| Author | Message | ||
     Mortarmanmike120 |
I agree somewhat with Johnnylunchbox but not completely. I would say our political/legal framework is very much based on Roman/Greek systems. They obviously can't be based on a Christian system because Christianity does not have a legal structure. I do agree with Jon that "Western Society is based upon Christian principles whether you care to admit it or not." Even though the framework may be Greek or Roman, the laws and values that have developed within that framework have traditionally been Christian. Granted not ALL, but it would be difficult not to recognize this. Frankfast, hope we haven't run you off. I'm not flaming on you, but I would like to hear your response. | ||
| Rocketman |
I'm not getting into this but it's unfair to say Muslims don't contribute to a society they integrate in when you look around Britain. Muslims are a huge part of the British people. The tragedy is whilst the world leaders squabble over land rights to stabilize energy for the future, the Western world has gobbled up huge reserves of their own natural resources and the Muslim countries are sat on top of the biggest chunks of what's left. Religion is a consequence of how both societies interact. Solve the energy problems and peace will prevail. Imagine if America could extract energy from cornfields on a similar or greater scale than oil energy has provided. Do you think our middle eastern Muslim brothers would want to rule all the world or just be happy with their side of it to do as they please. I imagine if we left them to get on with their own cultures we'd all get along fine. Unfortunately the middle eastern part of the planet has something the western half needs to have a grip on. Rocket | ||
| Jon |
Islam is more than a religion, it is a form of government. That's why Austrailia has boot the well oiled boot of democracy on Sharia law and it's adherents. That had nothing to do with cornfields in America or oil, although it's fashionable to think so. | ||
| Mortarmanmike120 |
Rocket, you're right in that energy demands play a huge role in the tensions of the middle east. You're also right when you say that muslims contribute to a society when they integrate into it. All peoples contribute when they integrate. However, you have to admit that little contribution is made when immigrants DON'T integrate which I think is the problem that this statement was addressing. I believe this statement was directed strictly at those who did not want to assimilate into Australian culture. It never said, ALL MUSLIMS GET OUT. I imagine if we left them to get on with their own cultures we'd all get along fine. I don't think so. In what way were we interfering with their culture prior to Sept. 11th. The only way that I see we were 'interfering' was: 1) Not letting them destroy Israel. 2) Trying to get Syria out of Lebanon. 3) Trying to prevent Iran from going nuke. 4) Paying them a shitload of money for their resources. I'm suprised this thread has remained so civil for so long. Maybe there IS hope for Badweb. Ya'll have a good weekend... looks like good riding weather. | ||
| Marhaba |
As far as the guy cutting his daughters clitoris, I don't believe that it is lawful anywhere. Frank indeed you are gravely mistaken on this count. I'm sorry to say it but FGM is a HUGE problem in the middle east and africa, even here in a fairly westernized country such as Egypt. Up to 90% of the women here in egypt alone have had FGM done to them. However, I will say that this does not go on throughout the entire middle east quite so rampantly. Mostly, within subsaharan africa and egypt as well. If you think that that is a problem that can be so casually brushed off as a practice done by a radical fringe, it is sad to say you're mistaken. The practice may be officially frowned upon in the eyes of the government, but ignorance about what the Quran really means (because it's written in really hard to understand arabic) is the main motivator behind such a practice. | ||
| New12r |
Marhaba, thanks for the insight! I thought this thread would get out of hand fast, thanks for keeping it civil. It is a good debate and something we should be thinking about. | ||
| Sgthigg |
O bama is a Muslim, | ||
| Oldog |
O bama is a Muslim, the dems were maknig noises about him werent they? } | ||
| Jackbequick |
If Obama's Muslim beliefs include advocating or doing anything that is a violation of U.S. laws, then he should not be considered a viable candidate for any office. In fact he should not be allowed to run for any office. I'm hearing mumbling about a Rodham-Clinton/Obama presidential ticket. I'm wondering if Obama has any self respect if he would allow himself to placed on a ticket with that other person. I would consider voting for a Obama/Rodham-Clinton ticket as long as he promised to keep her under control. Yeah, I know Obama's qualifications are weak, but what the hell, he does not come from a long line of rich folks controlled by special interests. He might even have all of our best interests at heart. Jack | ||
| Alchemy |
Muslim, I don't think so. Unless United Church of Christ has now adopted the Koran<grin>. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
I would consider voting for a Obama/Rodham-Clinton ticket as long as he promised to keep her under control. Yeah, I know Obama's qualifications are weak, but what the hell, he does not come from a long line of rich folks controlled by special interests. He might even have all of our best interests at heart. Yea, because Hitlery has never been involved with special interest or cover-ups.  What self respecting motorcycle enthusiast would even think about voting for a hillary ticket much less admit it on a public forum! Now Im not saying there arent some good democrat candidates. Id fully support a Cheney/Zell Miller campaign or even a Cheney /Joe Lieberman campaign. } | ||
| Imonabuss |
I have to say I am so impressed by Australia's Prime Minister. I'm about ready to take the spot of some jackass Australian immigrant trying to brng down their society. If we are going to be faced with Hilary and Osama as one of only two choices, it's time to leave and go somewhere where there is real leadership. | ||
