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Tlrracer
Posted on Tuesday, February 12, 2019 - 09:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

New to Buells not to bikes. Have ridden/raced many different machines from NSR250Rs to Ducati 750s to TLRs all super fun. Im going to pull the trigger on a 9SX or 12S this month. My question is: which would handle better/be more fun in the twisters for an ex-racer?
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Bartimus
Posted on Tuesday, February 12, 2019 - 10:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

They basically have the same chassis, so there is no difference between the two where handling is concerned.
The 9 revs higher, and therefore, seems quicker, but the 12 makes more power and torque.
Personally, I prefer the 9, I just like the powerband compared to the 12...
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Froggy
Posted on Tuesday, February 12, 2019 - 10:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Assuming the same year on both, both will handle identically.

Same chassis, suspension, tires, etc. The differences are internals of the motor (longer stroke), and cosmetic bits like hand guards.
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Tlrracer
Posted on Tuesday, February 12, 2019 - 11:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Super helpful. I gleaned as much from reading about XBs for two years but nice to hear it from you guys.
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1_mike
Posted on Tuesday, February 12, 2019 - 12:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've had my 12s for a "few" years. Along with an RX and an 1125CR.

The RX makes the most power, handles reasonably well.

The CR...just something about it..!?

The little XB12s, while under powered compared to the other two...the handling can't be matched by the other two. And even though it has a tougher time hauling my butt around (245lbs.), it gets me through Los Angeles morning and afternoon traffic much easier than either of the other two. And, more fun doing it, just because of its being so nimble/easy to change directions.

Mark me down for the 12, just because of the power. As said, the rest of the chassis is the same on both bikes.

Mike
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Tlrracer
Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2019 - 07:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks Mike,
The 9 is an 08 and the 12 is an 07. I know they made changes to the 2008 engine. Is it a big enough diff to sway the conversation? Plus the bike I buy will have to carry 100 pounds less than your machine.
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Tleighbell
Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2019 - 03:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

a lot of people, me included, like the 9 engine in the S frame. Less torque and power but sweeter running. And you can add power if you want to. Also, there have been crank failures reported on the 07 1200 engine, not sure if it affects all models or just the Uly. Others with more experience will know more about the value of the engine upgrades on 2008. I understand the upgraded crank is more durable. I would personally go for the 08.
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1_mike
Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2019 - 03:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yes, the newer engines have some better internal pieces than early engines, (oval ignition housing vs early, round ign. housing).
Though I'm not aware of of big changes between 07 and 08.

Again, XB wise, I don't know of any major chassis/frame changes that make the later chassis handle better than the early chassis. Just minor changes for air intake on the early frame, vs. a different intake on the later frame. No handling gains.

Power wins...I'd...always go for the power..!

Mike
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2019 - 04:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

There were a good number of enhancements that came from 2008 in the XB12.
Larger crankpin which raised the redline to the same as the XB9
DDFI3 with computer controlled idle and no TPS zeroing with computers.
Oil pump stacked on the top of the cams instead of at a right angle drive underneath.
"Jiffy tite" connectors for the oil lines.
I think this was the year that the transmission was changed to "dog ring" shifting.
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Phelan
Posted on Thursday, February 14, 2019 - 11:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

08 XB9 is a sweet and very rare bike. I would choose it over an 07 XB12 a hundred out of hundred times. I presume it is 08 XB9SX; I believe that is the only remaining XB9 model 08 and up. I would put a race pipe and race ECM on it (if not already done) and call it a day.
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Phelan
Posted on Thursday, February 14, 2019 - 11:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've had 32 Buells, my personal bike is an XB9R, if that gives you a reference point.

I had and loved my EBR as well, but I don't need that kind of power and I replaced it with a much more practical and still extremely enjoyable late model GMC :P . My license is thankful for the change also.
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Falloutnl
Posted on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 - 11:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

08 XB9 is a sweet and very rare bike. I would choose it over an 07 XB12 a hundred out of hundred times.

Interesting. I'm the complete opposite. Of course the added reliability of the '08 improvements is nice. But the engine feels quite different compared to the older ones. It was one of the reasons why I sold my '09 Scg, the motor just didn't do it for me.
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Elff
Posted on Saturday, April 13, 2019 - 07:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

06 is the sweet year for Buells.
That's when the trans and primary got a major upgrade that made shifting feel like a Japanese sport bike.

I still think the CityX is the most flickable Buell. There is something about the handlebars and riding position that really allow you to quickly switch from side to side.

