| Author |
Message |
    
M2me
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 12:43 am: | 
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Again, the definition of a "special interest" is an interest that the speaker does not agree with.
Exactly!
This ruling is one more nail in the coffin of government of the people, by the people and for the people. Multi-national corporations are now considered to have an equal voice in America's public policy debate. I guess we can hope that multi-national corporations will have the best interests of the American people in mind. But I've got to admit that I'm highly skeptical of that. I suspect that multi-national corporations will push for policies that are beneficial for them, even if those policies are not beneficial for the American people. |
Rich
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 06:26 am: |
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I feel sorry for all the bagmen who lost their jobs, now that politicians can be bought out in public. |
Aptbldr
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 06:40 am: |
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Money flows to those in government (power); like gravity it's a natural law.
Perhaps recognizing this opens-up information about campaign financials. I try to be optimistic.
Campaigning, politics outside government service, is BIG $$ business in USA.
Creating and maintaining (political) celebrities is certainly an American industry. Little optimism for change here. |
Pso
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 08:31 am: |
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I find this whole thing very interesting, the neat thing about our wonderful form of government is we fix something and if it is not working we then are able to make adjustments to make the fixes work. We aspire to ideals and attempt to attain and maintaine them. As situations changes our participitory democracy can make adequate and appropriate changes and we do not need a violent overthrow or the govt. Look at big pharm. We established the FDA because of all the snake oil being pushed on us and killing us, then in the 70's we decided that big pharm should do their own testing and send the test reports to FDA for approval. Just a matter of time before people catch on that big pharm is killing us again and we will change the laws again.I do not fault big pharm, I memory serves correctly the SEC in a statement made it very clear a long time ago that corp. owed their first resposablity to stock holders not consumers, thus big pharm is obligated to make as much as they can even if it kills people, that is what tort laws are about. I love America greatest country ever. Regarding the level of heated discussion that emerges once in awhile- to paraphrase Plato what makes us angy is other people not doing what we think they should. |
Blake
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 12:04 pm: |
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Yeah Blake. That ended 100 years ago. Open you frickin' eyes. Who do you think make all your clothes? Well paid Indonesians?
I know you're not that stupid."
Thanks for the vote of confidence. I should clarify that as we are talking about America, my comment concerned unions in America, not Indonesia. Sorry for the confusion.
"Only reinforces, to me, that the Republican Party is nothing but Corporatist."
Says the staunch unionist.
"So you never agreed with McCain in his sponsoring of finance reform? About the only thing he did that made any sense to me.
IMHO,this is a sad day for America."
I did not agree with that, no. The intent was good, but the execution was horribly flawed. McCain himself admits as much. |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 12:41 pm: |
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I think the politicians should be covered in corporate logos just like nascar drivers. That way we know who bought the political vote. |
Hootowl
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 12:50 pm: |
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Nah, you'll just end up with wanna-be politicians covering themselves in corporate logos trying to look like they're sponsored. |
Sifo
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 02:08 pm: |
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A corporation is just a group of people organized for a stated purpose and chartered by the state. Funny thing is that is also exactly what a Political Action Committee is. That is also exactly what news corporations are.
So why can George Soros (not a US citizen) fund PACs? So why can news corporations openly support candidates and agendas? So why can a corporation such as GE own a news corporation such as MSNBC? Until this decision this gave GE a huge advantage over other corporations.
I hope some of you that think this decision was wrong have some answers for these questions. |
Ratyson
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 02:19 pm: |
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I ran across a little bit of information here..
It seems that the VAST majority of the top 50 Mean, people hating industries give a larger portion of their money to the democratic party...
