| Author | Message | ||
     Pwnzor |
Behold, the Gretel-matic 3000!  | ||
| Brineusaf |
thats cute, but the whole page is running very slow now... or maybe it's just this work computer | ||
| Imeazy |
Very cool. It ran slow here the first time around but after the whole thing loaded it looks great. Thanks for sharing. That is one awesome turtle. I could use about a dozen or so to help groom my lawn! | ||
| Light_keeper |
Don't let Tramp see that.  | ||
| Pwnzor |
She is a russian tortoise, but I won't tell her you said she's a turtle! Her favorite things to eat are the water hyacinths in my pond. My neighbors found her in the yard, their dog was biting through her shell, had punctured the carapace in 4 places, and she was bleeding. They brought her over to me, because they knew my mom keeps turtles (not tortoises) and thought I could pass her along to a good home. WELL, mom was out of town, and Maggie and I got sad watching the tortoise sitting in a little cage, so we named her Gretel and set her loose in the yard. Now she has breakfast and dinner served to her in front of her house (the bush by the living room window) and she patrols the yard all day. She is a lot faster than you might imagine, and we have to keep the gate securely latched. Her wounds have all healed nicely. I think Tramp would like her. (Message edited by pwnzor on August 29, 2006) | ||
| Bomber |
Pwnzor -- learn me up, sir -- what's the diff tween and turtle and a toroise? | ||
| Pwnzor |
CLICK HERE for a short informative article on the difference between turtles, tortoises, and terrapins. If you find the article informative and want to get involved, please CLICK HERE. Easiest way to tell for sure between turtle and tortoise is this: turtles usually have webbed toes. Tortoises NEVER have webbed toes. I've been rescuing animals my whole life, bringing home birds and stray cats and snakes. Lucky for me, mom was(is) a science teacher and she would always help me find room for the new family members. The only animal I have ever purchased have been fish, although I have rescued thousands of them over the years as well. | ||
| Imeazy |
Pwnzor - Sorry... dayem... I need some sleep somethin fierce. Or to just quit posting... | ||
| Bomber |
Thanks you P -- you've helped me reach my daily goal -- learn sumpin new every day -- I tried to bring home a "rescued" snapping turtle when I was about 11 -- he wasn't interested in being rescued, and put a helluva dent in the bottom of one of Mom's good cooking pans -- neither Mom nore the snapper were amused | ||
| Pwnzor |
On the subject of rescuing animals, when I bought the house I live in now, the three little ponds in the backyard were nothing more than mud puddles with a bunch of fish gasping for air, and rotting uneaten food floating all over the place. Now it looks something like this:  Only 2 of the fish have died, so far. They were definitely beyond help so I euthanized them. Several of them were trying to eat each other because they were starving, so I had to separate and debrief them. They all seem to be adjusting well and I have added a small red-eared slider turtle (another rescue) to the ecosystem. She is very elusive and hard to photograph, this is the best shot I have so far. Should have taken her picture before I put her in. She's about 3 inches long and cute as a button.  | ||
| Beachbuell |
Dude, turtles and tortoises rock! I'd like to get a tortoise and let it roam our HUGE backyard. I especially like Sea Turtles, being from South Florida there is a variety of sea life here and I love em all (mostly). | ||
| Bomber |
P -- I should get your help in converting the sad, boring pond we got at Festung Bomber -- any places I can tlook for goo data (keeping in mind that I am most definately NOT the green thumb in the family)? thanks! | ||
| Pwnzor |
Here's a few tips, since it will be at least 18 months before I am in Chicago again. Lots of plant life. Use water plants, both floating and rooted inside the pond. Outside the pond, use vegetation of varying height. Graduate the plants vertically from the edge of the pond, moving outward. Use rocks at the water's edge, and hang them over the edge of the pond liner. This helps to keep certain wayward turtles from walking away. It's not foolproof though, turtles are very clever and relentless. The look I was going for was an obscure waterline. I guarantee you can't tell me the actual size or shape of the pond, because I have hidden this from casual view. Just like nature does, I have tried to make it's beauty more than skin deep. Beautiful on the outside, and when you look closer the detail and the contents continue to amaze the the discoverer. One thing about a pond, that many forget because it is outside. Regardless of being in the open air, it is a closed ecosystem. There is nowhere for solid or liquid wastes to escape. Leaves and other vegetation falling in and sinking to the bottom where it rots, compound this problem. This is where the plants living in the water become very important. The more plants you have, the less chemical filtration you will need. Let's talk a bit about filtration. There are three basic types of filtration present in any aquatic environment, man made or natural. Mechanical, chemical and biological filtration. Mechanical is just as it sounds, removing large particulate matter from the water as it flows through the filter media. Generally some type of coarse foam or spongy material is used. In nature, exposed roots and other underwater flora serve as a mechanical filter. Chemical filtration is basically the extraction or absorbtion of harmful chemicals and soluable heavy metals which are found