| Author | Message | ||
     Rocketman |
Just look at the original bikes with the muffler under the bike and shock placement. Now look at the XB with its fuel in the frame, oil tank swing arm, and front braking system. All have their inherent problems too. Interesting. What? I hit the nail on the head? I doubt that very much. You recursively suggest that Buell become the US version of a failing, underfunded, under performing Italian motorcycle company that makes wonderful machines (though the name of the company changes from time to time) -- is this a subtle way of wishing that Buell go into receivership, that the government come bail them out, or what? Not at all. I'd prefer a Buell company that stopped pretending to build world beating bikes based on grin factor and real world bullshit performance. My preference would be that they use the brains of the genius at the helm to build an American hot rod that could stand proud in the street parked next to an MV Brutale. But you're right. You and I are not the target demographic. I agree, it's about time that the Japan Inc folks stopped making those tired old IL4 based sportbikes, and Ducati should drop the ancient Desmo valvetrain, and BMW should can the antique boxer motor, and Triumph should mothball the old three cylinder idea; it's past its prime, and Moto Guzzi is foolish to continue with the silly transverse V-twin idea; they all need something new, time to stop pissing around with antiquated tradition. They are all making fools of themselves sticking with traditional configurations trying to integrate them into modern ideas. The 100+ year old piston and cylinder engine configuration is so boring, old hat. The difference is with every make you speak of is that they all have advanced their antiquated designs. Buell are the only manufacturer that have rehashed their engine into something that produces less power and less performance. Why? Because they can't get the reliability otherwise, and that's why they can't compete, not only on the street but on the track too. Me? I would never ever cast Buell in such a dim perspective, mainly because to do so is entirely ridiculous. Buell is leading the industry in real meaningful innovation. I'm sure the future will also see continued that tired old tradition. And that's why Buell will continue in the same vein. They are no more innovative than anyone else. Just somewhat different. Their head is in the sand too. What's funny to me is, Japan Inc. seems to be really proud of their MT01, a pushrod V twin. And right they should be. It's sales target is a mere small percentage of Yamaha's market share. It simply fills, and competes, with another sector within their larger market, but it also shows that they can build a V twin pushrod engined motorcycle that is consistent with Japanese reliability. Buell on the other hand put their shallow V twin in everything. Perhaps it would be fair if Buell made a small amount of IL 4's so's we could poke fun at Yamaha? Buell has introduced some legendary products and done some fascinating things over the past 4 years. Man did I get ripped off then 8 years ago. Rocket | ||
| Acejay |
hey bomber i agree with you there. And for my part - there aint no thang wrong with pushrods!! | ||
| Whodom |
Well, this is the Sci-Fi channel, isn't it? If they REALLY wanted to be innovative, they'd adapt Project Orion's proposed drive system: http://www.nuclearspace.com  | ||
| Bomber |
Rocket -- if you got ripped off, and 8 years ago at that, I'm thinkin it's time to move on -- I think there may be a support group available I know a number of folks who'll gladly compare their XB sleds with a Brutale -- factor in price difference (let's not even get going on if there's a dealer in your county/state/continent), they seem to think it's a no brainer | ||
| Daves |
"Buell are the only manufacturer that have rehashed their engine into something that produces less power and less performance." I got news for you Rocket, a XB12R will run away from a S1,M2,X1,S3,S2. I know, I've ridden them all. My first track day with a XB9R I took 6 seconds off my best ever lap times on a X1. | ||
| Bomber |
Daves, you're just an ignorant petrol-head | ||
| Daves |
 I'm kind of proud of that fact | ||
| Bartimus |
Hmmm, must be something wrong with my XB9 then, because my S1W spanks the heck out of it power-wise. It just doesn't handle as well. | ||
| Diablobrian |
Bartimus: Is your suspension set up properly? Also what tires and pressures are you running on the XB? That makes all the difference in the world on these bikes. | ||
| Rex |
Okay a 30,000 rpm electric motor that is fed electricity wirelessly.....no fuel in the tank, the fuel is kept in the pits and the bike draws fuel over the net. rex | ||
| Daves |
That's why I said XB12 power wise against a Tuber. The 9s do have a little less power but handle so much better that my lap times still took a plunge. | ||
| Blake |
