|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 01:40 am: ||
I'm coming from an X1. I'm 6'2". I've had it for a year and grew to love the stance with the Corbin seat and aftermarket straight bars on it. I'm looking for something more reliable. I will not buy an uncomfortable bike after spending some time on a friends R1.
I've been looking mostly at used Firebolts. I sat on one XB9S with a tail lift kit and the bike just felt too short for me. I was about to rule the Lightning out, especially after sitting on my roommates 03 XB9R.
I came across a 05 XB9SX locally for a pretty good price. I loved the look of the Hero Blue (and black cases) the first time I saw them a while ago and will be taking it for an extended test on Wednesday. I'm looking to keep this until the wheels fall off. I was previously on a motard DRZ400 but didn't ride nearly the amount of miles I do lately.
I did some searches and have a few questions on things that have been raised
- Passengers: Everyone (including the owner) said having a passenger isn't ideal. I haven't heard this comment about the other Lightning models. Why? Don't they have the same seat frame as S, Sc, and Scg? I know the seats are interchangeable and affect the height of the seat, do they have drastically different sitting angles?
- Engine: What's the difference between a xb9s and xb9sx that makes "This is a bike for the rider who loves to dodge traffic, power away from lights and utilize the incredible agility of a sport motorcycle to charge through the asphalt jungle." Different tuning? Different gearing?
If it's geared for low end I assume it sacrifices top end. The majority of my riding is suburban and freeway with sport bikes. My X1 with mods has a hard enough time keeping up. I was leaning more towards the XB12 - but my friend didn't struggle as much as I did with an 03XB9R with the full race kit. I read plenty of times that the 9 with the race kit about equal to the stock 12 but more agile. I have to wonder why they kept with the 12 instead of the 9 in practically all of the models.
- ECM spy: I have the cable for my bike. I eventually plan to put exhaust and do the open air mod. Can I convert the stock ecm to be a race ecm if I can get the maps or do I need to plan on spending another $200?
- It's an 05 with 6000 miles. He's asking $4300 including some riding gear. I'm thinking $4000 because of the market.
I saw a 06 xb12Scg w/ 1800 miles going for $5000, but I don't think the lowered version would be good for my height.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 01:54 am: ||
I had an '05 City-X in Hero Blue. It does have a lower primary gear than the others,"street fighter" gear. I installed the race kit, pipe, air filter, ECM. Topped out at about 133 indicated, easily I might add.
I'm 6' and I was scrunched with the stock peg location, and the seat was hotter than that of my Uly, always. As far as a passenger goes, at 225, I did not leave much room and no back grab bar or seat back, raised tail housing or anything, left them all feeling uncomfortable at best.
It had plenty of power, really fun to go flying about, handled like a dream, but I could not ride it comfortably more than 150 miles a day. I had ridden it 325 in a day to try it.
After changing to higher bars, Air Hawk seat pad, increased windshield height, I bought my Uly. I never looked back. I planned to keep the City-X, but after three months of non-use, the writing was on the wall.
City-X = cool, fun, looks great, loved it. Uly = that and fixed all of the things you asked about.
Would I have a City-X again? Only if a Uly wasn't available.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 01:56 am: ||
Passengers: Everyone (including the owner) said having a passenger isn't ideal.
Umm have you looked at the amount of rear seat room, or lack thereof? Its fine for around town bursts, but anything more than half an hour I would recommend at least a Lightning Long with its slightly larger seat, or a Uly.
Engine: What's the difference between a xb9s and xb9sx
Nothing. Depending on the year you would be looking at something like a different intake, but all models get the same changes for that year.
Different tuning? Different gearing?
Different marketing, oh and a headlight grill and hand guards.
If it's geared for low end I assume it sacrifices top end.
Yep all XB9 models have the same short gearing. You can swap in the XB12 primary chain should you desire to lower your revs.
I read plenty of times that the 9 with the race kit about equal to the stock 12 but more agile.
Hogwash, they are both putting down double digit horsepower, but the shorter gearing on the 9 gives it that little extra umph it needs to make up for the like 15hp/tq disadvantage vs the 12. Oh, and they use the EXACT SAME SUSPENSION, so any agility claims are bogus.