in water that comes from municipal water systems. Generally a sack filled with crushed activated carbon is used. In nature, again the exposed roots and underwater flora play a big part in removing harmful chemicals by respiration. Biological filtration utilizes bacteria (nitrosomonas) to convert ammonia, which is the primary by-product of the decomposition process, into nitrite which is less toxic. It then further utilizes another bacteria (nitrobacter) to convert the nitrite into nitrate. Nitrates, being the least toxic of the three, are controlled by changing the water. This is physically draining "old" water and replacing similar amounts of "new" water. This occurs naturally on all exposed surfaces beneath the water line. Special media is available which is specifically designed to offer maximum surface area in a small space. Having said all that, my suggestion for someone starting a new pond is to get it all set up and start planting it. One or two fat guppies in there will make sure no mosquitoes set up shop during this phase. Get your plant situation the way you want it and your pumps or fountains running. Watch over the first couple of weeks for the water to get cloudy. Once it does, wait, maybe as much as 28 days or more, until the water clears on it's own. Small daily water changes (10%) will facilitate this. Then, only after the water has cleared, should you begin adding livestock. I suggest 2 or 3 medium sized fish. Watch them for 2 weeks and see if the water clouds again. If so, wait for it to clear before adding more fish. Here is WHY: By adding animals to your ecosystem you are introducing a new waste stream. The pond itself, every bit of surface area will gradually be covered with the bacteria I mentioned above. You can't bombard that process with too much livestock at once. On a much smaller scale, that is exactly how our government ruined Yellowstone park. The relationship is symbiotic and maintains a balance all on it's own with very little help from humans. But you must establish it very gradually. By doing so, you will save a lot of money and headaches. Patience is key, you need to have about 15 minutes EVERY day to physically check for dead animals or whatever might have fallen in. Once a week, plan on spending about 2 hours maintaining everything. A dead rat in your pond can ruin everything unless it has been a very well established pond for years. Even then, it can have devastating results, because the pond has a liner, and nothing gets out of the water unless you take it out. Strong argument for targeted feeding, not just throwing food in the water. I'm starting to ramble now, I hope this helped a bit and wasn't too boring. Here are a couple of links to a pond and aquarists' forums. Kind of like BadWeB for fish. Aquarium Hobbyist Pond Hobbyist I'll do my best to answer any questions. | ||
| Bomber |
P -- thanks a million for this data -- I'll be digesting it for a long far -- just for clarification, though the "pond" is man made, there's no liner -- it's a hole in the ground dug by a previous owner, primarily to keep the structures on the property from being consumed by the spring run-off (the soil round here is, well, suffice it to say there was a brick factory near here from the late 1800s til the mid 1960s) -- the water is generally about 100 feet from end to end, 40 feet across the other dimension, and 4 feet deep in teh spring to 18 inches deep during a dry spell -- the bottom of the pond is silt and small rocks -- the level varies on given rainfall and snowmelt -- we've got an aerator (sparys water up about 2 feets) to keep the pond from turing into a smelly mess -- I'm thinkin filtration would turn into a maintenance nightware given all that -- thanks again, and let me know when you're near the city of big shoulder -- I got some excellent single malt, and I'm not anywhere near being above begging for expertise I ain't got ;-} | ||
| Pwnzor |
Ok, that's a really large pond, a bit beyond the scale I'm used to but the rules are all the same. In a body of water that large, it's important to try and keep it circulating as much as possible. Click HERE to see some fountains for larger ponds. The amount of livestock you can keep will depend on how much water you can move, it's supply and demand for oxygen. Based on your description this pond qualifies as being a part of the natural aquifer. Are there fish in the pond now? I'd start by testing the water for pH, Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate. As close to 7 as possible for the pH is where you want to be. If the Nitrate (NO3) is relatively low, 0-60 ppm then whatever plant life is in the pond already is likely healthy. If the Ammonia (NH3) is over 8ppm it's unlikely you'll be able to keep livestock until after a long period of steady planting. Unless of course you have some way to pump out about half the water and replace it with fresh water...? BTW, "single malt" are magic words to me. (Message edited by pwnzor on August 29, 2006) | ||
| Imeazy |
Pwnzor - Thanks for all the pond info. Some good stuff. I plan on creating one in my back yard next spring. This will be very helpful. Tell Gretel I apoligize.  Diregard my prior post... been having a rough day. | ||
| Pwnzor |
If she can handle being attacked by a dog 20 times her size, she can handle a little internet chatter. On the subject of ponds again, if you're starting a new one, I highly recommend using a flexible liner and shaping the hole in the ground yourself. It's a little more work, but I think the payoff will be worth it. Plus it allows you to use the space you have more effectively. Also it means you don't have the same shape pond as the guy down the street. | ||
