| Author | Message | ||
     Lsr_Bbs |
Brad, The rear cover will have the pcv hole in the wrong place when using the blast covers. You have to drill a new one...it's no big deal, I was tired and got sloppy with predictable results. Neil Garretson X0.5 | ||
| Ara |
Reepicheep, that's a beautifully simple setup! I've got a theory on why your filter gets satureated. Since the cylinders are 45 degrees out of phase, the puffs of crankcase gases in the breather system should also be out of phase. I imagine that any liquids in the lower loop of your system would be "blown" back and forth by alternating puffs of breather gasses, perhaps enough to keep some of the liquids sufficiently airborne to get your filter damp. Your idea to put a T in the lower loop and attach a catch hose there would give the liquids somewhere to go out of the airflow and should keep the filter dryer. You could even use a T that has a 1/2 leg so your catch tube would have more capacity. What do you think? Russ | ||
| Sportyeric |
Finland! Dang! That was bait for the Yankees, so I could make fun of the boring money they have. One toonie=two loonies. The Loonie is the Canadian $1 coin, which has a picture of a loon on it. Some people thought a $1 coin was a loony idea. Get it? They were going to put two stags on the $2 coin so we could call it "two bucks", but they didn't. It's about 2cm.,which is about 7/8". Mind, that's after a thorough flailing on an old engine. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Ara... could be. The T at the lowest point might sort that out, but the stuff that comes out is so thick that I don't think it would make much difference. Though a short section of clear tubing would be cool... to see when it needs draining. Hmmmm.... I think it is just a matter of a gas coming out the breathers hitting a cooler temperature at the breather filter and condensing. The water evaporates, the oil stays, and after 500 to 1000 miles, it has got to be washed out. A longer tubing run of some sort would be one solution, so things would evaporate before hitting the crankcase filter, or a proper catch can (which would have the same effect on condensation). Both those solutions worry me that they could impair breathing though, or just require too much plumbing and too many parts bolted to my bike. As it is, I just run my thumb on the bottom of the breather filter after I pull in the garage. If it comes out wet, I pull it off and bring it in to wash out. If not I wait until next time. Nothing to it. So it does not reach my pain threshold to bother installing another T... though if somebody else does and it helps, I would love to know  . I did not mention in the original post that there are two other sections of tubing involved, each straight and about an inch long, that go from each "T" to each breather port. I sized them so the loop is about half an inch proud of the frame. I cable tied all the hidden joints, and leave the two obvious joints on the visable brass tee untied to make it easy to drain the bottom "catch tube". The connections to the filter are not secured either (to make it easy to pull and clean). It never came off, though I did forget to put it back on before a ride once.... | ||
| Doncasto |
Here's my version of the "el Cheepo" catch can. Although it looks like just a coffee can, there is a purpose beyond the intended "goof" on HD. The actual catch can inside is schedule 40 PVC, and prone to melting. The coffee can also serves as a sheild.  | ||
| Ara |
Reepicheep, I think your theory has more merit than my own. Here I was worried about how long my breather filter hoses are, and it may be that they're just the thing! I still think your breather design is beautifully simple. Russ | ||
| Reepicheep |
Russ... you may be right, the longer tubing may take care of that nicely. You will still need a trap of some sort to catch the stuff thats condensing, and you don't want the trap to become a plug or it will get blown out all at once. Real Credit goes to Jose' and Aaron for both being stubborn, smart, and persistant enough to really work out how these breathers work and what they are doing. Once they hashed that all out the rest was obvious. I guess Odd gets credit (of Odd's cycle shop), for stocking the dual nipple breather and pointing it out to me when I asked him about what the Sportster guys do. I also worry about longer lines getting pinched somehow, but careful routing should be able to manage that. Bill | ||
| Rick_A |
My breather set up that seemed to be working nicely I found isn't. I have a T going down to a draintube and up to a filter under the tail. The tube gets all the junk but the oil still ends up on my tire  It seems that when the filter gets wet it spews its oily residue. So, I think I'll just run a damn plain hose out to my license plate. Other than that my Buell is completely free of external oil  | ||
| Ara |
Rick, you have a single T that splits between a drain tube and a filter? Is that for each cylinder or are the two breather lines T'd together and then split? If you could draw it or photograph it, we might be able to offer some suggestions. Russ | ||
| Blake |
Guys, both cylinders vent to the same volume, the crankcase, which then vents simultaneously to both rockerboxes; each cylinder therefore vents to both breather ports simultaneously right? | ||