(If anyone knows how to put this in a columned format better... please do... it doesn't look very good like that... lol)
Rank Industry Total Dem Pct GOP Pct Top Recipient
1 Lawyers/Law Firms $22,668,990 83% 17% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
2 Health Professionals $14,307,929 63% 37% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
3 Retired $11,285,022 55% 45% Mark Kirk (R-Ill)
4 Real Estate $10,842,041 64% 36% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
5 Securities/Invest $10,776,669 73% 27% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
6 Insurance $9,062,842 57% 43% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
7 Lobbyists $7,801,801 69% 31% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
8 Leadership PACs $6,624,511 64% 36% Roy Blunt (R-Mo)
9 Bldg Trade Unions $6,136,245 92% 7% Judy Chu (D-Calif)
10 Pharm/Health Prod $5,852,259 61% 39% Richard Burr (R-NC)
11 Electric Utilities $5,673,806 61% 39% Lisa Murkowski (R-Alaska)
12 Misc Finance $5,563,770 62% 38% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
13 Democratic/Liberal $5,294,744 100% 0% Michael F Bennet (D-Colo)
14 Oil & Gas $4,703,998 40% 60% Blanche Lincoln (D-Ark)
15 TV/Movies/Music $4,661,525 69% 30% Patrick Leahy (D-Vt)
16 Transport Unions $4,423,410 87% 13% James L Oberstar (D-Minn)
17 Business Services $4,247,368 73% 27% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
18 Commercial Banks $4,163,241 52% 48% Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY)
19 Hospitals/Nurs Homes $4,051,154 74% 26% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
20 Public Sector Unions $3,895,921 93% 7% Scott Murphy (D-NY)
21 Industrial Unions $3,864,710 98% 2% Mark Schauer (D-Mich)
22 Air Transport $3,583,154 55% 45% Byron L Dorgan (D-ND)
23 Crop Production $3,536,166 61% 39% Blanche Lincoln (D-Ark)
24 Misc Mfg/Distrib $3,257,744 57% 43% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
25 Defense Aerospace $3,234,240 60% 40% Patty Murray (D-Wash)
26 Computers/Internet $3,104,709 71% 29% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
27 Accountants $2,975,508 51% 49% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
28 Beer, Wine & Liquor $2,909,375 61% 39% Mike Thompson (D-Calif)
29 Retail Sales $2,829,237 55% 45% Blanche Lincoln (D-Ark)
30 General Contractors $2,826,868 51% 49% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
31 Railroads $2,771,145 59% 41% Corrine Brown (D-Fla)
32 Telephone Utilities $2,690,007 56% 44% Rick Boucher (D-Va)
33 Candidate Cmtes $2,615,618 81% 19% Scott Murphy (D-NY)
34 Construction Svcs $2,599,922 65% 34% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
35 Misc Business $2,377,766 70% 28% Al Franken (D-Minn)
36 Education $2,361,123 82% 18% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
37 Health Services $2,341,038 69% 31% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
38 Defense Electronics $2,164,565 63% 37% John P Murtha (D-Pa)
39 Agricultural Svcs $2,021,026 55% 45% Blanche Lincoln (D-Ark)
40 Casinos/Gambling $1,833,238 76% 24% Shelley Berkley (D-Nev)
41 Food & Beverage $1,789,632 55% 45% Charles E Schumer (D-NY)
42 Misc Defense $1,604,759 63% 37% Daniel K Inouye (D-Hawaii)
43 Misc Unions $1,593,270 100% -0% Scott Murphy (D-NY)
44 Finance/Credit $1,588,028 57% 43% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
45 Pro-Israel $1,584,426 71% 29% Harry Reid (D-Nev)
46 Automotive $1,509,219 47% 53% Roy Blunt (R-Mo)
47 Telecom Svcs/Equip $1,483,239 67% 32% Rick Boucher (D-Va)
48 Food Process/Sales $1,454,883 54% 46% Blanche Lincoln (D-Ark)
49 Chemicals $1,444,049 55% 44% Vernon Buchanan (R-Fla)
50 Publishing $1,294,683 75% 24% Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY)
(Message edited by ratyson on January 22, 2010)
(Message edited by ratyson on January 22, 2010) |
Ceejay
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 02:41 pm: |
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serious rounding, but 124M jeez! does it ever seem like the system has gotten out of hand-meaning what gets put into it doesn't equal what you get out of it-similar to televising sunglasses for the blind... |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 03:08 pm: |
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I'm just going to make four points:
a) Big business is STILL business
b) Corporations cant's cast votes
c)Corporations are owned by the SHAREHOLDERS, which is typically made up of the public when we're talking about large entities. If you want to blame someone, blame them. They're the ones that allow corperations to behave as they do. If a corperation acts out of line, then the shareholders should all sell.
d)If the public is upset about how a candidate is being influenced by a corportation, they shouldn't vote for them.
