| Author | Message | ||
     Aesquire |
The Uzi is actually a refinement of a Czech design. The bolt actually wraps around the barrel allowing it to be much shorter. Not knocking Uziel Gal at all, most stuff people invent is a modification or improvement on something else, and the genius of building a bottle opener into the Galil is breathtaking. Sten guns are so easy to make you'd fail a gunsmith course if you submitted one as a project. Only a few machined parts. The Poles made them in factories right under the noses of the Germans, they used hydraulic tubing and actually stamped the guns with english markings so the Germans wouldn't know they were home made. My personal choice for a 9mm carbine is a H&K semi auto MP5 variant. I don't think ( my opinion ) that you can count any full auto gun as a "one gun". After the fall of civilization, you probably will pick up assorted tools for survival, from zombie cleared APCs etc. THAT's when you can consider a M249 or an abandoned National Guard M60. But for walking away from the fire that is the LA basin after the meteor strike, or the flood that wrecks your town, you probably want something a bit easier to carry. | ||
| Rick_a |
An M249 or M60 is more gun than is needed for most any purpose. A bit too heavy, not accurate enough for precision shooting, and a general waste of ammunition. I'd take a lightweight semi-auto in an intermediate to medium caliber. For a pure survival gun I kinda like the old Springfield M6. Too bad the prices are a bit ridiculous.  | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I have heard that with a bit of tube finagalling you can get a .50 cal BMG to fire out of a single barrel shotty, that with the shims for the other calibers, and a single shotty might be the 'one' gun , one shot solution.... cus you only get ONE shot ! I really like the three gun solution set distance 30/06 close 12 gauge personal 357/38 and I figure if all hell comes to past high water - then screw the 'rules' | ||
| Aesquire |
I'd like to see that, from about 200 yards. Better yet, send the video, and cut the messy parts. The .50BMG operates at a MUCH higher pressure than a 12 ga. 3 1/2 magnum, I suppose that a properly machined barrel sleeve could be made, but there isn't enough room to make me happy about the pressure. Let's see.... Assume a break action single shot.... Rossi, NEF, etc. so we can insert the sleeve in the bore. Assume we take into account any choke, and machine precisely enough, ( no sweat, I've been a Model Lathe Operator working on Ti and harder alloys ) What are the numbers? 50 BMG base dia. .804 12 ga. base dia. .812 50 BMG bullet dia. .510 !2 ga bore dia. .775 I might buy that an 1/8 in. thick barrel sleeve with minimal rifling would work, And I know the NEF shotguns are pretty strong, but there's no reinforcement of the chamber at the base of the .50 BMG and for much of the body length. Might work, don't do it near me. Have the survivors send video. They DO make a variety of inserts for shotguns to fire bullets and Briley makes sub-gauge converters to fire , say, .410 in a 12 ga. http://www.mcace.com/shotguninserts.htm Someone on Badweb posted a video of one make of these, but, as I said, .50 BMG scares me. I have a shooting buddy with an AR-50 that won't shoot at less than 200 yards after he sighted it in, after seeing a video of a guy hit by a ricochet that bounces off the Dirt in front of him and takes off his ear muffs. Stupid Human tricks. | ||
| Rick_a |
Having had a couple 50 BMG single shots, and seeing how much material is around those bores and especially chambers, I'd like to watch that (from a safe distance, and behind cover). People have built low pressure 50 cal rounds to fire out of such shotguns, but that's a completely different animal. | ||
| Aesquire |
City, The 30-06 works fine at close range too. You can skip the shotgun and save 8-10 lbs. A rifle works at any range you can reliably hit the target, and you have to aim to do so. A shotgun is close to medium, with, say, buckshot, and you have to aim to do so. Slugs take it out over 100 yards, and how far is up to gun, sights, and shooter who can deal with the rainbow arc. In close quarters, a shotgun must be aimed. Period. The pattern even with a cylinder bore at in house ranges is a handful of inches at best. The idea that a shotgun magically fills the alley with death is silly, and ignorant. Really, pace out the biggest distance in your house from a likely defensive position, bedroom door, closet, whatever. Then set up big piece of paper and shoot it at that distance. You might be surprised. http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3_2.htm An appreciation of penetration issues is needed with any fire arm capable of doing more than irritating someone. A Daisy Red Rider could, it is well known, put someones eye out, and it's even possible to bury a BB in someones epidermis. And golly gee, that hurts! It also won't go through a typical sheetrock wall. Darn near everything else we've discussed here, and for durn sure a 30-06, is going to pass though at least one wall and possibly entire houses, so any home defense, or shooting in town/houses requires a responsible shooter to be aware of the issue. ( And if a .50 BMG is your one gun, I start doing genitalia jokes ) Not saying I don't like the shotgun, Either can do the job fine. Which 30-06 would you chose? | ||
