Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 01:47 am:
Superdave.... that's a cop out. I DO believe in "evolution". I just Don't know what "facts" you think you have that prove it.
Again, which? Theories? do you? like?
I favor catastrophism, where sudden changes in environment kill off the critter unfit for the new conditions. Giant Meteors, Comets, Ice ages, Volcanoes, and supervolcano, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supervolcano uber landslide, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megatsunami and a fav out in the NW states, Glacial Superdam Collapse http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missoula_Floods all stress the environment leading to the best suited mutants becoming the common herd. ( that's why there's no medium Giraffes )
I'm actually big on galactic scale events too. There seems to be a long periodicity major die off that tracks with a possible gamma ray laser firing from an orbit further in toward the Core. Every umpteen jillion years we get zapped, no matter how we clean up the planet, or become enlightened.
Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 10:15 am:
Ft, Those aren't examples of proving a negative. You're alluding to facts that eliminate a negative. And this works great for things that are known. You can prove that a dog does not have 8 legs if we act like rational thinking people and just look at a dog. But if someone were to say that every dog has four additional legs that are invisible, intangible "spiritual" legs, can you prove them wrong? Would you even bother?
(Message edited by notpurples2 on September 21, 2011)
Posted on Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 09:14 pm:
simply can't prove a negative... True. I recall from jesuit teachers stuff about the prove-ability of faith. In fact, with an entire order devoted to arguing about faith, they had a lot to say. Some jesuit thought is parodied in Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy, in the bit about the babel fish.
While I don't actually recall being excommunicated, ( may have missed it....probably was after confession ) I no longer follow that path, and so have little to say about Christian doctrine. Laughed a lot at the movie Dogma. Heck, I don't worry about doctrine in my own faith.
logic may be the wrong tool to measure the Gods.
Just don't see how evolution is "fact" rather than "pretty well observed and logicked rationale for different critters" Don't need to argue it's existence with anyone, just curious what variant you favor?
Nuclear Fission is "fact". We're a little looser on Fusion in all it's forms, but since my Dad was involved with the Bikini tests, I can assure you we have a small, tenuous grasp on the subject. ( and the early H-bombs were far more powerful than anticipated. Way more bang than calculated. )
On another thread there is mention of this deity being a version of that one. Not surprising. It depends a lot on your belief in exclusivity of a particular religion. I understand Christmas is when it is because the Roman Christians had to hide it under another holiday. As far as Krishna goes? don't know. Always thought Loki and Coyote were pretty close.
Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 12:56 am:
A negative is easily proved. What cannot be proved is non-existence.
But that point is irrelevant to the question of origins. If purely natural mechanisms gave rise to the universe, time itself, and life, then demonstrating plausibility of such purely naturalistic originations ought to be feasible. It certainly is not asking to prove non-existence, or even a simple negative.
The IRS would be concerned and those suffering bankruptcy relieved if indeed one could not prove a negative.
Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 09:25 am:
Big fan of Penn and Teller. Love their homes in Vegas ( as seen on tv ) but wouldn't get all upset about Penn's secular humanism. His job, after all, is to fool people. Darn good at it too.
BTW, if I heard a voice tell me to kill my child, I'd have to laugh at it. Really, once a girl has gone through 14...... You've already had the idea.
Now my child's boy friends? "Boy, look at me. You see that little girl there? That's my only little girl. She's my life. So if you have any thought about hugging or kissing, you remember these words: I got no problem going back to prison."
Now if I got repeated voices asking me to kill people, I'd check the meds. Seriously. There's a reason you're not supposed to stop some drugs suddenly.