| Author | Message | ||
     Johnnymceldoo |
Americans have elected a group of people that do not believe in American exceptionalism. They believe America for the most part needs to put in its place and Americans need to be told what to do and how to think, breath shower and $hit. They are clever in that while they try to change America they can line their pockets and throw their supporters some crumbs. Van Jones had this almost mythological idea that they would lead and create an industry making energy and enforcing energy conservation and put the poor and downtrodden to work. What does van jones or any of those dip$hits he rubs elbows with know about alternative energy? I was just picturing some acorn or SEIU goon knocking on my door to inspect my house. I cant hardly type coherently or make a good argument because the bull$hit is so deep. | ||
| Madduck |
E-mail servers at all of the North American universities with a serious weather science research program are being backed up and delete logs being stored as the investigation takes hold. This mess is just starting to blow up. Major University programs will be disgraced and the "scientific journals" of meterology that were borderline financially will be going under. The repercussions of this will affect all of science as we know it. NASA and NOAA are in deep trouble as well. Leading the suicidal lemmings off the cliff will be punished in this economy. Getting a public to fund major science projects was always a problem. Corruption on this level will make funding anything much more difficult. It is a very sad day for science. | ||
| Sifo |
Al Gore knows when it's time to go into hiding. I wonder if he will grow his beard back? http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2009/12 /03/al-gore-cancels-1-200-handshake-event-copenhag en | ||
| Xodot |
Aesquire - You want the BEST Toronto Pizza? http://www.dine.to/vesuvios Since I was a kid, this has been the best. Authentic, neighbourhood oriented, welcoming blah blah blah..... and reasonably priced. | ||
| Aesquire |
Xodot, Thank You! I get up there a few times a year, & haven't had luck with pizza. Don't want to go to a multinational Pizza Chain, that's like McDonalds, safe but crappy food for the road. I know Toronto must have it's own style. Pizza is a very regional thing. Perhaps it reflects the immigration patterns. Influences change the food. I'm a "melting pot" kinda guy. I was eating salsa before Frito-lay sold it. We have a heavy Indian food thing going here with so many students & families, so I can get good vindaloo. We even have a few real good authentic Chinese places, but nothing like Toronto's Chinatown. | ||
| Blake |
From: http://mrc.org/press/releases/2009/20091204124643. aspx | ||
| Blake |
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| Court |
Sounds like Gore is about the be the first to ever have an Oscar taken back. The criminal Implications are huge. The financial fraud these folks perptrated makes Madoff look like a kid selling lemonade. | ||
| Madduck |
A lot of people are probably wondering exactly when they first heard/started this fraud and correlating it with later statements. When it was known and what you did with the information may actually mean the difference between disgrace and a real prison term for scientists that never imagined this ocming apart so fast. Another impossibly large bubble bursting. Been coming for four years and now that its here the hope is it goes away quietly, like a rotten fart dissipating. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Oddly enough, Obama isn't holding off on the Copenhagen trip. I bet they work to push Cap and Trade through before November too. | ||
| Reepicheep |
My first thought when I started reading the emails was "why isn't this a RICO case?". It oughta be. Liars lying on an industrial - government complex scale ought to face jail time. It ought to send a chill through the scientific establishment... if you are spending other peoples money, if you lie you go to jail. (just like in any other industry >  ) | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
"Al Gore knows when it's time to go into hiding. I wonder if he will grow his beard back?" He isn't hiding at all. He was on David Letterman last night promoting his new book..."Our Choice". | ||
| Chellem |
And did Letterman deliver any of the hard-hitting questions? Perhaps he made a joke about Al Gore's daughters sleeping with famous sports figures? Did it even come up?? Not that he's a real reporter. I was just curious what he said. There sure are jokes to be had, were he so inclined. | ||
| Neurorider |
Global warming my A$$. I just brought my mom to the airport in Little Rock Arkansas for her flight to Acapulco-flight is delayed because of SNOW in Houston Texas! Now, that isn't quite "snowing in Hell", but shoot, Houston is pretty close temperature-wise, you know?  | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
"Global warming my A$$." I'm riding the fence on Global Warming right now. I understand that historically there's cycles, but on the other hand, I've been rained on 3 of the last 4 years on Christmas week, in northern Wisconsin. And there's been issues with irradic annual snow falls up there for the last 20 years. Our weather is changing here, question is, is this a permanent issue or cyclical? (Message edited by buellinachinashop on December 05, 2009) | ||
| Blake |
The question for me is, is man causing catastrophic warming of the planet? The answer is no. The weather everywhere is always changing. Nothing on the planet is constant. At one time sea levels were MUCH lower. At one time they were MUCH higher. Get off the fence and face reality. We've been sold a pack of lies. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