| Ceejay |
Bombs-you may be better to dig it out about 8 more feet, at least in one end, bobcat would do the trick and get the water to start circulating itself, as in warm and cold spots continually changing, course ifnyer in town, there's lots of things going on under there that might not make it possible... | ||
| Imeazy |
That's exactly what I plan to do. I have a friend that has one of the plastic ones and I don't care for it. Although his garden is beautiful when he takes care of it. I dug a 6' x 8' pond at my last house for some ducks and geese my kids and I raised. It was cool, but didn't hold the water very well as I didn't line it. I would top it off every other day with a hose. I have a 10' x 20' foot space between my house and garage that I plan to create this one in. Maybe next year I'll be able to post some pics if all goes well. Thanks again... | ||
| Ceejay |
turtles are cool cept when your swimming with em... | ||
| Pwnzor |
When I got my Openwater II cert, I swam with a very large turtle for about 20 minutes off St John's bay, US Virgin Islands. It was possibly one of the most beautiful animals I have ever observed, didn't mind being touched or anything. I think I was a curiosity to him, and he could have snapped my arm or leg off if he really wanted to. His(her?) carapace must have been 7 feet long, although underwater through the lens things look a bit larger. He was definitely bigger than me though. It swam off very suddenly, and it made me feel sad for some reason. It also made me look all around to make sure something BIGGER didn't scare it off! | ||
| Ceejay |
I grew up, as many did, swimming in the local fishing holes around my home, guess I was reffering to how nervous I would get when swimming with a young female knowing full well that turtles can see underwater and I can't... I still likes em, and are way cool to have around, and would probably be awestruck at the sight of a turtle that damn big... Went fishing in the gulf a few yrs ago, about 10 miles out I was amazed at how clear the water was, and was striping down to jump in, when my soon to be father in law asked if he could put a hook in my foot first, I gave him a puzzled look...then I looked over the boat and saw what must have been a shadowy ten foot tiger swim by. I put my shirt back on.. | ||
| Luvthemtorts |
Pwnzor, Nice Russian you have there. Thought I would share a picture of a new acquistion to my breeding colony. Just picked up 2 males and this big girl. They are Geochelone Platynota aka Burmese Star Tortoise(not to be confused with the more common Indian Star Tortoise. Estimated to be less than 75 left in the wild with captive breeding their only hope for future survival). I have produced many over the past several years and hope to be able to increase and diversify my bloodlines with the new animals. I think this will also clear up some confusion regarding my screenname. Many people think I am a lawyer but it actually stems from my love of keeping and breeding rare and endangered turtle and tortoise species.  | ||
| Pwnzor |
After my Openwater 1, I got my night diving cert. In that class they taught us to pretty much disregard scary things you might see under the water. The divemaster told us, "if you see something in your torchlight that disturbs you, turn your torch 180 degrees to face the opposite direction and forget about it. If, in the event you see another one or more of them, having already redirected the torchlight, slowly get out of the water." He was (still is) a Brit, a Londoner to be specific. Had all kinds of great sayings and was a very experienced ice diver. We had great fun together off the tip of Argentina in '88 when I failed my Ice Diving certification. Damn drysuit kept flooding, and down I would go, dragging him with me. Talked to him about a year ago, we laughed about it. I never retested for it, but then I never had another chance to swim inside an iceberg. Some of the shrimp there look like pieces of glass flying through the water. | ||
| Ceejay |
While turtles are a reptile, are they as much an indicator species as amphibians are to both water and air quality? wondering why it-Burmese Star, is heading for extinction... | ||
| Pwnzor |
Jackie, She is absolutely gorgeous. My mom belongs to a big turtle/tortoise club out here, she's going to love seeing this. I've bred various fish and reptiles over the years, mostly impromptu. I've had columbian red tail boas that snuck into each others' cage, mated, and returned to their own cages like nothing happened. Suddenly there's a lot more snakes than there were before and I had to be a reptilian gumshoe to sort it all out. Lots of fish I've bred, too many to list. Mostly s. american cichlids and a few africans. Various birds, frogs, lizards. What you are doing to preserve the species is highly admirable, and I commend you for it. Gretel was a rescue as I mentioned, but Maggie and I are now so attached to her that we're considering trying to adopt a friend for her. Do tortoises need companionship in that way or are they basically stoic, indifferent other than for mating purposes? Thanks for posting that picture, feel free to email me as many pictures as you want at pwnzor@zero3nine.com ps, if you want me to make an animation for you like the one at the beginning of the thread, email me a series of pictures you want and I can put it together for you. That's assuming you don't already possess that capability, but I'd love to make one with that beautiful creature. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Tangent-- On the subject of SCUBA diving, and having been down there below Argentina that one time, I was really hoping beyond hope to see a Narwhal. I was so jazzed up all the way down there on the plane and for weeks beforehand. I just KNEW I was going to see one. I knew they were shy and kept to deep waters in the summer, but it was autumn and the waters were rough so I thought my chances were pretty good. Then I asked the divemaster if he'd ever seen one down here. He shattered my reality by letting me know I would need a video screen and a satellite feed if I wanted to see one here, as they live in the ARCTIC circle, not the ANTARCTIC... I was so disappointed by that but Jon the divemaster from London did his best to keep me happy and it was still a good trip even though I kept sinking and failed my test. I still want to see one... the unicorns of the sea.   | ||
