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Buell Forum » Knowledge Vault (tech, parts, apparel, & accessories topics) » Troubleshooting (Poor Starting/Running/Handling/Ride Issues) » Archive through May 25, 2007 » Your Thought's of whats happening « Previous Next »

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Cringblast
Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 07:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

07 XB12R Just over 5k miles.
Has been surging. 1st gear slow throttle role slight surge. 2nd gear same. 3rd gear same. 3rd gear steady 3000rpm slight surge.
4th gear less surge, ever so slight but I feel it and same at steady throttle at about 3k and 5th felt none at all. most surges guess all at 3500rpm and less. Felt nothing 3500 or more. Bike has done this since I got it so I thought it was norm. But, after reading badweb and over 5k miles on the bike I started to think other wise. When I feel the surge the tach does not move. Idle no probs.
3 weeks ago got on it (wot)at 1st gear and sounded like a crushing aluminum can. Can repeat that gettin on in 1st through 3rd gear going to wot at about 3k rpm. Sort of sounded like spark knock? I've been putting 93oct since day one. Decided to take to the dealer and tell them whats up. told them same as above. Gonna get the bike tomorrow and they told me they did a tps reset and added a fuel additive and it is running fine. Dealership has been very cool. Just wanted to get a few thoughts from you all. Thanks,C
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Littlefield
Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 08:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I don't know about the crushing aluminum cans thing but I've been amazed at how big a difference zeroing the TPS can make.
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Cringblast
Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2007 - 09:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Got it back this eve.
They did a TPS reset and they rode it. Added a little fuel additive.
Much better.
The dealership was very cool and did
not charge for anything. $0.00
Have to say, they were excellent.
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Sparky
Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 12:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Thank your lucky stars: You have a dealer who wants their customers satisfied.

So, what's the trick, did you buy the bike from them?
Do they work on out-of-state bikes? Just kidding.: )

Glad for you they got it fixed.
Cheers.
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Blake
Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 05:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Thanks for the update! : )
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Cringblast
Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 09:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Sparky,
I got the bike from them.
The service Dept there seems very cool.
They even have the Buell's out front, outside and a TT inside, in the front when you walk in.
No bs so far, I was kinda getten ready for it from reading things here. As time goes on I hope to take care of things my self to an extent. I am sure they would take out of state probs as if it was down the street. C.
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Blake
Posted on Saturday, April 21, 2007 - 07:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

One question. What kind of fuel additive did they use? A detergent type combustion chamber cleaning additive or an octane booster additive?
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Cringblast
Posted on Saturday, April 21, 2007 - 10:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

It's Harley Fuel additive.
1/3oz to treat 5 gallons.
It's like a oct boost and cleaner.
They said to add 1/3oz every few
tank fulls.
When I was talking to them about it
in the service shop I noticed that a few
of the tech's had some at their work area.
Talked to the lead tech about it and he said no prob using every now and then.
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Saszta
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 12:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I was looking for the product you're mentioning (octane boost/cleaner) and I only found one Harley product that's an octane booster but it says nothing about being a cleaner as well. I'm having the same issues you had and wanted to get the exact same stuff. Is there anything on the bottle that can help describe it better?

(correction: it does mention that it cleans the fuel system))

thanks.

(Message edited by saszta on May 02, 2007)
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Saszta
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 12:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

here, I found a pic of what I was talking about. Is this what you got?

Harley Fuell Additive
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Sparky
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 02:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Duralt is the active ingredient in the Harley Fuel Additive. If you can find Duralt in auto parts stores, that would be better because, I believe, it is more concentrated than the HD product.

I once bought the 100% stuff from a vendor for my Harley and it made a remarkable improvement in driveability and throttle response. I can't say the same for the HD stuff, but if you try it, you'll probably notice some kind of improvement. YMMV.
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Cringblast
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 03:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta thats what I got.
It was about $5.95
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Saszta
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 04:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I picked some up and in it went. No difference so far but I haven't gone through the tank yet.

Next step is check air intakes for leaks, fuel pressure, and another TPS reset. If all that does not cure it then I don't know what else man...I'm getting a little pissed. It's a pretty common issue from what I see reading many posts here, but the solution seems pretty variable.
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Sparky
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 07:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta, what are your exact symptoms and when did the problems start?