Reality? The reality is that there's more people on the planet than ever, that number is never going to decrease. To say that the human effect on our planet is non-existant is prety close minded. Do I think we're 100% to blame? No,there's been ice ages long before we came along, but I do beieve we have an impact on our climate. | ||
| Sifo |
I'm riding the fence on Global Warming right now. I understand that historically there's cycles, but on the other hand, I've been rained on 3 of the last 4 years on Christmas week, in northern Wisconsin. And there's been issues with irradic annual snow falls up there for the last 20 years. Our weather is changing here, question is, is this a permanent issue or cyclical? When a lead author for the IPCC states "The fact is that we can’t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t." it's pretty clear that their theories don't stand up to realities. The real question is if CO2 is a problem. Hard science has failed to prove a problem despite of billions of tax dollars being thrown into the research trying to prove there is a problem. Please consider that carefully. We have spent billions on "scientific" studies that start with the premise that CO2 is a problem yet we haven't been able to prove it simply because temperatures aren't doing what is predicted. We now see the scientific response to the data not matching the models and theories... The data is getting adjusted to match the theories and models. I really don't know what more one needs to see before they come to the understanding that CO2 is not causing the warming. The problem is that it's easy to show the world is warming. It's also easy to show the world is cooling. Again, please understand that these are not contradictory statements. It's simply a matter of the time scale that you choose to look at, and that's using data that we know to have been adjusted to show a greater warming trend. It's the adjustments that allow statements about the warmest years happening in the past decade. Take out the adjustments and suddenly the warmest year happens in 1934 IIRC. The adjustments would be much easier to accept if they were done openly with explanations and disclosure of the mathematical formulas. It seems that this isn't how climate science is done for some reason. When you talk about erratic snow falls for the past 20 years, what are you comparing to? I assume the preceding decade(s)? That would make your comparison to a known cool period (that too was blamed on man until it went into a warming trend). As I said earlier it's easy to show warming or cooling. It's just how you select the data. The bottom line is that climate change happens. If you need to blame it on man your theory needs to conform to what is happening in the world. Failing that simple test means the theory has failed. Again to quote a lead author from the IPCC "The fact is that we can’t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t". | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
"When you talk about erratic snow falls for the past 20 years, what are you comparing to?" Yes, previous decades, but to a greater extent the inconsistant winters we've had over the last 20-25 years. Heavy snows the last two years, but the previous 4 were warm and dry. I remember winters 30 years ago that were so extreme my father couldn't hunt because of snowfalls in November, this year it was in the 50's. I undrstand that climate changes, it has historically done so. To say that our "foot print" on the planet isn't having an effect on that change is where I'm on the fence. Co2 isn't the only bi-product of the human race. To say its THE CAUSE of change I don't beieve is right either. My thought is IF we do have an effect, there's mulitiple causes, not just Co2. | ||
| Strato9r |
I'd like it if Al Gore came over to my house and shoveled out the four feet of snow that is keeping me out of my garage! | ||
| Court |
They lied. Al Gore either lied or was duped. I'm going with lied simply because if I, as a simple construction worker, could see past the bullshit . . Well, the " inventor of the Internet" should have. Of course, I didn't make millions, buy a yacht or a private jet as a result of his fear mongering. I'll bet . In the "global warming" parlayence, we ain't seen the tip of the iceberg. Keep an eye on Rahm. | ||
| Wolfridgerider |
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure." | ||
| Blake |
To say that the human effect on our planet is non-existant is prety close minded. You no read good. You are arguing a point against a view that no one has offered. Words have meaning. My specific words were,
Of course we affect the planet. | ||
| Sifo |
John, I'm glad that you sound rational about this. You really sound more like a "global warming denier". There is no doubt that man changes the environment. Just do some reading on the urban heat island effect. The funny thing is that when you look at the urban heat island effect and look at how the temperature record may need to be changed to account for that, the adjustments needed would be exactly the opposite of what the scientists actually do. 30 years ago the Midwest suffered some very extreme winters. I remember all too well having a car that wouldn't start in 25 below temps. I was living in an apartment where I couldn't just plug in a charger. I was taking the battery out of the care and soaking it in hot water in my kitchen sink with a charger on it, then back out to the car for another try in a few hours. I also remember snowmobiling in MI after 30+ inches of snow in a night. Last winter was the coldest I've seen in decades. This winter is starting out on a rage too. None of this is statistically meaningful though. Both sides make that clear when it benefits them. My issue is that CO2 is focused on as the big cause. Green house gasses in general. The entire greenhouse theory is being proven wrong by reality though, not just the CO2 aspect. Personally I see bringing mercury into my house as a much more serious threat that climate changes caused by greenhouse gasses. This leads to another interesting part of the question. What is the real effect of the climate change (assuming it's happening, which it appears to not be real). Do we benefit more from milder winters and longer growing seasons or harsh winters where you can't even get out to hunt? | ||
