| Author | Message | ||
     Kilroy |
Anyone here replace their car or truck's belt driven radiator fan with an aftermarket electric one? Looking for tips and recommendations - looking to do this to my wifes SUV. This is a grocery getter - not a rock crawler so I don't need to go too wild. Just something that turns on and off when its supposed to. Thanks in advance- Kilroy | ||
| Ratbuell |
Its easy. Most come with a temp sensor you place near the thermostat. Wire it and a relay and mount it with zip tie type straps to the radiator. Make sure you know if its a push or a pull, and mount it on the correct side of the radiator. Damhik. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Kenlowe. http://www.kenlowe.com/fans/consumers/fans02.html | ||
| Orman1649 |
I did this to one of my old trucks. The temp sensor grounds the coil of a relay which turns on my fan. I also have an indicator in the dash to tell me when it is on and a switch to turn it on just in case the temp sensor or relay fails. | ||
| Hootowl |
I've done this in my truck as well. The only down side I've found is that strapping the fans directly to the radiator does away with the shroud. A fan and shroud setup blows air across the entire radiator, not just the circle where the fans(s) is(are). If you can find a fan with a shroud for your model year, I suggest that you use that. In theory, your mileage and water pump service life will improve. | ||
| Azxb9r |
If you are going to do this , make sure you get one that moves enough air to cool the engine properly. If the engine is stock it should not be too much of a problem, but some of the aftermarket fans just dont move enough air. | ||
| Kenm123t |
why? | ||
| Etennuly |
I did this electric fan set up in my Jeep a few years back. I run a small block Chevy 400 with a 4 row copper/brass radiator made to fit the Jeep body. It is set up for high torque at low rpms. I ran two fans, one pushing and one pulling, staggered to cover the radiator better and shrouded the dead areas as well as was possible. I set them up with a manual switch through a relay for each fan. It never quite cooled the engine as well as the belt driven clutch fan. The best thing about it in the Jeep was that I could turn it off in deep water and mud to keep from blowing crap all over. The biggest draw back for my use was if I had any kind of battery related failure, like a dead alternator, or an upside down, or lights left on, weakened battery, I could not cool the engine to make it home in limp mode. I have gone back to a belt fan and the Jeep's engine is happier all around. Shrouding is everything. Like it has been said, buy one set up with a fitted shroud, the aftermarket fans that mount through the cooling tubes with zip ties are not a long term answer, mine damaged the tubes after a couple of years of hanging on them. Maybe you could measure your radiator and room for fit then peruse a salvage yard for a good used factory fan set up that is mounted in a shroud. | ||
| Aesquire |
The 2 main reasons for electric cooling fans are...... Less hp lost to turning a belt driven fan all the time. A common performance and efficiency modification. Can save a surprising amount of fuel. Off road, when you hit water deeper than the fan blades, you can bend the fan, wreck the radiator, even throw a blade and vibrate damage a LOT of stuff. Being able to shut off the fan as you cross a creek is a very good thing. A shrouded model that covers the maximum amount of radiator surface with airflow works great. little ones that zip tie to the radiator, does not. all advice above looks sane. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Its a grocery getter guys I know why for special apps and low speed I am a engineer and my dad was nearly 60 year Ford guy Why re package a grocery getter cooling fan system? I know where he lives he has oh about a 50Ft mountain to climb in hot weather. | ||
| Froggy |
Because the original was engineered by a retard. I recently found out some retard did the same with my truck, I will be swapping the fan out to help improve the fuel economy. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Froggy It s about time you grow up if you had 10 % of your arrogance in engineering ability you would go far in life. I asked Tom why he needed to change the fan arrangement. I see him time to time he lives near another Off line Buell owner I am pretty sure he has a reason for the electric fan I was enquiring what the reason was. Speaking to the issue with your truck I suspect the retard is behind the wheel. | ||
| Aesquire |