| Luvthemtorts |
Headed for extinction because the locals eat them themselves and sell them to other Oriental food markets. Last field study yielded 5 tortoises for 400 hours searching with trained dogs! It's a sad thing. Pwnzor, Thanks for the kind words! Sounds like you have made quite a few achievements yourself. I have successfully kept and produced Gila Monsters, Red Pygmy Rattlesnakes, Indian Star Tortoise, Burmese Star Tortoise, Flowerback Box Turtle, McCords Box Turtle, Chinese Box Turtle, Pancake Tortoise, Red Eyed Cocodile Skink, Prehensile Tailed Skink, Red Tailed Boa, Rosy Boa, Kenyan Sand Boa among others although my true passion is for Chelonia (shelled critters). I would love to have a stop motion series made. I will wait until they are breeding again or until another egg hatches so it will be somewhat entertaining for the rest of the group. Tortoises are generally solitary although there are exceptions. They don't really seek companionship but seem to congregate to share basking areas as well as choice burrows and hiding spots. Is you mom by chance of the CTTC? Ceejay, Amphibians generally are a much better indicator of water quality due to the fact that toxins are easily absorbed through their skin which can not only affect respiration but cause systemic issues as well.. They also tend to be a bit more delicate to begin with in general oftentimes requiring specialized microhabitats to function and thrive properly. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Jackie, I believe that is the club. Either that or it's affiliated somehow because I'm sure I remember seeing that name on some papers. I'll verify it with her tomorrow. When you shoot for a stop-action set, use a tripod always. Stop action exaggerates any variation in the background scenery. My suggestions for best results are to keep the action within the frame without moving the camera. Experiment with the angle a bit. Panoramic shots work well by turning the camera at intervals and preventing any up-down motion in the frame. The faster you can shoot, the smoother the animation will be. Also, the more frames you shoot the larger the file will get. I can compress it to different levels which will degrade the quality accordingly. I can also put in titles and stuff. On the subject of amphibians, I knew I had restored the balance in my ponds when I began hearing bullfrogs singing to me in the wee hours. They adopted my pond and me, they tolerate me reaching into the pond while they sit idly by. Here's the male, I believe these are the non-indigenous invaders imported by traders from South America in the last 150 years or so. Considered a pest, and in the south there are eradication programs.  I'm sure this one is male because of his large "ear". I've yet to photograph anymore than the eyeballs of the female, but when I saw her out of the water, hers are much smaller. Look at that face, how could anyone call him a pest? Their songs are very peaceful to me.  I have seen a bubble nest on two occasions but alas, no tadpoles yet. I think the fish would devour them. After the last bubble nest I decided to fill the smallest pond with hyacinths and removed all but the smallest fish into the other ponds. Hoping that the froggies will move their nuptial activities over there, but nothing so far. Any time you're ready just email the pics with a description of what you want. If your files are very large and your email provider won't let you send them all, I have an FTP server for guests to upload large files. Let me know if you need the settings and/or instructions on how to use it. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Another note on the bullfrogs. Maggie was looking out the sliding glass door at the pond one morning and watching the birds landing on the lilly pads and taking their baths, and having a drink of water.... ....when suddenly like a flash of green lightning, the mighty frog springs forth, blasting water and bits of foliage everywhere, SNATCHED A HUMMINGBIRD IN FLIGHT, and disappeared beneath the surface once again. I really need to train a camera on a continuous loop out there. We've seen some things in the yard that are hard to believe. The dragonflies have been doing a lot of mating out there lately as well. Little blue ones and big fuzzy orange ones. I knew that the larvae would attack and consume small fish, but I never realized that the adults will actually hunt fish from the air! Saw one snatch a mid-sized guppy right out of the water and up he went to presumably consume his prey in horrible fashion. I've restocked the ponds twice now with about 150 guppies each time. Got some interesting tail patterns emerging among the survivors. The frogs like to eat them and I definitely want more dragonflies so I'll keep stocking the little guys as the numbers dwindle. Ahhh, the circle of life. |