The bottom line is this all come down to Johnny Public. |
Blake
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 03:18 pm: |
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| Rank | Industry | Total | Dem% | GOP% | Top Recipient | | 1 | Lawyers/Law Firms | $22,668,990 | 83% | 17% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 2 | Health Professionals | $14,307,929 | 63% | 37% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 3 | Retired | $11,285,022 | 55% | 45% | Kirk (R-Ill) | | 4 | Real Estate | $10,842,041 | 64% | 36% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 5 | Securities/Invest | $10,776,669 | 73% | 27% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 6 | Insurance | $9,062,842 | 57% | 43% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 7 | Lobbyists | $7,801,801 | 69% | 31% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 8 | Leadership PACs | $6,624,511 | 64% | 36% | Blunt (R-Mo) | | 9 | Bldg Trade Unions | $6,136,245 | 92% | 7% | Chu (D-Calif) | | 10 | Pharm/Health | $5,852,259 | 61% | 39% | Burr (R-NC) | | 11 | Electric Utilities | $5,673,806 | 61% | 39% | Murkowski (R-Alaska) | | 12 | Misc Finance | $5,563,770 | 62% | 38% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 13 | Democratic/Liberal | $5,294,744 | 100% | 0% | Bennet (D-Colo) | | 14 | Oil & Gas | $4,703,998 | 40% | 60% | Lincoln (D-Ark) | | 15 | TV/Movies/Music | $4,661,525 | 69% | 30% | Leahy (D-Vt) | | 16 | Transportation Unions | $4,423,410 | 87% | 13% | Oberstar (D-Minn) | | 17 | Business Services | $4,247,368 | 73% | 27% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 18 | Commercial Banks | $4,163,241 | 52% | 48% | Gillibrand (D-NY) | | 19 | Hospitals/Nursing Homes | $4,051,154 | 74% | 26% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 20 | Public Sector Unions | $3,895,921 | 93% | 7% | Murphy (D-NY) | | 21 | Industrial Unions | $3,864,710 | 98% | 2% | Schauer (D-Mich) | | 22 | Air Transport | $3,583,154 | 55% | 45% | Dorgan (D-ND) | | 23 | Crop Production | $3,536,166 | 61% | 39% | Lincoln (D-Ark) | | 24 | Misc Mfg/Distrib | $3,257,744 | 57% | 43% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 25 | Defense/Aerospace | $3,234,240 | 60% | 40% | Murray (D-Wash) | | 26 | Computers/Internet | $3,104,709 | 71% | 29% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 27 | Accountants | $2,975,508 | 51% | 49% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 28 | Beer, Wine & Liquor | $2,909,375 | 61% | 39% | Thompson (D-Calif) | | 29 | Retail Sales | $2,829,237 | 55% | 45% | Lincoln (D-Ark) | | 30 | General Contractors | $2,826,868 | 51% | 49% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 31 | Railroads | $2,771,145 | 59% | 41% | Brown (D-Fla) | | 32 | Telephone Utilities | $2,690,007 | 56% | 44% | Boucher (D-Va) | | 33 | Candidate Cmtes | $2,615,618 | 81% | 19% | Murphy (D-NY) | | 34 | Construction Services | $2,599,922 | 65% | 34% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 35 | Misc Business | $2,377,766 | 70% | 28% | Franken (D-Minn) | | 36 | Education | $2,361,123 | 82% | 18% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 37 | Health Services | $2,341,038 | 69% | 31% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 38 | Defense Electronics | $2,164,565 | 63% | 37% | Murtha (D-Pa) | | 39 | Agricultural Svcs | $2,021,026 | 55% | 45% | Lincoln (D-Ark) | | 40 | Casinos/Gambling | $1,833,238 | 76% | 24% | Berkley (D-Nev) | | 41 | Food & Beverage | $1,789,632 | 55% | 45% | Schumer (D-NY) | | 42 | Misc Defense | $1,604,759 | 63% | 37% | Inouye (D-Hawaii) | | 43 | Misc Union | $1,593,270 | 100% | 0% | Murphy (D-NY) | | 44 | Finance/Credit | $1,588,028 | 57% | 43% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 45 | Pro-Israel | $1,584,426 | 71% | 29% | Reid (D-Nev) | | 46 | Automotive | $1,509,219 | 47% | 53% | Blunt (R-Mo) | | 47 | Telecom Svcs/Equip | $1,483,239 | 67% | 32% | Boucher (D-Va) | | 48 | Food Process/Sales | $1,454,883 | 54% | 46% | Lincoln (D-Ark) | | 49 | Chemicals | $1,444,049 | 55% | 44% | Buchanan (R-Fla) | | 50 | Publishing | $1,294,683 | 75% | 24% | Gillibrand (D-NY) | | Totals | $223,280,593 | 67% | 33% | | |
Top Recipient Democrats: 46
Top Recipient Republicans: 4 |
Ratyson
| | Posted on Friday, January 22, 2010 - 04:29 pm: |
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Thanks Blake!!! |
Mountainstorm
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 04:42 pm: |
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Might explain why Change is Hopeless. They are slurping at the trough. What pol is going to bite the hand that feeds? |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 05:22 pm: |
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McCain-Fiengold was/is bad law.
