| Author | Message | ||
     Whistler |
I have been flying commercially since 1971 and have racked up a couple of million air miles, most of these after 1980. I remember the days of zero visible security, much less a TSA, and I remember when, how, and why security inched its way into the system. Of course "security" is fully ingrained into the process now and has been for some time. Why the thread? I have felt this way for a good while but after more air travel this last weekend I no longer imagine the TSA screening process is primarily in place for our air travel safety. Security checkpoint requirements have not lessened, they remain the same or have increased. I believe TSA and the process remains in place as a pinch point to continue to teach the flying public to submit to identification verification and personal searches. Any random catches are just good TSA sales points. What a tremendous amount of money and time spent on this endeavor. Our government must think it worthwhile to use these resources with such little restraint. That said, what's next I wonder. I mean the title Transportation Security Administration covers a lot of ground. Whatever it is, no problem, easy peasy, we're well trained. Or maybe I'm just tired and cranky today. I realize the Bad Web has been down this road before but what do you think of our current transportation security measures? | ||
| Rwven |
It's why I've sworn off flying. I haven't been on a plane in over 2 years and I have no intentions of getting on one again until the TSA is abandoned. | ||
| Sparky |
No such silliness riding Amtrak if you've got the time to relax and enjoy the trip. I've chosen this method going from LA to Seattle several times recently to visit family. Love the scenery along the Pacific Coast and thru the forested mountains. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
What's next you ask? The tinfoil-hat side of me foresees this useless agency creeping out the jurisdiction over other modes of transportation. I hear it's already started with rail travel in some areas. Remember: It's for your own good, citizen! Do EXACTLY what they tell you to do and you'll remain "free". | ||
| Sifo |
http://www.naturalnews.com/032778_TSA_groping.html TSA coming to all forms of transportation. I used to travel 2-3 times per year by air. Haven't at all for about 6 years now. It's just gotten more invasive that I want to put up with. I wouldn't mind so much if I could see benefit, but it just doesn't seem to be there. When the underwear bomber failed to detonate, solely because of the incompetents of the terrorists, Janet Napolitano actually said "the system worked". The only thing that worked to protect lives is that there may have been fewer people on board that plane because they chose not to get a holiday groping from government employees. Add to that the number of times that testing has been done and guns go right by the screeners, or a gun is found in a carry on that has been through other airports earlier that day. I just don't have confidence that they are up to the task of making us safe. Then of course we need to strip search a 4 year old traveling with her grandmother just to ensure that we don't profile those who would actually do us harm. Government knows no bounds when it comes to grabbing power. If people wish to be free the must be ever vigilant to stand up against government overreach. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
Its embarrassing as an American that our laws are so backwards. Grope and X-ray men , women and children that fly but look the other way at those who sneak into our country. I have no doubt these checkpoints will ease more and more into our neighborhoods if we keep electing the schmucks who profit from it or think its a good idea. | ||
| Stirz007 |
I definitely avoid air travel much more these days.... Last time through, I got busted for having a lighter in my carry-on. After passing through TSA, I immediately bought another at the gift shop before boarding.... Much safer with TSA on board  | ||
| Strokizator |
I carry a 4" crescent wrench on my key ring and TSA wouldn't let me board the plane with it. Were they worried I would disassemble the plane while in flight? I watched one of my favorite movies this weekend, Bullett. The airport scene circa 1968 is hilarious. The govt's negligence where people's safety was concerned was disturbing. | ||
| Teeps |
Could this be the answer? http://techyum.com/2011/08/the-45-liberator-replic a-a-pricey-piece-of-budget-history/ | ||
| Teeps |
Could this be the answer? http://techyum.com/2011/08/the-45-liberator-replic a-a-pricey-piece-of-budget-history/ | ||
| Teeps |
Could this be the answer? http://techyum.com/2011/08/the-45-liberator-replic a-a-pricey-piece-of-budget-history/ | ||
| Aesquire |
