G oog le BadWeB | Login/out | Topics | Search | Custodians | Register | Edit Profile

Buell Forum » XBoard » Help please----starter button does nothing « Previous Next »

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Spuds
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2019 - 01:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

OK....I know----you folks will have dozens of questions for me, and I likely won't have all the answers, but maybe my next steps can be more sharply focused from all this.

I'm reassembling a 2005 xb12r, coming from a home I'm familiar with.

Bought a running engine (so the seller said)... and replaced the cylinders, pistons etc with stuff that I had.
The main wiring harness was already in the frame.
All connectors present and accounted for.
The engine is in the frame, and the following connections made: starter, oil pressure switch, neutral switch, CPS, vehicle speed, VR, fuel pump, injectors, coil/plugs, head temp, air intake temp. ECM is plugged in. Ignition, RHS and LHS switchgear wiring is all connected. There are no loose / unconnected wires from the harness.
There's NO sidestand switch on the bike, and no wiring that looks like it would have gone to it. Clutch cable is not yet on the bike, so the clutch lever is in a position where the clutch switch tab is "out"---allowing the bike to start---I would think.
Hooked up a known good strong battery.

Plugged the bike into my laptop and newly downloaded ECMSpy (v1.12.27) (never used ECMspy or any other similar tool before) ...and can see temp readings, voltage readings, etc.....so (to me) ECMspy is talking with the bike.
Turning key to on position causes gauges to sweep, neutral, oil lights to illuminate. Switching the kill switch to run primes the fuel pump.
Using ECM spy, I set the static timing. Neat.

I've tested the ignition and stater relays (connecting each to 12v and testing for continuity at the indicated tabs), and they're seemingly good.

My immediate purpose, is to see if the the starter will roll over.

Here's what I've NOT done yet (figure for my prime immediate purpose they're not required...but maybe I'll learn here that they are...?): I have NOT yet installed the clutch cable, nor have I put any fuel or oil in the engine---I know----starting an engine with no oil is sorta not recommended---I get it!!! I JUST want to get the starter to roll over...I'm not going to actually start it with no oil.

Issue (?)1- in ECMSPY - I ONLY see the following tabs: Overview, ECM Runtime, Diagnostics, Functions----I don't see "Fuel Maps", "Other maps" or "EEPROM". Not sure if this is an issue, a related issue, a cause?

2- With all of the above in place, and the ignition switch on, and the kill switch in the "off" position...shouldn't a starter still turn over?
Cuz' there's absolutely nothing (sound, click...) upon pressing the starter button.

So....before I start tearing things all apart...what am I overlooking/forgetting?
Hoping that this is one of those forest/trees things!!!

thanks....!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Froggy
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2019 - 01:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It sounds like you are on a good start. You should be right about the lack of a sidestand switch, in the US only the 03s had the switch, but all years sent to Europe have it due to regulations there. You are in Canada, I'm not sure if your bike has the domestic or European harness, but it sounds like the domestic one based on your findings.

The only other Ion the 05 would be the clutch switch and neutral switch. In theory neither should be an issue, as the bike would normally allow you to try starting in gear if you squeeze the clutch, but the clutch isn't needed if starting in neutral. I'd try and verify the clutch switch is actually working, they can fail and make the bike think the clutch is still engaged.

Regarding ECMspy, you have to enable the advanced mode to get the fuel maps and such. I forget exactly how to do that without looking, but it should be in one of the dropdown menus at the top.


quote:

2- With all of the above in place, and the ignition switch on, and the kill switch in the "off" position...shouldn't a starter still turn over?




I assume you made a typo, because you need the ignition and kill switch to ON/Run for it to work. I would also try verifying the start button itself is still functional. Given you are not getting a click, it sounds like the start relay is not engaging, so I'm thinking either a safety interlock like the clutch switch, or something else preventing it from getting the signal from the start button.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Griffmeister
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2019 - 09:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Might still want to pull the relay out and see if maybe the signal is getting that far. It would still be possible to have something wrong downstream to get no response from the starter. At least the relay is easily accessible and can check for power there in a matter of seconds.
Also, could probably jump power there directly to the starter solenoid just to see if the starter actually kicks in. Down and dirty is always good for some quick checks before you have to really dig in deeper.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Spuds
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2019 - 07:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

thanks----

good points.

will start with those suggestions!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Dtaylor
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2019 - 08:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Also -- double check the headlight circuit, as it provides juice for the energizing circuit of the starter relay. A blown headlight fuse will cause a no start condition.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Spuds
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2019 - 09:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

headlight circuit?!?!?!? yikes!

OK----you can all sit and chuckle....I REALLY wish I had taken a more scientific approach the other day when I first tried turning the starter over.----to know for sure and be able to say for sure I tried it with the kill switch set in both positions.

Today---put the battery back in, double checked all connectors, set the kill switch to "run", and voila...the starter cranked.

Sigh of relief.

But c'mon---someone back me up here----normally---on most bikes....one can forget to set the kill switch to run, turn the key, and stand there with a thumb on the starter and wonder why it's turning over but not starting....right???

Anyway...progress! I think.

Sheepish Rod
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Froggy
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2019 - 10:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The headlight circuit safety is only on 08 and newer bikes.

Glad to hear you are making progress!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Akbuell
Posted on Saturday, January 05, 2019 - 08:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Spuds - Don't feel too bad. You are not the only member of that club. DAMHIK . . .
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Griffmeister
Posted on Saturday, January 05, 2019 - 11:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Just wait till you see what else you can do. Been there, done that.
« Previous Next »

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Bold text Italics Underline Create a hyperlink Insert a clipart image

Username: Posting Information:
This is a public posting area. Enter your username and password if you have an account. Otherwise, enter your full name as your username and leave the password blank. Your e-mail address is optional.
Password:
E-mail:
Options: Post as "Anonymous" (Valid reason required. Abusers will be exposed. If unsure, ask.)
Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action:

Topics | Last Day | Tree View | Search | User List | Help/Instructions | Rules | Program Credits Administration