometeorology problem, with "traps" and pockets of concentration of smoke.

I was under the impression that the problem is much less now because of better tech on the power plants.

We can make better. ( Magnetohydrodynamic primary generators with heat cycle boiling water turbine cogenerator and full recovery scubber systems. ( needed to conserve the MHD "seed" material ) Essentially hot water vapor & CO2 output. Feed that to a Greenhouse system & have a net carbon gain. )

I don't know much about Oceanic acidification, except if Sulfur is an issue, the much increased use of coal in Asia makes keeping an eye on that important.

As you point out, metals, especially Mercury and other heavy metals, is a real concern.

There's also something to be said for conserving the existing coal beds for the future, where I'm sure it's use as chemical feedstock will be far more important than burning it.

Also I have much sympathy for the miners and those dependent on the industry, while being concerned over the environmental damage.

The political part? seems to me to be naked authoritarianism, Capitalism grown To Big To Fail, and the ginormous amount of political ( bribe ) money involved.....
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, October 12, 2013 - 10:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MHD_generator

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetohydrodynamics

And, from the above link, why Solar storms affect electric & data grids..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Currents.jpg

Move those magnetic fields with solar wind/high energy particle flow at hypersonic speed, and you get current. spikes and floods of it.
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Aesquire
Posted on Sunday, October 13, 2013 - 07:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/ 100238550/the-climate-alarmists-have-lost-the-deba te-its-time-we-stopped-indulging-their-poisonous-f antasy/

We tell them Reality does not match their predictions.

They say we are fat, running dog capitalist pigs, who hate children.

Who has the clearer argument?

Which one addresses the real world?
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Aesquire
Posted on Sunday, October 13, 2013 - 10:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/must-see-video-spac ex-grasshopper-rocket-makes-half-mile-hop-8C113807 72

Just plane cool.

The argument between spaceships with wings, and VTOL tail landers has been going on a while. Wings contribute nothing when in vacuum, but need little fuel to get you on the ground.......and tail landers need smart guidance, and enough fuel to stop.
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Torquehd
Posted on Monday, October 14, 2013 - 03:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Wow. That is impressive. It seems like it shouldn't be, but it is.
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Chauly
Posted on Monday, October 14, 2013 - 10:36 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

What's curious and a bit puzzling is the billowy orange flame dancing around the tail, like something wasn't burning correctly or not shutting off completely. It looked like the tip wasn't screwed tightly on the welding torch--- any weldors here will know what I'm talking about... :-)
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Aesquire
Posted on Monday, October 14, 2013 - 11:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The Grasshopper 1.0 used the Merlin 1D engine. The 1D is the center engine of the cluster engine setup for the in progress Falcon 9 Booster.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merlin_1D#Merlin_1D

I assume that the billowy flame is the exhaust of the Turbopump that pumps fuel & oxidizer ( Rp-1 ( premium kerosene) & LOX )
into the engine.

The 1A engine used the turbopump exhaust as part of the guidance system, mounting it's nozzle on a swivel, but it looks like just bolting it in place is lighter and easier.

There is a lot of thrust coming out of it, but the bulk of the power & velocity of the exhaust is used by the turbine, so it's not coming out nearly as fast, and that's why it's "billowy".

In vertical, going up like a batoutahell flight, it's not nearly as noticeable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grasshopper_(rocket)
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Aesquire
Posted on Monday, October 14, 2013 - 11:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.space.com/19379-saturn-5-f1-engines-tes t-firing.html

Here's the gas generator ( a freaking rocket motor ) that feed the turbopump on a Saturn F1 engine.

NASA is looking at the old parts as they redesign the F1 for their new booster.

The system on the Merlin Engine for SpaceX's Falcons is smaller, but it's still a rocket engine hooked up to a turbine to spin the fuel pump.

Keep in mind this is just to run the pumps.

Saturn F1 Gas Generator test.


And the Real deal, the Merlin 1D engine used in the Grasshopper 1.0
You can see the turbopump in some of the views.