I do really like my Firebolt with the Lightning Rear but I Helibar top triple clamp which moves the clip-ons 1" up an 1-1/2" back. It makes a huge difference

I can't say anything more than what's already been posted. The 12 is more powerful, but the 9 revs more. I had no complaints on the 9 because it was still a Buell engine and had killer TQ. The 12 is just more TQ but different on the street.
I guess the 9 would feel more smooth to some people

OO , I also have only owned Buells with the Race Kits installed. I have never driven a Buell with a stock exhaust and tune.
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Tleighbell
Posted on Monday, April 15, 2019 - 01:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

My hairball theory: the longer stroke of the 12 means the crank has greater moment of inertia than the 9, translating to increased gyroscopic effect and resistance to direction change. Enough to be noticeable? Dunno.
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Tpehak
Posted on Monday, April 15, 2019 - 10:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

No replacement for displacement. 12 is better than 9. 9 is for someone who is afraid big displacement motorcycles. 9 looks and sounds like a toy with those tiny exhaust headers.

There is no reason to buy 9 over 12 except you want to save some money or you are beginner. If you are experienced motorcyclist and if 9 and 12 would cost the same price there is no reason to have 9.

Buell just followed the idea of Japanese motorcycles when they sell models line with similar looking motorcycles but with different displacements. The "real" motorcycle is the one with the biggest displacement in the models line, other motorcycles are just marketing thing to attract beginners offering more affordable and less powerful motorcycles which look similar to the "true" motorcycle but they are really not. Same thing with 9, it just mimics the 12, but if you start looking on the details closer you will see that this is just a toy for someone who wants a motorcycle which looks close to 12, but for less money, with less power, with some compromises in look and sound.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on April 15, 2019)
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Skipbarberman
Posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 04:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Right...and when you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail. I suppose that same theory could be applied to the big block vs. small block mentality. Personally, I prefer the chassis balance of a small block car, vs a big-block car that pushes in the corners. I'm a 'turns guy', not a drag racer.

The 12 was an inexpensive way (no motor development costs) for Erik to up horsepower to compete with the Japanese. The bike was launched with a 984 for a reason, and switched to a 1200 for marketing.

That said, I've never ridden a 12, but own (2) XB9s. Price is roughly 15% less in my local market, and power is roughly the same with XB12 getting the nod for a few ponies. That aught to tell you something.
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Skipbarberman
Posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 04:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The red one now has (not pictured) a 1050 kit, a ceramic coated (Jet-Hot) XB12 header and Dean Adams exhaust, an XB12 Throttle body, Ohlins rear shock, Ractech built front end. Absolute hoot for an old guy with years of 600 supersport racing.






(Message edited by skipbarberman on April 16, 2019)

(Message edited by skipbarberman on April 16, 2019)

(Message edited by skipbarberman on April 16, 2019)
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Elff
Posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 09:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The bigger engine = more riding skill is bullshit.
I cant count how many people on 1 liter bikes told me Id outgrow a 600cc motorcycle
And then when we went out for a ride, i always had to wait for them after every turn.
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Slaughter
Posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 09:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I got used to the XB9 power in racing. Never went fast enough on the street to say there would be enough difference to matter.

If you're into engine work, there's MUCH you can do to the 9 to make it a far superior beast but you can easily put $4K or more into the engine.

Retired racing in 2014 but can't bring myself to sell either my A or B bike.

2008+ is a more bulletproof engine with bigger bottom end bearings. I had mine (2003) modified and flywheels lightened almost 2 1/2 pounds. Redline bumped to 8200. Bored to 3 13/16, custom CP pistons to mate w/modified combustion chamber, cams, big valves.




(Message edited by slaughter on April 16, 2019)
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2019 - 11:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

8200? the valve springs can keep up with that?
Upgraded to Beryllium pushrods?
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Skipbarberman
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2019 - 02:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)



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Elff
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2019 - 06:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Slaughter

If you ever change your mind, please send me a private message.

OOO and if we are doing pictures, here is my lil beast
It's a 12 with a lightning tail

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Phelan
Posted on Saturday, April 20, 2019 - 10:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

TPEHAK, I've had 37 Buells including an EBR 1190SX, and I've built 90" XBs and other high performance Buells, and with a few changes the XB9 is BY FAR my favorite of the pack. It's not about the power, but the delivery. It's a unique blend of revs and speed. The stock muffler makes the bike sound anaemic but an aftermarket muffler on a 9 and you will be hard pressed to tell the difference by exhaust note alone. An XB9 with a 12 intake, header and exhaust will make the same peak power after tuning that a similarly equipped 12 will make, but the 9 will make less torque because the power later in the RPM band. The primary gearing difference between the 2 bikes means you will be hard pressed to notice the lower torque on the 9 as well, which is why it feels more endless revving than a 12, because of the higher rev limiter, especially compared to the 04-07 XB12 models with 6700 RPM limit. The 9 is a far more enjoyable machine in town that a 12 overall, in my humble opinion.
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