| Frankfast |
I'm all for that. | ||
| Blake |
Sean, How would you characterize an organization that mandates the execution of anyone who resigns membership, quits the club so to speak? I'd call that a cult. Welcome to Islam. | ||
| Bomber |
Obama is not Muslim -- Blake, I would expect you to deflate that kinda thing as rapidly as you attack anti-conswrvative posters. One of Obama's parents IS Muslim. And that means, what, exactly? I found myself nodding along to the Ozzie PM, until the following struck me -- cultures, languages and laegal systems all evolve over time -- it's difficult, if not impossible, to stop these changes. While I agree that accepting the prevailing culture should be part of the price of admission to said culture, expecting no changes over time is a good way be be disappointed. The civility in this thread is predictibly lessening over time. Sad, innit? | ||
| Pwnzor |
Barak Hussein Obama I'm not making that up. I just got done with this whole discussion on another board. Have fun. | ||
| Bomber |
Nope -- you are absolutely correct, Pwnzor. And my middle name is Lee -- soes that mean I'm in favor of succeeding from the union? | ||
| Naustin |
Holding that against him is just as ridiculous as associating anyone with the first name "Adolf" with Hitler. Hussein is just as common a name as Jones or Anderson. | ||
| Cowboy |
There is no 1/2 muslim one parent has accepted or the other has rejected I know my wife rejected. | ||
| Frankfast |
I went up to a guy on the job today and asked him his name and he said Mohammed. You're fighting a losing battle if you think you can keep muslim influences out of this country. It's already here. Get over it. | ||
| Cowboy |
Still very unhappy about it. I just had to post today as to day is the day my son is to get out of jail for whiping 2 of the b@#$$ds real good back in 2004 2yrs for whiping thier asss yet they can cut off our heads and nothing is done. If I sound bitter it is only because I am. | ||
| Frankfast |
You can't take the oil without the culture coming along with it. | ||
| Jon |
"I went up to a guy on the job today and asked him his name and he said Mohammed. You're fighting a losing battle if you think you can keep muslim influences out of this country. It's already here. Get over it." Well, sounds like we don't need to talk about this any further. So tell me Frank, are you going Sunni or Shia? | ||
| Frankfast |
Jon, your bigotry has surfaced. You were right the first time. We don't need to talk about this any further. | ||
| Grndskpr |
And my middle name is Lee -- soes that mean I'm in favor of succeeding from the union? As a matter of fact, i suspect you wouldn't be against it R | ||
| Bomber |
there ARE days, I'll admit -- specially after reading some of the threads here ;-} (Message edited by bomber on December 19, 2006) | ||
| Jon |
"Jon, your bigotry has surfaced. You were right the first time. We don't need to talk about this any further." Moral outrage...the hiding place of the convicted. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I've known a fair number of Aussies over the years & worked closely with a few, I'd say that the opening statements of this thread are expressed quite moderately for Australians. Most of them would just say "If you don't like it here f**k off!" A sentiment I sympathise with, living as an immigrant myself. | ||
| Frankfast |
Jon - Whose outraged? Some of my best friend are bigoted. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
Here is something you wont hear about on the clinton news network: Raped in Oslo From the desk of Fjordman on Wed, 2006-12-13 08:23 The number of rapes in the Norwegian capital Oslo is six times as high as in New York City. I’ve written about the issue of rape and Muslim immigration so many times that I am, quite frankly, a bit tired of the subject. But as we all know, problems don’t disappear just because you are tired of talking about them, so here goes. There has been an explosive increase in the number of rape charges in the city of Oslo, but both the media and the authorities consistently refuse to tell us why. They did do so, however, in 2001, when two out of Norway's three largest newspapers, Aftenposten and Dagbladet, reported that most of these rape charges involve an immigrant perp, which again mostly means Muslims. Both newspapers have since then conveniently “forgotten” about this, and have never connected the issue to Muslim immigration although the number of rape charges has continued to rise to historic levels. They are thus at best guilty of extreme incompetence, since their former articles about this issue are still available online. Norway’s Minister of Justice from 2001 to 2005, Odd Einar Dørum, mentioned the problem in 2001 but has later gone quiet about the issue. The reported number of rapes in Oslo is now six – 6! – times as high per capita as in New York City, yet the media keeps warning against Islamophobia. According to Aftenposten, the clinic (voldtektsmottak) at the emergency hospital known as Legevakt has never had so many rape victims to treat. Its ability to care for them all is being severely tested. The number of reported rapes has skyrocketed this year. Two out of three charged with rape in Norway’s capital are immigrants with a non-western background according to a police study. The number of rape cases is also rising steadily. Unni Wikan, a professor of social anthropology at the University of Oslo, in 2001 said that “Norwegian women must take their share of responsibility for these rapes” because Muslim men found their manner of dress provocative. The professor’s conclusion was not that Muslim men living in the West needed to adjust to Western norms, but the exact opposite: “Norwegian women must realize that we live in a Multicultural society and adapt themselves to it.” http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1754 (Message edited by johnnymceldoo on December 19, 2006) |