"The difference is with every make you speak of is that they all have advanced their antiquated designs. " So has Buell. Back in 1995 the Buell S2 was putting down what, 65 RWHP? I guess an increase of nearly 50% ain't good enough fer ya?  "Buell are the only manufacturer that have rehashed their engine into something that produces less power and less performance." Honda CBR600F4i? But good grief, that is just ignorant. With nothing more than a performance intake and exhaust supplemented with some ECM tuning (comparable to carb tuning) an XB12 will breach 100 SAE RWHP. Achieving that kind of performance used to require that AND a LOT more modification including cams, headwork, new carburetor, and a performance top end. You know this better than anyone. The XB engines are not an advancement over prior evo engines?  Of course they are. As far as innovations, please name any innovation from the competition that comes close to rivaling the Buell's ZTL brake/wheel, which allowed cutting 6+ LBs from the front wheel/brake assembly's unsprung mass. | ||
| Imonabuss |
It's obvious Rocket's off his meds again, but the little men in white shirts will be around soon to straighten him up, or put him in an armless shirt. "*od you, I'll type with me teeth!" Foam, gnash, roar... | ||
| Rocketman |
Hey, as a Buell owner of 8 years standing I have a right to be pissed off. A Buell will do that to you sometimes.  Rocket | ||
| Rocketman |
No meds today!  Rocket | ||
| Sparky |
Hey, it's better to be pissed off than pissed on.  | ||
| Jackbequick |
Rocket, You're the parallel for the guy that hates his wife/girlfriend except for occasional moments of shared intimacy that go well. But you can't bring yourself to sever the relationship so you hang around with all her friends and take it out on them. You're saying the MoCo needs too scrap everything and start over but I don't want it to. I find something very appealing in the H-D V-Twin regardless of the frame you hang it in and regardless of what everyone else in the world may be doing with engines. It is not the newest engine in the world but it is a good engine. I and think, admit it or not, that when things are going well you like that engine and that is the only reason you still have the bike. If not, there must be some bike out there you'd be happier with. I'm not trying to argue or criticize you, this is just polite conversation. I'm just replying to your post that says, in effect, that the things I like are doo doo and need to go away. Jack | ||
| Paint_shaker |
I like my carburated, push rod equipped, air cooled V-Twin!! I consider it an American hot rod and it rumbles as such. I am proud to park it anywhere!! | ||
| Rocketman |
Nothing could be simpler. "It is time for Buell to move into the 21st century", I believe is what I said. The XL motor is ok. It worked fine for me, sometimes. That isn't the problem. What is is Buells reluctance to build a brand new modern power plant that puts Buell on a par at least performance wise with most everyone else who are building from mild to wild factory customs. The XB motor, let's face it, looks like it belongs in a dump truck or a concrete mixer. Aesthetically speaking, at least the XL motor looked like a traditional engine that had a natural home in a motorcycle. So from a traditional standpoint Buell were right to put the XL motors into modern innovative chassis, but that is where it should have ended. The fact it didn't, and Buell launched the XB's is great (not for my taste though) but it needs to stop there. That rehashed power plant is holding Buell back, which of course is a conscious decision on Buells part, and with it came a new chassis / modular production and a new set of failings. It's all well and good bringing funky bikes to market, but how can a company as cash rich as Buell justify the unreliability of their product? One doesn't hear of other manufacturers with as many consistent problems like those that befit their XB platform. Wheel bearing failures are common place. Isolator failures too. Inherent running problems with the F.I system. Speedo sensors are common failures. Oil leaks are not unheard of. Clutch failures occur. Worse still, transmission failures are also well known. Goosed engines are not unheard of either. The list is endless. If the XB's were Ducatis Monster, Ducati would be bankrupt by now. People just wouldn't put up with it and sales would diminish significantly. Buell on the other hand get away with selling their (somewhat necessarily unreliable [profit / build cost] ) product because their cornerstone market is domestic, where patriotism comes first, and with it a bull headed attitude that the products majority of owners simply refuse to criticize no matter what because they see the product as flying the Stars and Stripes. Let me tell you, that attitude is bullshit. There's a big wide world out here and Buell dare not to do more than put a toe in the water and say 'Hey look what we can do. We can kick your arse if we want to', but frankly they never do. Witness Buells reluctance to race on a world scale, where it has to be said success will guarantee success on the saleroom floor too. Meanwhile those cany industry hungry Chinese and Far East nations are buying up or into companies like Benelli for example because they realise the European manufacturers are in the ascendancy and bringing to market modern motorcycles that can and do deliver everything and more that Buell can, except patriotism and some ridiculous nonsense that heralds a motorcycle faster in a corner than anyone else's. The fastest motorcycle in a corner is called a human being, without which a motorcycle wouldn't even stand up let alone get around a corner. Build a hot rod or stay home is what I say. Where's me meds  Rocket | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Well seeing that H-D owns Buell, I believe it would be up to H-D, ultimately, what power plant goes in the bike. Did you ever think that Buell would like to update to a newer motor, but is being held back by H-D? I think there is a lot more involved than just shoe horning a different motor in their bikes. | ||