How fast would a pickup go with that pushing it? ( Answer, Smithereens! )
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Aesquire
Posted on Monday, October 14, 2013 - 11:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.nationalreview.com/human-exceptionalism /361101/genocidal-impulses-human-depopulation-wesl ey-j-smith

I'll skip comment on this one.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 08:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/25/aussie-pm-carbon -tax-is-socialism/

Looks like the Aussies caught on.

I'm still not sure how to rant on the post above.


Biologists have calculated that an ideal population — the number at which everyone could live at a first-world level of consumption, without ruining the planet irretrievably — would be 1.5 billion.

That’s Deep Ecology anti-human talk–which alas, has become mainstream within the environmental movement.

But here’s the thing: You can’t go from 7 billion (or 9 billion, or 15 billion) to 1.5 billion through voluntary, non-lethal means. China’s tyrannical one-child policy has not reduced the number of people in that populous country, only slowed the rate of growth. If female infanticide, forced abortion, and eugenics don’t do the job, imagine what it would take!


No matter how many times I explain to people about nihilism as a component of the watermelon movements, no one wants to believe it. It just is too insane for most to comprehend.

When the leaders of your faith start telling you the world would be a better place with far less people, ( sure, makes sense ) so you can live great without guilt, ( selfish, but rational ) where does that rationalization chain lead?

"so we have to murder 3/4 of the planet, staring with the infidels, of course, since they don't treat the Earth as nice as us"

"It's for the Children". ( which of course, will mostly have to die. But it's kinder to gas them to have them live in a horrible polluted hell, right? So it's ok. It's for their own good. It's perfectly reasonable..........)

And the worst part is just saying it makes ME seem nuts, while they plan to tax your breathing.
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Sifo
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 09:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

When the leaders of your faith start telling you the world would be a better place with far less people, ( sure, makes sense ) so you can live great without guilt, ( selfish, but rational ) where does that rationalization chain lead?

You can be sure that these "leaders" will lead from the back of the line, pushing other into the gas chamber first.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 04:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well, of course the enlightened have to stay around and practice stewardship of the planet.

It's the unenlightened masses that have to go.

As I've told people for years ( literally decades, now ) if you believe in Anthropomorphic global warming, you can't Let 3 billion Chinese drive SUVs.

I often get thoughtful nods on that one.

Then I really get them going by pointing out the only way to stop that is to initiate Nuclear Winter ( a mostly disproven theory ) by nuking China.

The funny part is I'm just blunter than the nihilist society suicidal greenies.

There is a really twisted manifest destiny argument that the only way to save the planet is to kill all the poor people, except for small colonies to harvest the chocolate, cinnamon, etc. And most of the Rich people so that the remaining resources are not strained by our excessive lifestyles. No one in these discussions ever volunteers to sacrifice themselves for the rest, oddly enough.

It's the hubris of the Aristocracy.

Ted Turner is awaiting the day he eats bison steak in his heavily guarded ranch while we become cannibals in the post apocalyptic world.

Tom Clancy pulled the philosophy of the bad guys group in the novel "Rainbow Six" right off the Greenie websites.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 04:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Now this is fringe stuff.

Most ecologically aware people are reasonably rational, even if they drive a Prius, read Mother Earth News, and recycle wine bottles into walls.

It's really a small minority that would do terrorism, ( most Muslims are not terrorists, most...... ) or support genocide to keep a privileged lifestyle.

Or free lab animals,
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Hootowl
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 10:37 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB100014240527 02304655104579163663464339836

Lies, lies, and more lies. Okay, that's not fair, he MAY believe his own tripe, in which case, he's simply delusional.

From the very first paragraph where he states the obvious, and appears to claim he and his ilk are not responsible for the outcome (it is implied, not stated), this is a painful read.

You've been warned.
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Sifo
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 11:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)


quote:

subprime carbon asset bubble






WTF?
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Aesquire
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 08:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That's right, the guy who sold his tv network to the oil sheiks, wants you to believe that the tax on Carbon will lower your investment in oil.