I learned long ago that a "hopped up" engine with cam timing & intake lengths appropriate for the rpms actually used got far better mileage than stock. Nearly every Van I ever owned ended up with headers and intake manifold changes. ( in part because headers & a whole exhaust system were cheaper than replacing the "Y" pipe ) Every one got better mileage after. Why didn't the factory do the same? Mostly cost. Partly because it's harder to control emissions with a higher performance engine, since fuel burned = horsepower, and a better flowing engine has a broader range of fuel needs. At idle, it's going to burn slightly less than stock, at full throttle, quite a bit more. One of the more spectacular changes was with a '77 Dodge Maxivan with a 360. Headers, and a friend with attitude and some skills, who polished, ported and port matched a 2bbl Carter carb and stock manifold. An insane amount of work for anything but a hobbyist trying to prove a point, but I got over 20mpg highway out of that giant loaf of bread. I had the advantage of zero pollution gear ( 6100 gvw ) and a 2.71 rear end. Not a good drag racer. I could do a whole historical rant on mileage, but in short higher manifold pressure and lower rpm is the key. ( assuming equal fuel mixing and distribution ) Today, making any change to the pollution control system is a legal issue, and modern cars are far closer to their maximum potential than the past. Doing an external mod, like the cooling fan, or underdrive accessory pulleys, is relatively cheap, pretty easy, and gets a better bang for the buck than a whole truck full of bogus mileage booster toys, like bent sheet metal swirlers, magnets for fuel tanks & lines, or electrolysis rigs that put "brown's gas" into the intake. Is a $100-200 fan going to pay for itself? It's hard to tell. Most mileage gains for any modification made on a car are actually from the "placebo" effect, where the driver pays more attention for a while to driving style & mileage. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Vern your running pretty close to the load threshold we do when running a 1800 rpm generator Your radiator is too small and your air flow is to low as well. The radiator for a 80 kw generator would be a good choice with out going to BEcool and having custom made. They are copper brass with side mounting flanges. It will be about twice as big as what you have now in face area and you will need close to 15hp to drive electric fans at full load. I would use a belt drive fan with an electric clutch to switch it in and out. and toggle for water crossings. Problem is a small block mounts the fan on the water pump. Hinos etc have a separate fan bearing and pulley. could be done. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Aes we run under drives to keep the alt water pump etc from over running at sustained hi rpms Water pumps can be wild when they blow up the plastic radiator tanks by running up the pump curve. But your right any more the casting and machining is very good now most of the gains are Engine calibration. Trucks have plenty of room for air boxes and exhaust and can meet the sound and epa regs better than cars for a specific HP | ||
| Ourdee |
Rock crawling..... I ran an aluminum radiator with a flex fan when I put a 360 in my CJ5. | ||
| Kilroy |
I'm just looking for some supplemental cooling. Coolant temp tends to rise at long periods of idle with car at standstill. I figure an electric fan (with shroud) will move more air at idle than the mechanical fan. | ||
| Kenm123t |
does it have a clutch fan if so its probably failing. and or the thermostat is going bad What kind of car | ||
| Kilroy |
Nissn xterra. clutch is fine, tstat is fine. These are apparently notorious for this issue as the cooling system slightly degrades due to age. No margin built in, explained off as weight savings or cost savings. My american pickup could probably run with half the coolant gone, half the oil gone, half the trans fluid gone and not have any issues, unlike the foreign makes. | ||
| Etennuly |
Kilroy, I have fixed the problem you are having many times in my body shop. Aluminum or copper/bronze radiators will build up with corrosion and crap inside the capillary cooling tubes making them less efficient at transferring heat as well as restricting coolant flow. Removing the radiator and then one of it's tanks will allow for 'rodding' the tubes and a truly complete flush of the cooling system. It seems like it is a lot of work, but compared to changing the fan system it is not that big of a deal. It probably would not take any more time and could even cost less. If you find that the tubes leak after the cleaning process, then what you have found is that replacing the radiator was necessary anyways. No matter what fans you put on it, the radiator won't cool it if it is the point of what is failing. | ||
