| Author | Message | ||
     420at145mph |
dave ur like a super salesman guru what ecm do i need? u sold me the pipe n filter i figure ud know | ||
| Easyflier |
I don't recall ever seeing any dyno comparisions on the aftermarket stack. What we did learn is that jerseyguys beautiful aluminum stack performed exactly like the rubber one that it was modeled from. | ||
| M1combat |
Easy flier is correct. Jersey guy is working on a new one as we speak... As far as the bryon james crap... Just buy their clear nippled cover and you'll get the same benefit as the whole thing. That's the only part that actually does anything. Oh wait... You could just buy an XB12 airbox cover (cheap) and get the SAME results as it's the SAME thing... Ingenuity and out of the box thinking at it's finest I suppose (Oh wait... It's just a copy of OEM equipment... N/M). anyway, buy what makes you happy. | ||
| Tucsonxb9s |
M1- That's what I said back before the GMAN vs. Dyna posts. I think all the benefits that GMAN is describing is exactly what I got with my K&N and 12 Airbox. Total expense of $100! Don't get me wrong, it looks beautiful. The problem is no one will ever see it (once you put your plastic back on) and the performance is just not proven. | ||
| Jerseyguy |
Dyna - Please tell me I don't have to type this whole story again...... | ||
| Zip |
"As far as the bryon james crap... Just buy their clear nippled cover and you'll get the same benefit as the whole thing. That's the only part that actually does anything." M1-how do you know that? | ||
| M1combat |
Take a look at that and at the 12 airbox top... It's the "same" thing. It's been proven that the airbox top alone is worth something. The BJ airbox top is a reasonably close copy of that. There has been a good deal of discussion (with some VERY smart people I might add) about the OEM SHAPE V-stack and the conclusion was that there probably won't be much if anything to be gained by using anything else on a reasonably stock bike. I think that you may see a bit of improvement after an 88" rebuild or something along those lines. Basically, it was decided that the shape is good. Length is the way to change the curve. Keep in mind though, that the torque curve on the XB is VERY flat so it's probably already VERY close to the proper length. There's just not much to be had in the V-stack unless you get to a point where you are trying to flow a good deal more air than you are now. There IS however a gain with the 12 airbox top. Disclaimer - I have NO proof, but I have read/discussed a lot on the subject. | ||
| Zip |
So we bash GMAN on a guess??? Dyna- where is the independent dyno test you refer to?? | ||
| M1combat |
"WE" don't bash GMan... "WE" bash Bryon and James because of how they represented their product the first time they appeared on the board and because of how they treat business partners. | ||
| Blake |
I'm with Dyna on this one. Smells pretty stinky to me. | ||
| Dyna |
Zip, I could have swore that Bubba did a test of Coreys stack but even if he didnt, just by looking at it you can tell its really no different than stock, maybe a little shorter. And like I said before, anon even came in & told us that we were looking for gains that arent going to be found. Throw a 12 cover on the 9 & be done with it. I already said what I had to say to Gman, if he isnt connected with Corey then eventually we will know, but if he is we will also find that out. No big deal either way. And 420...you arent even worth the effort. Try the crap you have pulled on other sites & Blake will ban your ass. | ||
| 420at145mph |
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| Gman |
I agree with Davefl's post. I believe one should be sent to Bubba, if he is the trusted dyno master here. Dyna I do remember seeing, some months ago, a discussion about one being sent to Tilley's, I just don't think it ever happened. Also, I want to include, although I never measured the difference, the new v-stack is considerably shorter and has a wider opening at the top. Speaking of dyno masters, I clicked a link to Kevin's site on a different thread and I must say the thick exit tube on the Drummer looks REAL GOOD! Sorry to jump threads. | ||
| M1combat |
Yeah, we don't need that sort of punk ass BS around here 420... /IGNORE=ON | ||
| Dyna |
Sorry to jump threads. No big deal, we do it all the time around here. If it wasnt for the extreme tangental runoffs we would be lost sometimes. | ||
| Gman |
Cool. I did not want to get off on the wrong foot with anyone, Dyna. I'm really not sure how to take you. You seemed to be attacking me and my opinions, yesterday. I understand you don't trust those fellows or their products. That's fine. It's your opinion. Just don't come after me. I was simply stating my opinion. Any way, enough of that. I have a question, how can I get to the Drummer site? Is this the same site I commented on before or is there some place other than that one. I am trying to find the sound bite. | ||
| Dyna |
Its some temporary site setup. The link is somewhere here on badweb..sorry I cant be of more help on finding it. | ||
| Daves |
420, You just need the current race ecm. Call me at work tomorrow and I can get one for you. 920-757-1651 Just ask for Dave "the new guy" | ||
| Jerseyguy |