He may have a point. Between the tax on energy they want to put on, and the current foreign policy of the US, it's a good bet that oil prices will rise substantially, and therefor demand will drop.

I'm having a hard time imagining the price actually dropping as it gets taxed into oblivion, economically, but that's what he's saying.

Fossil fuels ( and by extension, alcohol, any CO2 releasing chemical, and your breath ) are in the process of being outlawed by pricing them out of economic reach. Since the replacement for burning old sunlight just isn't there, I just see prices rise.

Economic, and real hardship as one faces the choice between heat and food, and the mandatory expenses of a New Normal socialism, looks to suck.

There are available technologies that can help, but as with web sites, and truth, directed technology is a difficult thing for Government to do. ( Knowing what you are doing, and making things work, not being part of the Government skill set )

IMO the Science behind his economic insight is flawed. Consensus has nothing to do with science.

Ultimately, owning oil futures will be as silly as stock in horse & buggy harness makers, but stock in giant mega corps that are not run by looters like at Kodak, are generally a good purchase. Exxon is going to make money if they have to build algae farms.

It's not like I see any hope of demand dropping globally, since China will take up any slack in consumption, so Unlike Gore, I think for the next decade at least, Oil is a good investment.

OTOH, the Authoritarian types see Carbon as the greatest excuse ever for taxing you. So expect to bear the burden no matter what happens.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2013 - 07:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-248 3553/The-brain-powered-CAR-Vehicle-monitors-driver -paying-attention-slows-theyre-distracted.html

I don't know if I should be thrilled, or terrified. It just has so much potential for abuse. Think mandatory, like alcohol testers, in cars.

OTOH.......What if you had a race, with cars set up so the more "focused" you were, the faster you would go?

The possibilities for "mental" control using this technology are exciting. I'm thinking quadriplegics and the "Jaegers" from "Pacific Rim".
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2013 - 07:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/nov/1/oba ma-orders-government-prep-global-warming/

I'm going on record right now with this prediction.

This is going to make some folk who contribute a lot of money to Obama.com a great whopping bunch of money. Your money.

Bet ya.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2013 - 07:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Not sure which definition of "resilience" the President is using.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/resilien ce

http://www.resilience.org/

It's such a nice buzzword. Like Progressive. People's Republic.
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Aesquire
Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2013 - 09:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

https://medium.com/war-is-boring/740cf5a8e930
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Aesquire
Posted on Monday, November 04, 2013 - 10:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2485772/Gl obal-warming-pause-20-years-Arctic-sea-ice-started -recover.html

Bottom line, the models are wrong.
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Aesquire
Posted on Friday, November 08, 2013 - 08:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/e2-wire/189754-ob ama-grasps-for-climate-legacy-as-second-term-agend a-crumbles

If you want to keep your car, you can. Period.

If you want to keep riding a motorcycle, you can. Period.

If you want to pay a tithe to another's religion, you can. Period. ( and if you don't, too bad. Period. )
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Blake
Posted on Saturday, November 09, 2013 - 10:04 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Now we can at least tell the actual scientists from those more concerned with greed and or politics. Anyone pretending to be objective and scientific but who refuses to oppose the alarmism and dire forecasting has proved themselves untrustworthy.

Meanwhile Al Gore continues to press for his own happy ending, not just at the massage parlor, but for his carbon trading investments.

He ought to be in prison with all the other scheming liars who defraud people of their hard earned money.

Instead, he receives awards, an Oscar from Hollywood and another farce from the Nobel committee.
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Aesquire
Posted on Sunday, November 10, 2013 - 11:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/2013/10/ 28/paul-krugman-environmentalist-first-economist-s econd/

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/363533/ukrai nes-genocide-famine-alec-torres
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Ducbsa
Posted on Monday, November 11, 2013 - 05:24 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Temperatures not rising doesn't seem to bother the Krugmans of the world.
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