| Kilroy |
Thanks Vern - Vehicle has about 93k miles. At 110k, i need to replace the timing belt. This is the point most xterra owners replace water pump, since it has to come off first to get the timing belt cover off. Since I will need to take the radiator out also, I will also just replace it at that time. I will put in a 3 pass in place of the single pass POS that comes stock on it. What I have decided to do is add a pusher in front of the condenser and leave the mechanical one in place. Wire the pusher to come on when the AC comes on. Simpler, and quicker and I will get the extra air flow when I need it. That will be all I need to coast to the 110k milestone when all new parts go on - | ||
| Kenm123t |
Vern nailed it and your right some systems are marginal in so fla | ||
| Etennuly |
You are welcome. I see you are looking for a temporary "get you there" fix. I would probably just go ahead and do the timing belt early and get the fixing done if my plan was to keep the vehicle into the next decade. Given that, I would certainly not even bother with the electric fan in the case of replacing the radiator with a three row unit. It will be wasted over kill. If you have a 200F thermostat for the clutch fan and a 215F for the electric one I doubt that it would ever come on even sitting in a drive through line with the AC on Max. One thing that is hard to get through to customers about a weak AC system on a 100,000 mile vehicle, is that the cooling system needs to me attended first. I wish you well with this project  . It should last a much longer time than the original stuff did. | ||
| Aesquire |
I think Kilroy has the best idea. I approve. ( looks like everyone but me gave good advice ) Falls under the wise category of "moderate hop up for performance & reliability." Reading this and the "airbag" thread points out to me that modern cars are much closer to the limits of technology than, perhaps, is wise. The Computers that run everything are one thing. I'm still aghast at the bad engineering/bleeding edge tech that is a "bricked" Fiskar. ( as I curse my way through an SSD install on my living room PC  ) Making stuff lighter, and just enough, is part of the quest for mileage and performance. That leaves far less margin for age & error. I had a '79 Dodge van that ran great, until one day on the Expressway it began to overheat and we had all the fins falling off and stringing through the fan, being shredded all over the road. It's funny now. | ||
| Kenm123t |
I would love to take a bricked Tesla and put a 3.5 ECO boost Ford V6 in it. Car has great looks and stance one passes me 2-3 times a week on his way to work in PB. I talked to him one day and he said if he is stuck in traffic coming over the center bridge he turns off the Ac radio etc to make it into the office. So no side trips on the way home or to work. | ||
| Aesquire |
Jay Leno has a couple of electric cars. He did a great editorial on them. Now, forgive me If I get the dates and names mixed up, but he had a 1906 electric and a 2006 Chevy Electric. 100 years difference, and the new one goes 5 miles more per charge. The Old one uses Iron Acid Edison cells, which can be rebuilt indefinitely, and the car is easy to work on. The new one is sealed and impossible to repair. His complaint was that although he loved the new one, he simply could not go to a party and let someone try it out, or he wouldn't be able to get home. He wanted to, he's a big car nut, and he loves showing them off, but the range limits are too severe. Now, me, I want the big VW diesel out of the Porche Cayenne for my imaginary Bricked Tesla. ( Or if anyone wants to give me a Cayenne, or a Touareg, I'd groove on the 400 ft. lbs. of torque, but just can't bring myself to buy a car that costs more than I make..... ) | ||
| Kenm123t |
the 3.5 has 420 ft lbs @ 2400 | ||
| Doubled |
the 3.5 has 420 ft lbs @ 2400 And that's before you open up the exhaust. Many of the exhaust manufacturers are claiming huge gains with a cat back system, on the order of 40 hp and 40 lb-ft. Unfortunately, I don't wanna sound like a rice rocket going down the road so I'm going to leave mine stock. It still has plenty of power though. The other day I got the tail to wag mashing the gas at 40 mph on slightly damp roads.  |