| Cityxslicker |
would love a M1903A1 'likes' the Remi 750 in wood *(so it is less scary) on the hunt for a 742 and mags - but they are hard to come by here. | ||
| 01x1buell |
ill stick with my ak47 with a bayonet on the end, not the best long distance shooter but damn good stopping power and reliable as hell, cheap ammo also. | ||
| Ninefortheroad |
It is hard to beat a SKS with plenty of stripper clips in a ChiComm vest! They just run and run and run.... | ||
| Gregtonn |
Which 30-06 would you chose? Mine is a Browning M78. It has served me well, out to 600 yards. G | ||
| Just_ziptab |
30-06? Made mine the BAR | ||
| Just_ziptab |
This will make you drool.More powder and bullets than I have ever seen in one store for a long time. Recently filmed?? | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/bigbore/189 5SBL.asp Marlin 1895SBL The end result of years of improvement in a big bore guide gun. Handy, customizable with the scope rail, accurate, and powerful enough for all North American game, including automobiles. Downsides are mass and a cartridge once a US Army standard, but now less common than 30-06 or .308 the .45-70 ( former .45 Govt. ) has a bit of a rainbow trajectory, but with decent ranging tools or skills, can still connect out further than you'd think. The Marlin will handle much more power than a Trapdoor Springfield, and Hornady LeverRevolution ammo gives a bit of edge at longer range. And you can handload that century plus old cartridge with black powder or triple 7 with cast bullets, and still whack steel far beyond rational range. It was designed as a black powder cartridge, and worked fine, after all, it's a Buffalo gun round. I admit, not so good for rabbits, they tend to pink mist. I'd suggest a scope with QD rings. | ||
| Phelan |
I'll stay in the caves and shoot a Raging Judge revolver  . | ||
| Macbuell |
That marlin reminded me of the Ruger Scout Rifle which might be a decent choice for a does everything rifle. | ||
| Aesquire |
I do like the ability to have both conventional and forward mounted optics. Both work, matter of preference. The "Scout" concept, the latest being the Ruger Gunsite Scout, the older Ruger Frontier, the Savage Scout, countless homebuilts, and the Steyr Scout ( a VERY nice package with built in bipod and mag holders, developed with Col. Cooper ) were designed to answer the "one gun" question. A certain handy length and weight, a caliber capable of stopping critters up to 200 kilos, and the option for a long eye relief scope, etc. All part of the wish list. The Ruger Gunsite Scout does a darn good job, but isn't perfect... but nothing is. If you haven't tried a forward mounted scope on a long arm, I suggest you try it. Not for everyone, eyes are different. http://www.gunsandammo.com/2011/11/15/the-8-best-g uns-for-zombie-killing/ Nothing on this list I hate. http://www.gunsandammo.com/2012/03/27/8-must-have- guns-for-the-doomsday-prepper/ ditto. http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/10FCMSCOU T http://www.steyrscout.org/general.htm http://www.gunblast.com/Ruger-Gunsite.htm http://www.gunblast.com/Leupold-Custom4570.htm | ||
| Rick_a |
The BAR is monstrous and heavy by modern standards. Great for it's time. Well obsoleted now. | ||
| Ninefortheroad |
http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/11HOGHUNT ER Bargain buyers' tactical in 223 or 308 (my choice) | ||
| Aesquire |
Nice. Savages have a real good rep for accuracy, and the threaded barrel allows for ear protection in free states. 10/22 bullpup stock. http://www.redjacketfirearms.com/index.php?page=sh op.product_details&product_id=67&option=com_virtue mart&Itemid=2 A review. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vE_7L96xi-I looks like a nice accessory. Wish they still made the Ruger Carbine in 44. Mag. | ||
| Rick_a |
I hate clamshell style 10/22 stocks...especially the bullpups. It will lose some accuracy due to the receiver not being anchored down as well, the trigger will be terrible due to additional linkages and return spring, the balance is terrible and the ergonomics aren't as good. This is more my style:  | ||
| 99savage |
Been reading this most days, some interesting thoughts - and - some dumb ones, a long gun in a pistol caliber, really now.. General foraging would still go w/ the Stevens 22/410 stack barrel. If the scenarios to prepare for included possibility of armed attacks by hostile individuals in unforeseeable circumstances have now decided on a military bolt action. Springfield, Mauser, Lee-Enfield, Nagat, all great guns, reliable as rocks, in very effective calibers. Personal choice would be Springfield; 30-06 available anyplace (and already have the dies), terrific trigger pull | ||
| Rick_a |
Just to show that I do mean what I say...  My 16" AR sure feels cumbersome now...  | ||
