| Author | Message | ||
     Just_ziptab |
I don't follow nascar,but it sure seems like it is "orchestrated"......for what little bit of it I do run across. Why would you build a car for hundreds of thousands of dollars that does not fit the template? Or any other aspect that you know you will get caught on in tech? The drama?? The sensationalism? Molten balls of metal bouncing across the track..that should be just a feather spray of sparks? Maybe it's just me........  | ||
| Sifo |
Has this happened recently? It would be easier to answer know the details of what you are talking about. They do have new rules this season and it is possible that a given team could have pushed a "tolerance" beyond the edge. Sometimes springs sag and a car can go out of spec. Sometimes they even cheat. Some have gotten away with cheating for a while. I don't see as any different from any other form of racing. | ||
| Pkforbes87 |
For being fake, it certainly isn't very entertaining. At least RAW puts on a good show. | ||
| Sifo |
I assume the OP is referring to this... http://www.nascar.com/2007/news/headlines/cup/10/0 9/rsorenson.jelledge.penalty/index.html Sorenson had a car that failed the minimum height after the race. Keep in mind that this is also checked before the race. Probably a case of a spring settling more than expected. I agree that NASCAR is tough to watch unless you are really paying attention to the strategies involved. I don't have the patience for it anymore. | ||
| Badlionsfan |
No that's not what op is talking about. Your link is from 07. This is what he's talking about-- http://m.nascar.com/primary/wk_cup_article?article Id=urn:newsml:NASCAR.com:20120302:cknaus-responds- to-penalties:1&category=nascar_cup_latest&pageSize =5 It's not fake, it's ultra competitive. The level of competition is insane. 43 cars start every race, 2/3 of them could win. Any little advantage you can find and try to get thru, you gotta try it. It's not new, in fact it used to be a lot worse. Smokey Yunick was a master rule bender back in the day. NASCAR has made the gray area much smaller than it used to be. Chad Knaus and the 48 team have a history of getting caught "bending the rules", hence the steep penalty this time. | ||
| Etennuly |
Evolutionary refinements. Every year the Nascar rule makers and enforcers get better, every year the car builders and crews are looking for even the smallest of advantages. The parity of the cars now is so close that they may as well be built like the former ICAR cars were, in one shop by one crew. So in some respects the cars being more equal makes the driver and crew more important than ever in making that car win. I was a race fan back when the winner of a Winston Cup race may have won by three laps. Qualifying times may have been spread out over a couple of minutes per lap. Now ten cars may qualify within .002 of a second, the whole field within .5 second. It has changed for sure. It is safer for sure, but no one could have predicted the finish of the Daytona 500. There are plenty of closely contested, fender banging races still run. I would challenge anyone who thinks it is fake to take a 200 mile per hour lap at Daytona. These folks who drive these cars are still nuts to do what they do. Before Hans devices and such, say back in the mid 80's, it was fun to look at pictures of drivers in the Daytona year book. I would guess only 1/4 of the drivers had both eyes pointed in the same direction. Repeated concussions probably did that. I enjoy watching more now that the cars and barriers are safer. Although I too like watching the wrecks, I never did like watching them get hurt. | ||
| Sifo |
Wow, I did a search on NASCAR rules violation and saw a few links mentioning Sorenson. I assumed it was current. How come I can never find information from years past when I'm looking for it! That violation sounds odd. "It was all visual. The templates were never actually put on the car," Knaus said. "We never even got the opportunity to present that car to the template. So it was unfortunate. There was some subjectivity to it." I'm not sure what to make of that. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
This is something that has been gnawing on me for 15 years or so. Seems to be ramped up the last couple of years. I don't need to hear how many grammys the singer of the National Anthem has won. I just want to hear it before the race.... in it's true form and not molested by the singer. Sponsors make the race happen....but I don't need to hear their name or product .....three times in the same sentence.....and over and over and over. I didn't need to see Harvick kick an expensive radio controlled car into the bushes because it was no fun for him to play with it any more....and has always been a spoiled brat to me ever since. I watch a little nascar on Saturdays with the gang at the bar for dinner. Maybe if the sound was off,I would feel better about it. BTW,I have a friend that got "transplanted" last year to paint for HMS..so there is something there for me to look for..but give me old nascar from the 70's please.....with out all the damned hype and sensationalism. I just want to scream shut the hell up and race.....  My car dealer buddy just bought a #3 replica(real car)at an auction. Will it have a birthday in the showroom? Apparently the last dealer couldn't sell it either. | ||
| Sifo |
I remember when Montoya came from the open wheel circuit thinking NASCAR would be easy pickings. This year he wrecked into the track dryer.  OK, that probably wasn't his fault, but I found it entertaining anyway. Quite a few drivers have found the transition from open wheel to NASCAR difficult to master. When ever I watch a race these days though I feel like the only drivers I know are Martin and Lebonte. Who are these young kids?  | ||
| Badlionsfan |
Open wheel to NASCAR is a transition, but can be done. Tony Stewart, Jeff Gordon among others have managed to do ok. My biggest issue with today's NASCAR is the it's corporate and kinda bland. I miss the days when drivers had a personality, especially Earnhardt. It didn't matter if he was leading or two laps down, he made himself relevant. When he didn't like a rule or situation, he had Bill France jr's ear whenever he wanted, and Bill listened. No one has stepped up to fill that role, and the sport has suffered for it. A friend I've known since 4th grade works in the truck series, he's the truck chief for the 13 truck. Over the winter he asked if I'd be interested in driving the transporter. 10-12 years ago I woulda jumped at the opportunity. Now days, I'd rather not work weekends all summer and turned it down. | ||
