| Author | Message | ||
     Hootowl |
Greenpeace gets a reality check. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/10/01/greenpeace -crew-in-shock-in-russian-jails/?intcmp=HPBucket Traipsing around Western Democracies decrying the actions of Western Democracies is all well and good. Just don't try it anywhere else. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I'm taking bets on sea levels in 100yrs time. I'll give you great odds too. Just so's you can make an informed decision, here's a few of the major theories. A. The earth warms up, the poles melt, sea levels rise a bit & the coastlines are redrawn a bit, however we're all living in a crowded but tropical paradise. B. The earth warms up a bit, the seas evaporate a bit more & sea levels drop, the consequential constant cloud cover causes cooler temperatures & lots of snow leading to a near "ice age". C. Something somewhere in between. Remember, as the owner of an internal combustion engine, IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT!!! So bet now & bet often, I'll pay out to all winners (or their descendants) who precisely predict the daily temperatures & sea level at Le Guilvinec fishing port in Brittany for the whole of 2114. Come on, you know it makes sense. Well as much sense as the experts anyway. | ||
| Hootowl |
I'll bet you $100 USD that whatever it does, the climate models will not have predicted it. | ||
| Britchri10 |
Sea levels in 100 years time? Who cares! I will be dead and gone a long time before that. My son will be the same. His children (If he has any in the future) will be in their 70's. Their children (assuming they breed, will be in their 40's & the children of my child's children's children will be teenagers) So, a bet on whether the planet will be hot,cold or flooded (or any permutation of the three) Who cares! No one with any authority can tell me whether it will rain in 4 weeks time. It's all bull! (Also, when I win & the world is warm and drowning, how do I collect?) Chris C | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I'll come & find you Chris. Honest!  | ||
| Aesquire |
The "con" scenario is "Soylent Green". Too hot, crowded cities, no crops. That's never happened, and we've had all kinds of climate. But, I'd restate Mr. Grumpy's predictions. A. Is possible as stated.. We've had warmer climates, and it's been good. B. Most likely scenario, but as I understand the mechanism.....It's not the cloud cover, it's the open Arctic Ocean that dumps mass snow in a "lake effect" on the Northern Hemisphere. The increased albedo of the ground reduces temperatures and the snow stays, longer and longer, until it's mini Ice age, for an indefinite period. ( tens to thousands of years. ) I could be wrong on that one, but it was the popular theory back in the 1970's. long view. http://www.daviesand.com/Choices/Precautionary_Pla nning/New_Data/IceCores1.gif last cycle. http://blogs.agu.org/wildwildscience/files/2010/07 /vostok_back_to_eemian.jpg Notice we are at or near peak and the fall into bad. Civilization has never survived these cycles, except in legend. ( Indian pre-history for example. ) | ||
| Aesquire |
Of course you can't discount Volcanic effects, ranging from "a year without a summer" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Without_a_Summer to Supervolcano. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supervolcano http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theo ry With the really long term stuff determined by the Orbital Mechanics of the Earth. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbital_eccentricity# Climatic_effect Cycles. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles | ||
| Sifo |
http://mrc.org/articles/networks-embrace-catastrop hic-warnings-latest-ipcc-report
Wow! We really missed that bullet! Over 200 degrees of warming if that warming had gone into the atmosphere. Of course, I'm still just a bit confused on this new theory where warming from atmospheric CO2 (which happens in the atmosphere BTW) winds up in the deep oceans where we fail to be able to measure it. I guess I'm going to have to go to the local community college and enroll in a "new physics" class, because this certainly isn't how I learned things worked. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/04/kille r-hornets-chinese-city-living-in-fear Don't run away flailing... Freeze and attempt alpha waves. ( Has worked for me during hornet swarms for years. ) http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/tropica l-development-possible-1/18390176 Not a political question, really, but have they actually fixed any of New Orleans storm flood issues? ( from every National Geographic article on New Orleans my entire life. "below sea level..... burial above ground because of water table......... doomed........ waiting for the next big storm........ Mardi Gras......Jazz.......Bourbon street." | ||
| Sifo |
You mean like abandoning the area for an area that is actually above sea level? NO will always be a disaster waiting for the right conditions. | ||
| Chauly |
IIRC, The French Quarter is above sea level; it's St. Bernard's Parish and the 9th Wardthat are below sea level. That's where the poor people have to/used to live. I hear the houses are priced very reasonably, but insurance is a b*tch. Oh, did I mention the brain-eating amoebas in the St. Bernard's drinking water? :-( | ||
| Hootowl |
French quarter is above sea level. Thats why they built there. The levees came later in order to farm. People were never intended to live there. | ||
| Aesquire |
I found the perfect picture of man's effect on his Environment. It's a true life lesson. http://chillingkoala.com/post/30173 | ||
| Sifo |
OMG! We'll all be dead by 2030!!! http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/342876 /Sir-Bob-Geldof-All-humans-will-die-before-2030 | ||