| Blake |
"The XB motor, let's face it, looks like it belongs in a dump truck or a concrete mixer." I couldn't disagree more strongly. I think the XB engine, having rid itself of the Sportster gearcase (cam case) cover, the side mounted throttle body and the frontwards transversely mounted oil filter is a HUGE improvement in aesthetics over its predecessor. I do like the old style chromed steel pushrod covers though. Easy fix that.  | ||
| Blake |
"One doesn't hear of other manufacturers with as many consistent problems like those that befit their XB platform." You are joking right? That is the most absurd of statements. While we see everyone's XB problems reported here loud and clear - hey it's what we're here for, to help solve and console when stuff happens - but dear fellow in truth the statistics are not convincing at all in support of your stance, not at all. The actual truth is that the Buell XB and Blast bikes have proved to be among the most reliable motorcycles on the planet. As far as not racing on the world scene. There is this thing called "patience." Does Triumph race on the world scene? How about Benelli or all the other Italian marks besides Ducati? Buell is a cash rich company? Where do you get this stuff? | ||
| Blake |
It is bewildering how some folks confuse or equate the fact that "Buell doesn't build the motorcycle that I want" with the notion that "Buell motorcycles suck." | ||
| Jlnance |
If the XB's were Ducatis Monster, Ducati would be bankrupt by now. I thought Ducati was bankrupt? Buell on the other hand get away with selling their (somewhat necessarily unreliable [profit / build cost] ) product because their cornerstone market is domestic I thought Buell sold the majority of their bikes in Europe? Am I mistaken? | ||
| Glitch |
Am I mistaken? Only if you're talking about Buell before the XB platform. | ||
| Bomber |
Pssst, Sean -- Ducati IS bankrupt, bud -- don't say it too loud, though, I don't think they realize it | ||
| Brucelee |
Rocket is just going through one of his periods. One would think he was a woman in this regards. BTW R-man, I have an 2003 XB and it has none of the maladies you mention. Been pretty close to perfect for me. Let me weigh in with my wish list here. 1-A world class 6 speed trans that is lighter and shifts with a quiet click! I want to cruise at 70MPH at about 3200 RPMS or so. Also, make it lighter and smaller if possible. 2-Is there a way to see more of the engine? I love the way the engine looks and would like to be able to see more of it. Also, if the rear cylinder was not buried up in the frame, we would likely not need the bloody fan. 3-Get rid of the need for a fan. 4-Keep in air cooled. 5-Silent fuel pump please, I want to hear the engine, not the whine! 6-Lighter engine making about 110 HP, similar to the new BMW R1200R. 80 lbs of torque please. 7-Slightly more room in the frame ala the Long. 8-Different headlights for the L. They are a tad ugly. Ditto a new fly screen. All this and I will be happy on Christmas morning. Thanks Erik. | ||
| Rocketman |
The actual truth is that the Buell XB and Blast bikes have proved to be among the most reliable motorcycles on the planet You are only the second person in history to flaunt such statement. SHOW ME THE PROOF. Where are these stat's you speak of? Go to any other forum, be it for Triumph (who won a TT race two years ago  ) Ducati, Hyosung or whoever and you will not see so many owners reporting such a wide range of problems and as frequently as those do who own Buells. Someone please show me where Ducati are reported as bankrupt? BANKRUPT??? Rocket | ||
| Brucelee |
There is no externally verified data on repair frequency of any Motorcycle company that I am aware of. Defect rates are unknown to us all. Anecdote prevails!!!!! I am aware of Safety Recall data but I have never reviewed these data. Anyone? | ||
| Davegess |
Ducati is not bankrupt but only because they manage to find sucke... i mean investors to buy out the previous suc... I mean investors. They spendt a huge amount of the TPG money and did make some small profits but not nearly enough to make the owners happy. After much work TPG found a buyer who not only had to cover TPG's investment but had to assure the bankers that they were good for loses. without this the bankers would have pulled the plug. Not that I don't like Ducati, neat bikes I even own some stock. Bought it for ten bucks, it is now worth about 3 and has never paid a dividend so I my mind the company is not exactly doing real fell financially. |