| Jramsey |
A bag of Skittles flushed down the toilet reminds me of today's NASCAR races. | ||
| Needs_o2 |
Who here watches two wheeled racing? I bet any of the sanctioning bodies and race teams in bike racing would give their left nut to have the sponsors that NASCAR has! Thats why they get the air time they do, money, and thats why nearly every form of racing is trying to play catchup to NASCAR. They just know how to keep it fresh, entertaining, and competitive. How many times a day do you think Erik says Amsoil and Hero in a day? Zip, as far as fake goes, really? Those that don't understand, criticize. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Well,maybe fake was too harsh a word. Sensationalised .....to keep the money flowing? Attendance $$ Hot dogs $$ Beer/pop $$ Souvenirs $$ If I had all the money my sister has spent on nascar over the years,I'd probably be close to having a 1190 Buell. | ||
| Jumbo_petite |
A bag of Skittles flushed down the toilet reminds me of today's NASCAR races. That is funny!!!!!!!!!!!!! | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I'd rather watch this. | ||
| Blake |
MotoGP and NASCAR would benefit from some very simple event changes. NASCAR from one longgggg race to two races half as long. MotoGP just needs to add a second race. | ||
| Britchri10 |
NASCAR does that on the Friday before the big race (Twin 125's) &, No, I 'm not a NASCAR fan! F1 call it "qualifying". Chris C | ||
| Paint_shaker |
NASCAR- For those racers who don't want to race in the rain! LOL | ||
| Bads1 |
Understood..... but it bores me to death. | ||
| Datsaxman |
NASCAR fake? Let's hope that *somebody* there is smart enough that it would be a better show if they were orchestrating the results. OF COURSE they are orchestrating a patented "NASCAR close finish" every time they get the chance, but I think getting teams to cooperate and have the fix in for a predetermined driver to win is not credible. I was a big fan, once upon a time. Now, NASCAR is worse than fake. It has become corporate and pretend glam and hype and spoiled children...and dull... And I hate the things those idiots do to my national anthem too. As long as I am blowing off steam. (Message edited by datsaxman on March 05, 2012) | ||
| 99savage |
I am old enough to remember when there were something approximating STOCK Cars in NASCAR. You know, cars built from stuff you could walk up to the parts counter & order. Try as I might I can't bring myself to give a rat's rump about a bunch of purpose built vehicles, that are not exploring new concepts, going in a circle. But I do like the NASCAR fans. - We used to have Formula racing at a local track & the fans were a bunch of pigs. They now have Winston Cup racing & the fans are terrific. | ||
| Fahren |
"Au revoir, Ricky Bobby." | ||
| Needs_o2 |
I grew up a mile away from the Milwaukee Mile and went to all kinds of racing as a kid, stock car, indy car, and cart racing. I love all kinds of racing, bike racing, drag racing, sports car racing, even boat racing. The thing that makes NASCAR so interesting is it's diversity and parity, sounds odd, but name another form of racing that runs on short tracks, road courses, super speedways, high banked short tracks, flat mile tracks, and high banked super speedways. As far as parity, there has been 10 different winners of the past 11 Daytona 500s, more than the one season has started out with the first dozen or more races being won by different drivers, and the chammpionship, last year was a points tie. I am not a NASCAR fanatic, but as far as being entertained, I'll take NASCAR over F1 any day. I think those that put down NASCAR are those that want to be so different they rip on anything that is popular and mainstream to make themselves feel special. Dat, what does NASCAR have to do with the lack of talent in the music industry? Look what ball and stick has done to the anthem, they let Roseanne Barr make a mockery of it along with many others! | ||
| 86129squids |
Meh. As a kid, I enjoyed racing my go-kart around the yard WFO- even managed to flip it and had it land on top of me- laid in bed the rest of the day trying to recover from a massive asthma attack, was OK the next day... Never been to a race- I've been told that would change my mind. I doubt it- even though they're hauling A--, just going around in a circle does nothing for me... I'm a Buell rider after all!!! | ||
| Badlionsfan |
The "they're just going around in a circle" argument is a simple point of view lacking common sense or original thought. A model train goes around in a circle. If you can watch 5 laps of any NASCAR race and tell me it's the same as a model train then I've got some beachfront property in Nevada to sell you. | ||
| Ltbuell |
..hey badlionsfan,i've seen that beach front property you got for sale here(i live in Nevada)....like the bridge,too...  | ||
| Badlionsfan |
It's a future beach. Once California falls in the ocean, it'll be prime property. | ||
| 86129squids |
Dude. A cheap, simple train set does indeed go around in a circle. I've seen many, much more interesting and elaborate model trains sets... I'd rather watch them than any NASCAR race. As to my capacity for common sense, that's debatable, but rest assured, I've PLENTY of original thought. F you for such an offensive post.  Now- I do love the history and origins of NASCAR, as I know what happened on Kingston Pike regularly back in the day... just that now, in 2012, and in the past decades (count 4 for me), I've seen nothing interesting. Yes, I've only seen it on TV, maybe I should attend a race someday, maybe my perspective would change. Just like Daytona was once run on the beach, it could have been interesting... I do LOVE any motorcycle racing- be it true moto-course, ••••••••••, drag races, IOM, salt flats, ISDE, even trials (not really racing there...  ) NASCAR, once again, I say... Meh. | ||
| 86129squids |
Hey Blake- "••••••••••", I mean "Flat Track" apparently gets flagged as something indecent...  Fggggin A. | ||
| Strokizator |
I don't think it's fake but more contrived, as in "deliberately created rather than arising naturally or spontaneously". The "entertainment" cautions were the last straw for me. Junior about to go a lap down? Throw a yellow for debris on the track. The front runner has too much of a lead? Throw a caution. Still it's not a boring as soccer. If a motorcycle race has a run-away leader they focus on the battle for second or third or even further back. |