| Kenm123t |
Why would I take advice on living from a Zombie ! Geldof has been dead for years no has told him yet Kinda like Keith Richards | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.oregonlive.com/books/index.ssf/2011/03/ ted_dansons_trying_to_save_the.html Sifo, we've all been dead since 1998, right? It is in the nature of the Greenies to exaggerate. While it comes out to a rational human as outright lies, it's actually understandable. If I tell you that the release of Chemical X into the environment causes a .0000001 % increase in planetary cancer deaths, you won't pay attention to me. The number is so small, even though it actually means that a few dozen people who would have lived, now will die, horribly, that it's silly in your head to worry about it. So, I tell you instead that Chemical X will kill millions. THAT gets your attention. It's even "true", sorta, IF, over a thousand years of continuous leakage from a plant in continuous operation, nothing else in the universe changes. In the real world, that's insane. The plant that makes Chemical X will be shut down in 6 years ( because Chemical X will be expensive, and it's less harmful replacement cheap ) We'll develop more cures for cancer, our civilization will have been replaced by either a more advanced one, or a darker one, probably multiple times, Volcanoes will erupt, and WWZ will have already reduced the population of humans on the planet to 70,000. Seriously. Chemical X Does need to be regulated, we need to cleanup the "brown fields" where 19th & early 20th century industry has polluted the Earth, and keep working on science because if you thought Chemical X was bad, The stuff they are going to use in the 21st century data implants makes it look like mother's milk. Or something equally scary. More people are going to die next year from poorly washed pre packaged organic salad than Chemical X will ever kill. But it you want to get action, you lie through your teeth. It's the culture, and the legacy of the Soviet system. ( that created the European Green parties. ) You shouldn't pick on Bob Geldorf, since..... what? he's still alive? | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/03/us-clima te-oceans-idUSBRE99208K20131003?feedType=RSS&feedN ame=topNews Oceans face 'deadly trio' of threats, study says First, despite this being a rehash of the same basic crisis's that the Ocean is facing in an industrialized world, it also uses the latest buzzwords of the Global Climate Con. It's a hack piece, and not really worth reading, to be honest. However the 3 issues it addresses are quite real and must be addressed. Acidification is real, and the best way to deal with it is to clean up coal & bunker oil's sulfur emissions into the air. It's the Sulfuric acid that drips out of the clouds, that has done some serious damage downwind of power plants & foundries. There are both technological and political solutions. Better tech exists, and is being developed. Politically...... The "right" thing to do IMHO is to make better tech available everywhere. The predictable thing to do is authoritarian exploitation of a crisis to screw us. Deoxygenation is mostly a matter of fertilizer and detergent use. Again, better tech solves the problem. But again it has political ramifications, in the choice to pass laws to ban stuff vs. smart tech to use as little as possible while we wait for better stuff. The warming part is overblown, IMHO, but actually understanding the systems better is vitally important. We have the enormous Hubris to attempt planetary engineering on a scale that big. The models just don't predict very good yet. We need better models, and better understanding of both the Climate and the limitations of our models. Let's assume, for argument, that humans burning fossil fuels is increasing the greenhouse effect and keeping/making the planet warmer than it would otherwise be. There's certainly a good argument for the idea, it goes back a century, it's just that the people making that argument are liars and politicians. ( if that's not too redundant for you ) So, accepting that, and somehow we curb CO2 emissions and restore the planet to it's natural temperature. ( what it would be without us messing with it ) Odds are pretty good it'd be a cold, nasty, climate with mass death and starvation. You know, like a major part of human existence. End rant. BTW, the above hack article missed completely 2 other major issues the Oceans face today. Oil slicks/asphalt balls/islands of sludge, that is a byproduct of shore based pollution and illegal releases from ships. Garbage. Floating islands of plastic slowly, ever so slowly, proving that they are not eternal, but long enough lived to be damn annoying. Gotta clean up our messes. It's the way to be a good neighbor. Plus, enlightened self interest. The darn pace is a ball, remember? The air & water goes all the way around, and it's a thin layer. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2013/10/ready -lethal-autonomous-robot-drones/71492/ We do get into nutjob scenarios on this thread.  A while back, I read in "Air & Space" Smithsonian magazine that a US Air Force General was saying the next generations of drones would have autonomous targeting systems. My thoughts at the time, and now, are that building an unstoppable killing machine has never worked out well in the movies. http://terminator.wikia.com/wiki/HK-Aerial Or from the "computer struck by lightning and goes nuts" file, from "Stealth" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ASW_Fake_FA37_1. jpg Oddly enough, in the real world that just fries them, AFAIK, but it's a common theme since Frankenstein. A local firm is doing the algorithms on the "read your inspection/registration sticker" for police cars that works on the fly. They or someone like them is doing the programming on pattern recognition and giving robots the ability to spot a target autonomously. And with great ability, superhuman even. That's the trend in modern electronics. Where it gets scary is when you turn them loose to hunt down and kill folk by themselves. You may well argue that the fellow sending a drone out to find & strike a target with x characteristics is pulling the trigger just as much as the operator in Virginia pushing the button on the stick to send a Hellfire into a terrorist gathering in Pakistan. I'll leave the ethics aside, for now, and worry about the stupid smart bombs deciding I'm the enemy, when I'm not. (Message edited by aesquire on October 08, 2013) | ||
