| Author | Message | ||
     Roderick |
I have not had a car payment for nearly 14 yrs. But now I kinda sorta hafta. The candidate is an '05 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited with all the goodies attached to that version, including the Hemi 5.7 and the Quadra Drive II. And yes, I understand the mpg associated with the Hemi. The lady is asking 8750 and I should have no problem getting financing for that, which would include an immediate 2000 payment towards the loan anyway. For an '05, it is borderline good/excel condition, inside and out. Of course, there are the inevitable few minor paint dings on the front from driving, but nothing so obvious, even from just a few ft away. Miles = 135k. The CARFAX report is clean, as much as can be relied upon, and it shows the Jeep dealer performed oil changes and tire rotation every 3-4k miles. She now have a '13 GC Hemi in the driveway and that is why she want to sell the '05. My only concern for this candidate is that the transmission was rebuilt at around 100k. I looked at the work order, from a local transmission shop, and the total bill was about 3k. It included some kind of solenoid assembly (450) and torque converter (450), and the last line on the work order say: REBUILT TRANSMISSION. The shop guaranteed it for 25k miles, which she said has not any issues since then. Prior to this, there was a crankshaft position sensor and a fuel pump change back in '10. I test drove it in stop/go town traffic and on the freeway for a few minutes and could not feel anything unusual. Overall, the Jeep was a good/excel ride. Locally, I could not find any better deal in the V8 '05-06 yrs range, let alone a Hemi V8. I test drove a V6 and it was disappointing. The V6 was just too weak for the size of the GC. I have a '93 I6 Cherokee and am going to keep it until I cannot drive a stick shift any more. Most of the 4.7 V8 in the same yrs range have higher asking prices. Those 4.7s that are comparable to asking price 8750 have similar mpg rating to the Hemi engine. So my questions for all you guys that are way more mechanically experienced than I and hopefully in the specific area of 4x4 transmissions: How good are these rebuilt units in terms of longevity? Despite the mileage is 135k for the vehicle, can I consider the rebuilt transmission as only 35k miles? She did a few 2k lbs towing before the rebuilt, none since then, and she said it was just camping stuff, nothing industrial. This will not be a daily driver for me. If the snow is heavy enough, the '93 Cherokee can handle the job just fine in 4H. This candidate JGC will be for long distance drives, which would be once a month, and I just want a V8 power for this. Once in a while, I will go off road to go target shooting for the day, and may be camp out overnight, then home. Nothing radical. I like the Jeep and the asking price, but I would hate to get it for the deal and have another major transmission problem down the road. She is fine with me taking it to my own mech for inspection, which I will do. But now that I know there was a major transmission work done, should I take it to a dedicated transmission shop and have them look it over? Roderick | ||
| Blackm2 |
Roderick, I have a hard time believing this thing self destructed unless she neglected the maintenance of the tranny, which many do. With such low mileage for a rebuild, chances are she never had the transmission fluid changed. Although these trannys are essentially bullet-proof, they are a Mercedes design and DO require regular service to perform well. They have 2 filters, one in the sump and a screw-on canister for the torque converter just like an oil filter. Think surgical, these transmissions need to run clean. The fluid isn't cheap either, even Wal Marts Super Tech ATF+4 is almost $5 a quart. I have the same mileage on the same transmission, never rebuilt, in my '04 Ram with a hemi. I have every confidence it will do over 300k. But that being said, I don't trust shops. If you can't do it yourself, try to find someone reputable to look it over, to verify that work was done. Most likely that would involve dropping the pan. | ||
| Roderick |
Would the shop that did the rebuild give me the details on what happened? Should they? Am thinking of going there as well as taking the Jeep to a different transmission shop to have them check it over. Am not settled on this one. I just like it because of the deal with the Hemi. But if there are too many uncertainty about this one, I would still be happy with the 4.7 engine. Roderick | ||
| Blackm2 |
Hard to say, they may be cooperative or not. You definitely should give it a shot. I would definitely choose the 5.7 over the 4.7. Especially the earlier versions of that 4.7, they did major improvement in '08. | ||
| Etennuly |
What you really are looking for is a fortune teller. There are no real magical formulas to figure what vehicle or what rebuilds will last how long. About all that can be done to predict how long a vehicle will last is to go on line looking for Jeep forums and ask the question there. If it has been a repeat issue in that model Jeep it will show up there much the way Buell problems are posted here. Having looked there first I can tell you that ANY vehicle can have a failure just after you put your license plate on it. I have personally had major engine issues with two brand new trucks within 600 miles of new. You have a real good perspective on this vehicle, you have met the owner, she seems to have nothing to hide, she has the appearance of the 'little ol' lady' who has a history of getting the proper maintenance and repairs done as needed. Her towing a camper likely was not the cause of the transmission failure, they are made to do towing. Hundreds of parts in there, one fails and messes up the rest. I like that they changed the torque converter and offered a guarantee. It is likely they did a proper flush of the trans cooler system and they felt good about their work. No reason it could not run 200,000 miles like a new one should. I bet you would feel better about it with a warranty of some sort. These are available to people who buy used vehicles from an individual as well as from a dealership. I have even had them offered to me on vehicles that I have impounded. I get their advertisements in the mail a week or two after transferring the title. A word of warning, most of these secondary warranty companies are 'blame game' players. They will take your $700 and do their best to never give any back, they will blame your mother for not lubing the door handles two years ago if an axle bearing fails. This is exactly the same warranty the dealership sells to you  . There will be some good ones out there but that will take some research and likely cost more. With the research you have done I'd say this Jeep is probably a better prospect than one sitting on a dealer's lot where you wish you could have met the previous owner. But then the dealership will prop up your confidence with BS to "guide" you beyond these feelings.....you are taking on this responsibility here. IMHO, at least we have no gain in telling you a bunch of BS to complete a profit making sale. No matter what you buy or where, being wary and having good luck is the best thing you can have in your corner.  In this case if it were me I would buy it. | ||