| Reepicheep |
Err... Oh yea.  They would, wouldn't they. Easy to forget that, because by the time you run the tubing they are a foot apart Though because of the umbrella valves, I guess the liquid path out the breathers really is separate off both heads, even though the gas path is not. | ||
| Ara |
And by the same token, any blockages or design design deficiencies in the breather system will effect the whole engine. All the more reason observe two basic principles: 1) Use Gravity, Don't Fight It. Make sure that all breather hoses trend downward from the breather fittings, with no level or upward sections. 2) Preserve the volumetric efficiency of the breather system by running separate breather lines. Tee-ing them together reduces the volumetric efficiency by more than half. Russ | ||
| Rick_A |
Ara, my breather tubes T together right off the heads and that single tube T's again, with a drain hose going down and a vent line going up...now to my license plate...as per this sophisticated illustration:  The way it was, the filter would apparently expel the accumulated oily mist when it got wet after a washing or after riding in the rain. I don't dig that squirrely feeling...or the crap on my wheels. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
I don't know about Aaron, I think he actually UNDERSTANDS this stuff. I just had a service manual and a scanner........ | ||
| Ara |
Rick, if you can figure a way to get your breather lines to go immediately downward from the breather fittings, you will quite likely see improvment in the way your breather system functions. This will involve turning your breather fittings 180 degress to point downward if they are L shaped. If they're straight, it's a hose rerouting operation. As it is now you are very likely accumulating liquids in the breather fittings, the rocker boxs at the breather fittings, and in the upward lengths of breather hose. That accumulated liquid is essentially a liquid plug. Another thing that you should consider is separating the lines rather than T-ing them together. I and others who have done these things have noted considerable improvement. Russ | ||
| Ara |
Jose', you're tooooooo modest!  | ||
| Aaron |
Impovement in what? Forgive me for being skeptical, but I keep hearing this claim that it's important to run two separate hoses, but I don't see any evidence that one is inusfficient, and I see LOTS of evidence that one is fine. I don't understand the concern. | ||
| Blake |
Guys, I think y'all are getting a bit carried away with this breather issue. Isn't the stock system joined by a "T"? I do agree that it's best to maintain a down-slope before the catch can. After the catch can, it shouldn't matter. | ||
| Ara |
Aaron, Sportyeric reported that when he de-Teed his breathers his base gaskets quit leaking. I was surprised at that myself. That's probably not typical, but does demonstrate that the breather system performs an important function. That being the case, optimizing the performance of that system would be desirable. Wouldn't it? Blake, yes but the stock system also feeds the goo into the carburetor and therefore the design is suspect. We know that some design compromises are necessary for the factory to comply with federal noise and emmission regulations. Believe me, I'm NOT saying, "Your bike won't run right unless you mod the breater system." I'm saying that if you're having breather system related problems there are some things you can do about it. Russ | ||
| Aaron |
What if I said I teed them into 1 and stopped a leak? I'm just really reluctant to draw such strong conclusions based on such a small study, particularly with so much conflicting evidence. To each his own. | ||
| Djkaplan |
Hell, I got my breather lines tee'd and going up. I can't find any evidence of a liquid plug in the lines at all or in the heads at all. | ||
| Rick_A |
Hmmm...I don't know...if I tee them down immediately off the head fittings I may get more than my little catch tube can handle. As it is I get just a little bit of oily water to drain every few hundred miles. I like it like that. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
I spoke with our Buell mechanic, and he thinks that Buell finally cured the puking on the Firebolt. He credits the reed valve that was placed between the crankcase and the cam cover. He has not seen any puking at all from the Firebolt that we rode last weekend.  | ||
| José_Quiñones |
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| Sandstorm |
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| Sandstorm |
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| Buellistic |
ATT:Buellers Think about this one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Individual breathers for each head and timming plug hole. Use a reed valve so each breather blows air out ,but does not suck in air. Between the reed valve and engine a oil/air seperator. In buelling BUELLISTIC and/or Hardley-Harley | ||
| Sandstorm |
I have this setup and have no problems  | ||
| Sandstorm |
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| Sandstorm |
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