| Madduck |
I want all those "experts" riding around in limos and private jets to quit whining about the truck I use to haul my race trailer. Yeah its big and its red and it doesn't get squat for mileage. Hook my trailer to a prius and see what it gets for mileage. Bet my truck does better than their jet. I was done with Global Warming when they started on the CO2 BS. Having done weather science in the 70's I realized that they had read the data all wrong. Global Warming causes CO2 increase among many other things. How "eminent scientists" could pretend to not know the most basic of correlations made me very suspicious of what else they were getting wrong. I still am in shock at how big a mess has been created by this deliberate fraud. | ||
| Rocketman |
You might find this news broke today as relevant and of interest. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1233426/Me t-Office-review-60-years-data-amid-claims-figures- doctored-support-climate-change-fears.html Rocket | ||
| Sifo |
That is of interest Rocketman. I read elsewhere they were going back over the past 160 years, not 60. I have no opinion on which is correct though. It's a necessary step in the right direction. I notice that they are confident that the review will show that there was indeed warming over the past 150 years ago. As I said earlier it's all about picking the period you want to look at. What he is really saying is that it warmed up a bit since we were in the midst of the Little Ice Age! I have no doubt that the review will also show that the warming has leveled and reversed recently while greenhouse gasses continue to rise. I have no doubt that there is still no scientific explanation for this that preserves the man made greenhouse gas theory. | ||
| Chellem |
We also don't know what "normal" is. Obviously, as humans, we like it roundabout like it is now. What if trapping all the carbon inside the earth in the form of oil is what caused the ice age? Without the carbon, it got too cold? Now that we humans have begun releasing the carbon again, it's actually bringing the temps back to where they "belong"? I'm not a scientist. I just made that up. The problem I have with these "scientists" is their own lack of self-analysis. Global warming is suddenly a FACT. No more studying necessary. WHAT? What REAL scientist in his right mind would EVER utter something like that? Basically, we've learned everything there is to know about the climate of the earth, no need to keep looking. Quite a bold statement. Fraud or not, whatever information we think we have is STILL not everything there is to know. Honest scientific research is needed. Not politically-driven data mining to find things that support the conclusion you've already reached. Any scientist who participates in that sort of behavior should be, well, removed from the scientific community. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
I remember winters 30 years ago that were so extreme my father couldn't hunt because of snowfalls in November, this year it was in the 50's And I recall heat waves in Baltimore back in the 70's. I can't even remember, in recent history, when the temperature went over 100 in Baltimore, even with all the asphalt and if it did, it was only for a day or two. The problem I see with all this cap and trade bs is polluters like India and China aren't going to participate, so; our efforts would be for naught. The only thing we would accomplish is to further weaken our economy and increase our debt. | ||
| Sifo |
We also don't know what "normal" is. Obviously, as humans, we like it roundabout like it is now. Michelle, "What is normal" is a very good question. The reality is that there is no good answer. Again it's just an average that you derive based on arbitrary dates that you choose to pull data from. I would say that humans liking it roundabout like it is now may not be so obvious. Given that humans originally come from some of the warmest parts of the globe and it is only through artificial adaptation that we have populated the colder areas we seem best suited to warmer climates. Beyond that historically the Little Ice Age was a period of plague, disease and starvation. The Medieval Warm Period was a period of much better health and better ability to feed the masses. Certainly there are many factors involved in this contrast other than climate, but history doesn't support the assertion. Going one step further, the Jurassic period (dino era) was known to have been much warmer than current temperatures. It was also known to have been a period of incredible bio-diversity that the world hasn't seen since. Clearly the world is quite happy when warmer despite the hysterical claims to the contrary made by many alarmists. Then we get into the distribution of temperature as it warms according to greenhouse theory. Without getting too involved in the science behind it, the warming would be most noticeable at the poles, not the equator. Essentially where it's already hot won't get that much hotter and where it's cold will warm up some. That opens up a lot of land for agriculture that currently is too cold with little effect on the tropical areas. Net effect is more livable land for most of earths creatures and plants. Ever see a depiction of dinosaurs trudging across a barren waste land? I haven't either. The world is happy warm. |