| Ratbuell |
The 5.7 is a good motor, even though its a little thirsty. I'm in the process of grafting one into my 72 Plymouth satellite. The 4.7 likes to grenade. I'd avoid that engine like the plague. Trans maintenance is key. keep up on it and the trans should outlast the jeep. The TRANSFER CASE is where I'd focus. Make sure there are zero noises. zero shudder. No vibration. Go to sand or gravel and make sure it works. I'm also a jeep guy - 92 yj and a 92 xj, both 4.0 engines (yj is stick, 165k miles, xj auto with 250k). My next...will probably be the '14 diesel grand. None of the gas v8s offer me anything I dont get from my sixes, but a 30mpg diesel....hmmm..... | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Rat, crank rear main seal has given issues on the VM diesels, but it may have been fixed. | ||
| Roderick |
The transmission repair was not on the CARFAX as I guessed because it was not performed by a Jp dealer, as much as the CARFAX report can be a guide. According to her, she preferred to have a Jp dealer but none could take her on short notice and would take several days to fix, so she went with an indy shop. Am going to talk to the shop that did the work and see if I can take the Jp to another shop for inspection. I know that anything can go wrong even with a brand new off the lot vehicle. But at least with that there is the protection of a warranty. This transmission failed after that protection expired. In this, I would like to get opinions and experiences from anyone who have dealt with rebuilt <whatever> in a used vehicle. I can do my own basic maintenance, brakes, rebuild starters and alternators, and even changed a clutch in an old CJ7 by myself with handtools and two floor jacks. But an auto-trans is out of my league. At best, I can drop it and install it. I appreciate her honesty in this as I know many would not reveal something major like a transmission repair. But ultimately, the burden of dealing with anything falls upon me and her honesty would not help me if I am stuck off road or in the snow or on the side of the freeway miles from anywhere. I did looked around the Jeep forums about the 4.7 and it seems there are mixed opinions about it. Many criticized the criticisms of the 4.7 as being from insufficient care for the engine. Many seems to be legitimate technical analyses of the engine. So SHOULD (not would) she take 8k offer if I presented my argument that way considering her Jp have been on sale for nearly 30 days? The retail value is 2k higher according to a local credit union's estimate. I think she must have lowered the asking price at least once because of this. | ||
| Roderick |
I hate going downtown. The pavement sucks and the rail tracks kills my S1... Anyway...Talked to the transmission shop's owner and he remember the Jp. He remembered because it was a particular difficult problem to diagnosed. Shifting from 1 thru 4 was smooth. But from 4th to 5th (OD) and the whole Jp would shake violently. Basically, he could not take it above 40-50 mph. He could even tow a couple thousands lbs from 1st to 4th with equal smoothness as without a load. But no matter what, if he take the speed to where the transmission would begin to engage OD, the Jp would begins to shake. He finally 'shot it down to a ball valve that failed to seat properly when the transmission would begin to engage OD. So on the work order line that said 'REBUILT TRANSMISSION' all the clutch packs were replaced, along with the valve body, and the torque converter. Then anything else inside he could reconditioned, he did. From what it sounds like, there is basically a new transmission for the Jp. Roderick | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
What does your gut feeling tell you? If it feels all kosher pull the trigger before somebody else does, if it feels iffy walk away. If you can get it for well under book price, there's not too much risk for you. If you want a cast iron guarantee, buy new, anything else will be a gamble to a greater or lesser extent. I buy used, but I used to be a mechanic & I'm pretty well equipped in the tools dept. That said, I don't always do the right thing & the last pos that I came unstuck on was (yes you guessed) a Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo. A euro one though with the 2.5 VM diesel. Judging by what you've posted I'd go for it. | ||
| Blackm2 |
I still wouldn't worry too much. Again I say it was poor maintenance, coupled with if she said she did a few 2k pound tows....it was more like half a dozen 2 ton tows. People also tend to tow things without turning the overdrive off, putting it into the "tow/haul" mode. This allows for quicker shifts and more intuitive downshifts when hauling stuff. Oh and a correction to my statement that these are Mercedes designed. They are Chrysler designed. (Message edited by Blackm2 on September 25, 2013) | ||
| Roderick |
Tried to get the lady to deal her Jp down to 8k but no joy. She dropped only 200. After interviewing about a dozen candidates, I settled on a black '07 Grand Cherokee Rocky Mountain Edition with the QD II 4WD system. No Hemi. Just the 4.7 V8. Have 88k on the odo. Agreed price is just under 11k. Overall, the exterior is in good shape with the usual small front paint dings. Interior is excellent. All fluids normal. Everything works, radio, cruise control, etc. On Monday, am going to take the Jp to an alignment place where they supposedly put a laser on the frame. I do not want a vehicle that points its nose slightly off while on the road. Seen too much of that from lifted trucks and repaired vehicles from collisions. Roderick |