| Aesquire |
Registered as a pistol, right? Hmmm. You may have a convert here. I can see the utility and appeal. Parts list? Like the Ruger 10/22 also. | ||
| Rick_a |
Not exactly. It has to be purchased as a complete pistol, built from a virgin stripped lower, or from an assembled lower that has not been configured with an upper as a stocked rifle. An AR complete pistol is sold as a "handgun." A complete lower or stripped receiver are sold as "other" and can be assembled as a pistol, rifle, or firearm. If assembled as a rifle first, it can not be configured as a pistol. Additionally, a vertical forward grip can only be used if the overall length is 26" or over to the end of the barrel or permanently installed muzzle device. Doing so constitutes a "firearm." Configured as such it cannot be concealed on the person as that would make it an unregistered Any Other Weapon. Angled forward grips are ok regardless. A carbine extension tube can only be used if a spare stock is not readily accessible. Cheek risers and stock saddles are ok as are foam covers, rubber end caps, and furniture/cane tips. My build is: • M&A parts 16" 1/9 heavy barrel upper cut/threaded/port work by Adco • PWS FSC comp • Del-Ton lower • Geissele SSA trigger • KNS anti-rotation pins • Centurion C4 cut out rail • Ergo rail covers • H2 buffer • Leupold Prismatic scope • Viridian CTL light • Troy BUS • ITC Railrest • RRA lower parts kit • Bushmaster commercial diameter receiver extension • McFarland gas ring • Extractor O-ring upgrade • Accu-Wedge • Generic 1-1/8" rubber furniture tip from the hardware store It ended up at 28-3/8" overall length and 7lbs 6oz. For comparison my 16" heavy barrel rifle is 35-7/8" and 10.5lbs. Anyway, I love it and once I can test fire it and break it in properly it's going to be my primary home defense gun. I can't believe we used to clear rooms with an M16A2. This is much handier. Always adhere to state and local laws! | ||
| Aesquire |
Very nice. I will consider one a bit like that. I suggest a Hogue pistol grip. The latest Shooting Illustrated had an article that touched on this threads question. The Author acknowledged that if he was at home, he would have a selection of weapons and tools. In the "head for the hills" or "urban survivor" scenarios he favored the .45 ACP. 1911, certainly, but also revolvers, both the S&W DA and the Ruger Blackhawk convertible to take .45 ACP & .45 Colt. ( also modified for .45 Auto Rim. ) While the SA revolver has a much slower reload speed, it also is easier to top off than a DA revolver using Moon clips. The revolvers offered the advantage of not tossing empty cases around, making them better if you reload ammo. ( a must for end of the... scenarios..... AND a big plus in not leaving evidence around in Big Brother or Red Dawn scenarios. ) Some other views. http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/28115 /the-great-shotgun-debate/ http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/26716 /gone-in-90-seconds/ http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/14321 /are-you-prepared-to-survive-a-disaster/ http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/6626/ pistol-caliber-carbines/ Also, don't discount the 20ga. http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/27988 /the-mighty-20-gauge/ Winchester used to make a home defense (Defender) version of their Speed Pump in 20 ga. known as the Lady Defender. I had one for a while, and it was faster, lighter and easier on the body than a 12 ga. using full power loads & slugs. You needed a plug to reduce capacity to be legal for hunting, most places, ( a dowel worked fine ) but it was a fine deer gun, and I assure you the Buck couldn't tell the bore while he was being dressed. In the real world, the difference between a 3/4 oz. slug and one at 1 oz. is actually tiny. Both leave a largish hole as they exit. Buckshot of a given size at the same speed go as deep and do as well. The 12 ga. just has a few more. If you aim and hit, the 20 ga. will do the job. ( Hey! Joe! Mr. Veep! you HAVE TO AIM A SHOTGUN! ) | ||
| Rick_a |
The Hogue grip is the one grip I can't stand on an AR. | ||
| Aesquire |
Taste is taste. Fit is fit. The "best there is" is not for you if it doesn't fit you. | ||
| Rick_a |
The Ergo grip, Troy Enhanced CQB, and the standard A2 are my favorites. | ||
| Nukeblue |
this caught my eye... 22mag over 410. that would be cool http://savagearms.com/firearms/model/Model42 | ||
| Aesquire |
Once upon a time, I had a Stevens ( Savage, now ) 20ga./.22LR Worked fine. They also had other variations, including 12 ga./.223. Of course, back half a century ago, guns were made of metal and WOOD! ( the change from wood to plastic is the only change in weapons in the last 100 years, other than details and frills. ) I suppose you could argue that precision machining has replaced some hand fitting, especially in the manufacture of 1911's ( over a hundred years old ) and 1873 SAA clones. ( USA Firearms uses a high speed cutter system that eliminates the need for a lot of hand polishing ) |