The vast majority of XB Buellers don't have these problems. But yet when they do, it's usually related to an attempt to improve performance in which case the problems stem from the mechanic's workmanship or lack thereof, I'll betcha.
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Cringblast
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 08:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta,
Mine has done it since I rode it off the showroom floor.
Never owned a bike before much less a v-twin. Had thoughts about it, so thats why the beginning post. Before I took it in I rode a xb9sx, my dad's 2007. It did the same but on a smaller scale. He rode mine and noticed what I was trying to explain earlier. We did a TPS reset twice and it made no difference at all. He's got the software to do it. So at that point I was like ok, I decided to take it in and told them exactly what I wrote above they did what I wrote above. So know it's had 3 TPS reset's. At first it was a little better. But now it is the same. I am kinda paranoid about having to add fuel additive every tank full on a brand new bike, does not seem right to me, so I have decided to do it every 250 miles. I know no one near me to talk about this with or even ride to pursue it. All I can go on is what people say here and their knowledge about this. So for know I just accept the way it runs. Should a Buell xb12r with a smacked out sportster engine run/ride smooth ? I have no idea.
I have read write ups on other bike in magazines that they feel like a caged pitbull below 3k rpm. To be honest thats what this feels like.
It's stock for now. I got a Special Ops pipe on they way. Gonna run stock ecm and air filter at first and go from there. I know its hard to fix things over the internet, but I think, this is a good place to start.
C.

(Message edited by cringblast on May 02, 2007)
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Saszta
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 10:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Sparky,
the surging was present when I bought it from previous owner and thought it just needed a tune up (stupid me).
Anyway, all I've done to modify is add a drummer exhaust. I've reset TPS at dealer that's when idle started to hang around 2k rpm for a few seconds when coasting to a stop after riding when the bike is warm. That I'm thinking is a bad reset and it needs to be done again but the surging is something else, I believe. I've got new plugs, plug wires, air filter and checked the engine temp sensor. I'm thinking now that it may be a bad fuel pump or an intake manifold leak. BTW, anyone know how to test the fuel pressure?

Cringblast, check this guy's profile:
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/boar d-profile.cgi?action=view_profile&profile=naustin- users

He mentions similar problems and for him it was due to an intake manifold leak and faulty exhaust baffle...maybe you also have a leak or a faulty fuel pump or fuel pump short. These are just stabs in the dark but at least may give you some place to start looking other than a TPS reset.

Good luck, please post any news/findings as I will as well.
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Sparky
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 02:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta, the last part of doing a TPS reset job is readjusting the idle rpms to 1050. If yours is idling at 1050, try setting it a little lower, say 1000 or 900 just to see if it idles down normally.

Surging can be attributed to mechanical causes like leaks at intake manifold or exhaust gaskets, or the muffler joint at the head pipe as well as electronic causes like TPS calibration, degraded O2 and other sensors. The bike needs to be mechanically perfect (no intake/exhaust leaks that is) before doing any EFI troubleshooting.

Do you run oxygenated fuel? Does the engine ping? Have you ridden the bike at 3000 rpms for 5 minutes or so to adjust the AFV?

Did the previous owner change or do anything to cause the surging problem? Do you have its service history?

Sorry for asking all the questions, but knowing a little background gives one a direction to pursue, at least over the internet, ya know. There has to be one area in the haystack to look for the needle.
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Saszta
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 09:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Ya, I hear ya Sparky. Very true.
I'm kinda hijacking Cringblast's post here so I'll direct you to the post I started concerning my problems.
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/275052.html?1178121568

I've answered your questions in my post.

Thanks for helping out.
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Cringblast
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 10:04 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta,
I am going to check some things recommended
by Sparky. I'll let ya know what happens.
Thanks Sparky for the info.
C.
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Naustin
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 10:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Saszta, I have a 2001 Tuber, not an xb, but replacing the intake seals did wonders for my bike. You can read about the specifics in my profile...

(Message edited by naustin on May 03, 2007)
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Saszta
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 06:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I think you're right on the money Naustin.

Cringblast, I have an update, check:
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/275052.html?1178230398
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