Now, the Supreme court decision isn't about bribes to politicians, directly. That's whats on the list above. Heck, that's not even close to complete, since the SEUI allegedly donated 60 million to Obama.
The decision is if Exxon, or the Badweb pac, can run ads. It's now legal for Rocketsprink and M2me to pool their money ( R&M ) & buy an ad on radio telling people that voting for Jeb Bush is a bad idea. Before, they would be busted and fined or imprisoned if they tried that a week before the election.
Is that fair?
Now, I have little doubt that Exxon, or GE has more money and can run flashier, and more ads that R&M can afford. Exxon may tell people that Obama is against drilling & will make their energy costs rise. ( true, and happening today ) GE may tell people that without govt. help, they can't bring about a green tomorrow, and so we should not vote for Gov. Palin & Glenn Beck for Prez & VP, as they mock the global warming hoax. ( true, and happening today )
So, now you will have a more open forum with disparate views and will have to decide for yourself who's full of crap. ( hint, almost all of them ) What's the harm?
The only legit argument I've heard is that a company can buy all the available air time in a small market & drown out other views.
I'd think that would backlash on them, especially if the "news" agencies see it as unfair ( and don't get shut down in actual reporting by well bribed bosses ) and report that, say, "R&M are trying to buy the election, and it's unfair".... We'll see. We may need to reform the law.
Obama's 600+ million in untraceable donations ( some donations were overheard being made locally in a restaurant with multiple credit cards with multiple names, over $200k...LOL ) is because of McCain Fiengold. Ironic, huh? Totally legal money laundering because of, not de-regulation, but bad regulation.
Back in 2000 ONE of the candidates had what seemed a good idea on bribery reform. Rev. Alan Keyes wanted any citizen to be able to donate as much as he wants, with total transparency. Sifo gives $10, it's on Record. Bill Gates give $2mill.. on the books. No pacs, no unions, no company donations. Period. Just U.S. citizens. Severe penalties for boss's that pressure employees to donate. I don't remember if he had a plan for ads run by concerned people & entities. |
Hex
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 05:39 pm: |
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McCain-Fiengold was/is bad law.
And, to think he almost became president. |
Sifo
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 05:44 pm: |
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Instead we got someone who hasn't been around enough to have his name on any legislation. |
Madduck
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 05:55 pm: |
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Sort of nice to know that other big corporations can now duplicate what GE did with its ownership of NBC and MSNBC. Nothing negative and next to no background on our current president until the election. Having a huge corporation as cheerleader can make a difference. Maybe the presence of 20 additional will help.
I can see why the Dems hate to give up this huge press advantage, but I don't understand how we the public will be hurt by non media corporations having the same rights. |
Reindog
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 05:59 pm: |
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McCain would have been a so-so president, certainly not the "Bush's third term" attack slogan that the Dems used to their advantage in electing the current Looter in Chief. McCain's strength is that he is able to forge consensus and create alliances instead of being a pure ideologue. |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 06:02 pm: |
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And, to think he almost became president.
Dodged that one...right into the path of a train.
I'm of the opinion that McCain was the other Democrat choice. He didn't get the lead until the Obama supporters voted for him in NH. ( correct me if I'm wrong, here ) He was selected to fail, Hillary was a lock. I didn't want him either...and he almost won!
Let's hope 2012 isn't Obama vs. Jeb Bush. I'm not into hereditary monarchs.  |
Sifo
| | Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 06:08 pm: |
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I'm not convinced BO will be on the ballot in 2012. |
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