No. That's not the answer. See Clint Eastwood's "In the Line Of Fire". As an item in a collection of historical weapons, that Liberator IS a pretty cool thing. There is little documentation that they had much use, but as a tool for taking a real gun away from a Nazi occupying your country, but the concept sure beats using a rock. Since they were made so cheap, and given away, mostly in France, very few survive, and even fewer have been test fired in the last 50 years. ( Read a review recently..... It works, has no accuracy, hurts like heck to shoot, may harm a higher percentage of users than targets. ) But as an item in a WW2 collection, a Resistance collection, or a stupid weapons collection, having such a replica is quite groovy. hmm, stupid weapons collection.... Hat guns, Chest guns, shoe guns, It's amazing the side roads technology has taken from the first hand cannons to the laser sighted polymer defense guns of the 21st century. Most of the really stupid stuff predates John Moses Browning. ( possibly because people started writing laws about guns after the slaves were freed in the US and the Party of the Klan didn't like the uppity ones shooting back during lynchings... ask Condi Rice ) On the subject. I feel that the Dept of Fatherland Security was a horrible idea, and the current leadership, though physically closely resembling H. Goering, is ideologically a bit more like R. Heydrich, seems to me.  The TSA is crippled by political Correctness to the point they can't do the job properly, and part of that is the need to "fairly, randomly" pick 6 year old girls and feel them up. If they don't do it randomly, they offend certain protected groups. Like Islamic terrorists. I can actually see the logic here...but I don't agree that being deliberately stupid is a good thing. I also see the logic in sticking a fork in every outlet in the house to see if you get different results each time. I hope I've outgrown that level of dumb, but won't bet on it. The TSA sure doesn't stop terrorists. If it's purpose is to condition us to the New Way Of Doing Things, ( just like the Old way, see "show us your papers" in any WW2 movie ) then yeah, we have a problem. I'm just not sure that the people who organize these things are that smart. Perhaps we should seek for the incompetence before the evil....in this case. Unless you are a prime terrorist suspect type. ( Per Big Sis ) American, male, veteran, literate, patriotic, and not an Obama supporter. ( it WILL pi44 me off if in a few years I can say the same thing about the new, current president. ) | ||
| Pwnzor |
This is on the wall at Fort Sumter in South Carolina, where the War of Northern Aggression began: | ||
| Paint_shaker |
I pretty much only fly when I leave the ConUS. But I do remember the days of showing up less than an hour prior to flight departure and catching a domestic flight. TSA, like a cheap lock on a gate, provides a false sense of security to the massess. Thus we are now prisoners of our own system... (Message edited by Paint shaker on June 26, 2012) | ||
| 86129squids |
Interesting- they had an interview with a guy on NPR's "Fresh Air" today that covered the history of airline safety, especially how things have ended up in modern times... Although I kept my attention divided between the 'puter here and the radio, I heard enough to be skeered more than a bit at the methods airlines use to cut costs AND most everything else of value or importance. Yeesh!  | ||
| Aesquire |
You know you can't smoke a cigarette, pipe or cigar on a US carrier? You Know why every airline went along with this regulation, willingly, quickly, and without protest? It let them turn the Air conditioner down, a lot. Modern Commercial Passenger Transport planes are pressurized. ( for the most part ) The pressurization system has 2 main parts. ( this is the simplified version...) 1. The pump/bleed air system on the engines. That pumps air into the cabin. 2. The exhaust valves, usually near the rear of the passenger cabin. Large planes have multiple exhaust valve locations, and every American Built Plane has redundant exhaust valves, often with different programming or design. That's in case there is a design or software problem that hasn't come up before. If one fails the other will do the job. ( not so much on some Airbus's ) The exhaust valves determine the pressure in the plane. If they open too far/long/early it gets thin and hard to breath. ( at 30,000 feet, it's too thin for Humans to live ) If it fails to open, the cabin will rip open...then it gets thin and hard to breath. The pump/bleed air system's setting determines the air FLOW through the cabin. Turn it down, and the air still gets pressurized. ( off, and, yep, it doesn't ) It also saves fuel to turn the pump down. Lots of fuel. Back in the dark ages, the airflow through an airliner cabin was designed, and adjusted by customer feedback, to get rid of the nasty stinks from passengers and smokers. Once they banned smoking on planes, every airline turned down the FLOW, but not, of course, the pressure. ( there are rules for that, so that cheapskates don't kill the passengers to save money. And they would. ) Today, the pumps are adjusted to just not quite kill you, and save as much fuel as possible. It's like being in a mine shaft. Each person uses up some of the oxygen. The actual levels are..... restricted. ( but some people have blood oxygen monitors.....  ) The air on a modern airliner is barely changed enough to keep you alive. Barely. It's freaking toxic. I know stews that gather at the smoking area outside airports to get fresh air. After hours in a stinky, CO2 laden flying bus, the Smokers cove is refreshing. Remind me to tell you about the Blue Ice. | ||
| Baf |
Putting aside the liberty issues with the TSA, there is also an enormous cost issue. How much have we wasted on the behemoth over the past 10 years? Not to discredit or take away from those who died on 9/11, but air travel is pretty damn safe. Take all the deaths on 9/11... WAY less than the number of people who die from drunk driving on the roads in one year. Now, how much have we spent on air "security" vs stopping drunk driving? How much has the TSA actually stopped? It's all fearmongering. Terrorists have won this battle... their goal is to terrorize, and everyone is so afraid of airplane hijackings that they subject themselves to the TSA, when we'd be just as safe without them. There have been a handful of attempted shenanigans on planes. TSA stopped none of them, they were all thwarted by passengers on the plane. The TSA is way too reactive, and not proactive at all - it is totally ineffective. I wonder how many people are going to be affected by cancer due in part to the new body scanners. They claim they're safe, but there is plenty of controversy over that. | ||
| Stirz007 |
Remind me to tell you about the Blue Ice.  (Message edited by stirz007 on June 27, 2012) | ||
| Aesquire |
I wonder how many people are going to be affected by cancer due in part to the new body scanners. They claim they're safe,..... Since the nice drone at the gate doesn't know how many rads the thing gives off, I won't go though it. I've had enough rads. The Plane Ride is going to give me more. I don't think the TSA supervisor has a clue what Cherenkov Radiation is. ( It's a pretty blue! ) OTOH, If I close my eyes and moan "Angelina" while they grope me, it's way more fun. | ||
| Danger_dave |
10 years of regular airport and cattle class crapola and I'm over it too. I'm like 'Just let me know where I can pick up the bike' now. | ||
| Whistler |
Off to the airport again tomorrow. Here's the drill. 1. After parking truck remove ID from wallet and put in pocket along with boarding pass. Then take keys, wallet, cash, and watch and secure in carry on bag. 2. Wait in line for ID check. Show ID and boarding pass. I will be asked who's name is on the ID. Should be mine so I'll answer with my name. 3. Next is the body/bag check. Wait in one of 2-3 lines for a yet to be determined amount of time. Note to self, whatever line you choose, no matter the length, that line will take the greatest amount of time to process. 4. Arrive at table leading to bag check device. Take off boots and belt, place in plastic container. Remove laptop and personal toiletry items (already kept in a small clear plastic zip lock bag and all items are of the proper size) Place laptop in a plastic container by itself and place plastic bag in plastic container with boots and belt. Make certain both plastic containers and carry on bag get into the x-ray device. Wait in line to go into body scanner. Check pockets to be certain they are empty. Walk into scanner when ordered. Give TSA agent boarding pass. Keep ID in hand and place feet on the yellow foot prints. Raise arms overhead with palms open and facing outward. Walk out of scanner when instructed. Answer some inane question one of the guards will ask. Remember not to be a smart ass. Retrieve boarding pass, boots, carry on bag, laptop, belt, and plastic bag. Carry to an open bench. 5. Place laptop and plastic bag in carry on. Put on belt and boots. Remove wallet and cash from carry on and put in pockets. Place watch on wrist. Check to make sure all is accounted for and calmly walk away from area. Don't look back. Mutter under breath how much you hate terrorists and this unbelievable security process you just put up with one more time. Then remember that you will have to do it all over again in the morning for the return flight. Mutter some unprintable word. Walk to gate. | ||
| 86129squids |
Here's the link to the story I heard yesterday- if anyone travels regularly, you'll want to hear it- or, mebbe not... http://www.npr.org/2012/06/27/155838099/why-flying -is-no-fun-and-may-be-more-dangerous |