| S2t_bama |
The problem I envision, is not that the drones/androids/whatever get struck by lightning in order to "turn on us," or become self aware. I think it is far more likely that some guy in a cave with a laptop or in China will hack the things, sending them after us on purpose. If it's the guy in the cave, he doesn't even care if it blows up in his face. He gets his virgins. The hacker scenario seems far more likely, and does not require much suspension of disbelief at all. Bama | ||
| Hootowl |
*Sigh*. Who do we have to kill to stop skynet? I won't puss out like Sarah did. | ||
| Torquehd |
*Sigh*. Who do we have to kill to stop skynet? I won't puss out like Sarah did. and THAT is why women should not be allowed in combat roles. Plus the fact that their bodies are not made to carry 60-100 lbs of kit on their backs like men do every day. not to mention hygiene problems in the field, the need for seperate quarters, sexual temptation, and did I mention generally shoddy tactical decisions? I'm all for skynet. At least with that war, we could openly admit that our enemies are less than human. | ||
| Hootowl |
Careful. Dehumanization is the first step on the path to genocide. Psychopaths, yes, but still human. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Hoot you now totally understand the left and their motivations. Why do you think they have to call you a Terrorist and or stupid. Do not forget they are the people of abortion! Think about all the names they use to describe the unborn any thing but what it is a baby! Remember Planned Parenthood gave Hitler his Ideas on Eugenics Margret Sanger and the NY Social Elites are how that path to hell was started | ||
| Hootowl |
Oh, I'm well aware of the word games the left plays. Abortion isn't murder, it's 'choice', or 'reproductive rights'. It's all about perception, or in this case, delusion. | ||
| Sifo |
Reproductive sounds so much like they are fighting for the right to reproduce. Orwell much? | ||
| Hootowl |
Not related to climate, but perhaps to weather. Even I know not to drain a swimming pool when the ground water is up. http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/10/09/florida-homeo wner-faces-thousands-in-damage-after-pool-rises-fr om-ground/?intcmp=latestnews | ||
| Aesquire |
Long before Skynet, there was....."Colossus: The Forbin Project" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064177/ I certainly don't think that a lightning strike will turn a robot into a self aware killer. That's just a Sci-fi & Horror Cliché from the 19th century. But they plan to build robots to hunt down people, all on their own. Tom Clancy spoke of this, he was pretty wired into the defense community, and he was concerned that they plan to build machines that will actively hunt you down. In practice, you establish/declare a "killbox". An area where it's weapons free on any target. You do your best to NOT have any of your troops in that area, since Blue-on-Blue sucks. One of the worst "friendly fire" incidents in recent history had Apache helicopters get blown out of their killbox by wind while hovering over pretty damn featureless desert. When the Apaches saw a target, they took it out, and then realized they had drifted into an American "held" zone. Friendly fire, isn't. Once you've pulled the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend. Guidance systems fail, GPS can be jammed, and one patch of desert, like one stretch of Ocean, looks pretty much like any other. Even highly varied terrain can get you lost, even with maps. From just over treetop level, the horizon is gone, one ridge above you looks a lot like any other, and in places the GPS sat signal isn't good. ( I know, pre-cheap GPS, I've been lost for a time while below hill level while busy trying to stay up without an engine. With no good place to land in sight. Tree landings suck. ) So I'm not worried about Frankenstein, or Skynet. ( After all, the nice folk at the NSA are most of the way there, now. ) Hackers turning "our" drones against us is a serious possibility, but the #1 worry is how Drone 673c is going to view me. If it has been told to go get the "insurgents" in Killbox Delta Niner, and I'm riding down the road in what the drone believes is Delta Niner. Not so good. Or if I turn down the wrong road while lost, and wander into the killbox......................... This leaves aside any moral issues, or paranoid delusions that a government that has claimed and asserted the power to kill American Citizens at will/whim will actually do so. It's not like they ever abuse their power for their own purposes, right? I'm going to run down to the Veterans Memorial now................ | ||
| Torquehd |
remember that they're "human" when they further infiltrate the US, and begin beheading Americans in their own front yards, for opposing Islam. It will happen. Science, Climate, and muslims are coming. | ||
| Kenm123t |
LOL HOOT a guy at church just did the same thing! I thought the news report may be about him | ||
| Hootowl |
Speaking of autonomous killing machines... http://www.digitaltrends.com/cool-tech/jellyfish-m urdering-robots/ |