Dyna, Here's the inside scoop. I know because I was intimately involved. I solid modeled and CNC'd the EXACT copy of the stock stack but from aluminum billet and Brian tested it for me at Tilleys. It tested IDENTICAL to the stock rubber stack on the dyno. My conclusion after spending nearly $1k was that Buell knows what the hell they are doing. I still am working on another design because I love the challenge. If I learn anything you all will know about it. As to the other guys... They sent me a "drawing" of their stack - as a MS word document no less. I solid modeled it for them, correcting some impossible geometry & sent them the file. I also offered my engineering opinion and suggestions. Brion graciously offered me a free stack for my effort which I declined because I didn't want it. When they saw my postings to the Badweb regarding my copy of the Buell Rubber stack, they had a surrogate (they were banned) accuse me of stealing their design. I modeled them both & I can tell you better than anyone else that there isn't a single dimension that's the same between them. Brion subsequently sent one of his stacks to Brian at Tilleys, but without the necessary custom gasket made from the stocK rubber stack. To my knowledge Brian has it still and has never tested it. | ||
| Glitch |
If I learn anything you all will know about it. Hat's off to you! It's not very often (in my field anyway) that someone is willing to share information. | ||
| Tucsonxb9s |
Jerseyguy is the reason I started this thread. While Brion and Corey were making huge claims without any results, Jersey spent his own cash in an attempt to see what would really happen. His progress during planning and construction was well documented and he did a hell of a good job. Unfortunately nothing came of it except those two yahoos claiming he stole their design! Kudos to Jersey for telling the truth. | ||
| Court |
>>>Kudos to Jersey for telling the truth. | ||
| Zip |
Thanks - The truth is what I was after all along.  | ||
| Gman |
So Jerseyguy is saying he designed the current v-stack in the SVVS system; right? (and) Supposedly, Bubba has one at Tilley's; but it has never been tested on the dyno (with or without the inverted cone). (and) Corey and Brion claimed they developed the stack and Jerseyguy stole the design. OK. I don't have a dog in that fight. However,if this is true, thanks a bunch, Jerseyguy! | ||
| Tucsonxb9s |
No, Jersey is not claiming he designed the SWS at all. He machined his own stack with the same dimensions as the stock rubber stack. He showed the CAD and blueprints during his planning stages on the badweb for everyone to see. Once he finished it, he sent it to Bubba for testing. Those tests showed no major improvement. In the meantime, Brion and Corey were crying the blues attacking Jersey for theft of their design. My opinion is that they didn't want anyone to find out the stack WASN'T going to be an improvement over the stock piece. I also believe that any improvements you do feel with their system is directly attributed to the nipple that is the same as a XB12 airbox lid. Two different stacks, two different developers, two different philosophies. One tells us the truth with nothing to hide or gain, and the other out to make a buck at our expense! | ||
| Jerseyguy |
Gman - Let me make this perfectly clear. No, I did not design the SWS stack. What I did was, (cut and pasted from above) When Brion "sent me a "drawing" of their stack - as a MS word document no less. I solid modeled it for them, correcting some impossible geometry & sent them the file. I also offered my engineering opinion and suggestions." I make no claim to the design whatever and I didn't want the one that was offered to me as I did not agree with the design. One of my "engineering suggestions" offered to Brion was that any gains made by the use of the 12's airbox cover on a 9 would probably be lost on his design as his stack was much shorter. Subsequently he made that very nice clear cover that appears to replicate the 12 nipple but places it lower. Steve | ||
| Xb9er |
Gman said: The improvements in performance that you mention sound very similar to what you can get on a stock XB by 1) removing the snorkel, 2) adding the K&N filter, and 3) installing the XB12 air cleaner cover. Why don't you take out your "short stack" and put the stock one back on. Let us know the results. Dyno results would be good too. Mike. | ||
| Henrik |
I'm beginning to agree with Blake and Dyna (go figure  ) Gman sure is making some odd assumptions based *very* loosely on others posts. Troll ?? Henrik | ||
| Court |
>>>>>>Kudos to Jersey for telling the truth. | ||
| Gman |
Ease up, fellas! I was only trying to get a clear picture of what Jerseyguy was saying. As far as dyno numbers, I would be willing to try to do some testing to find out what is up. Dyna, I appreciate your challenge to Corey James as I think he should be up to another comparison to help settle this. But, it would be hard to speak for him. Dyna, the guy might not trust that you'll give him a fair test to "prove" his product is junk. Any way, that is between you two. I am not sure of how "local" my access is to a dyno. The suzuki dealer has one, but my HD/Buell does not. There is one problem, also. In order to install the stack, one must cut the existing stack to make the seal required at the base of the box. In order to put my "old" stack back on, I'd have to buy a new one. I am, however, open to any suggestions. This is a list of parts I have to test with/take off/ switch to: All stock components (less the stack & stock lid) Corey's stack modified lid stock ECM race ECM I think to make everything fair I need to get access to a XB12 lid. Then a pull could be done with a "stock" set up, then the XB12 lid, then same w/o snorkel, then same w/ race ECM. Then do the same w/ the svvs system. first stack, then same w/ cone, then same w/ race ECM. One more problem is the TPS reset that must be done when the ECM is switched. I don't mind trying it, but I may need help w/ parts. Does anyone who has the other parts needed want to try to get together and do this? I am also open to other suggestions. I'd like to get this conflict or debate or what ever you want to call it settled. Dyna do you have a suggestion? |