I have to wonder why they kept with the 12 instead of the 9 in practically all of the models.
Because its the better motor.
Can I convert the stock ecm to be a race ecm
Yes, but it is not recommended. Don't bother with a race ECM period, get your bike mapped to your setup, not some cookie cutter map that was made for a different bike with a different intake and exhaust.
Your call on the 05 vs 06. The 06 has the new transmission for smoother shifting, larger capacity frame, newer air intake system, newer style swing arm and a few other changes. The normal suspension is much better overall than the low suspension, so if you can handle the height of the normal bike, I would lean that way or look for another non-low.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 08:44 am: ||
I have an X1 and an XB9S. My X1 is tuned well with ForceWinder intake, Force pipe and a modded Race ECM. It runs great. While the X1 has more power than the XB9S, the XB9S has plenty.
I love the riding position of the XB9S, very comfortable. For passengers, once they get over the fear of the short tail it is a comfortable bike- MUCH better than sport bikes. No, it's not a touring bike so long distance trips are not ideal for 2-up, but we have done 2-up from Minneapolis to Madison without issue.
Buy the 12SCG, and swap suspension parts with me! Seriously, I want to lower my 9S for my girlfriend and all it takes is forks and rear spring swap...
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 09:41 am: ||
Froggy nailed it. You can take a passenger on the 9sx, but they have to be in love with you. And in a good mood. That being said, it wasn't much worse then my M2. Not nearly as good as a Uly though.
The 05 XB9SX, stock, I think had the tallest seat a lightning ever had. It's the short frame though, the Lightning Long / STT have the longer frame. That extra inch or so is really nice for tall guys.
That being said, I'm a big 6'2', and have been very happy on my 05 XB9SX for 30k miles now.
I have no idea if 4k is a good market value, but I can tell you that if you get a solid running XB9SX for under $5k, you have a *heck* of a lot of motorcycle for the money... wow! You could put that much into an SV-650 in aftermarket parts alone (not including the purchase of the bike) and still probably have a wore bike then a stock 9sx.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:26 pm: ||
Call me shallow, but I really don't like the way the Uly looks. I don't think I could get on that. I'm looking at the City X because it's available, a Buell, a good price, and my 2nd favorite color combination. I was a little hesitant when I kept reading its for city riding and the main difference was the seat height. I should have no problem with the height. I really jsut have to get on it an ride it.
I didn't think there was much difference engine wise. Marketing and the different addons makes sense.
Froggy: are you saying the 9 or the 12 is the better motor? It seemed like you were netural and favoring the 9 until the last comment.
About agility: I meant that the 9 is faster revving so it's more responsive? That probably wasn't the right description either. Basically what I got from other comments in the xb9 vs. xb12 is coming out of a turn - the 9 would be quicker than the 12. It doesn't seem to have the major difference like going from a 600 to 1000 on a sport bike does.
I know the seat looks tiny on the S models. I've just read more people complain about passenger comfort on the CityX vs the standard model. Maybe if I searched lightning and passenger comfort I would have seen the same.
Ideally I'd go with a Lightning Long - but I haven't seen too many for sale in my price range. That's pretty much why I've been looking at the bolts.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:50 pm: ||
I hate the 9, in my opinion of Buell had to skip any engine in its 26 year history, it would be that one. Some people love the 9, perhaps they drank paint thinner or something.
Just a clarification, performance is near identical on both motors, due to the difference in gearing. The 12 has a little more top speed due to taller gearing and the extra few hp, but you are still looking at only 12mph difference.
The 9 revs a little faster, partly due to the shorter stroke, but also partly due to the short gearing.
Coming out a turn, its all down to the rider. Barker had no trouble keeping me at bay on his XB9R at the Dragon, I was on my CR.
Seats are a preference. The Lightning seats plain suck for the passenger. Depending on your passengers size/weight/preferences, they might like one seat better than another. No seat is fantastic, so it would be like winning the special olympics, in the end you are still retarded.
The SS is a newer model, so they do cost more than the older XB's, but they are fantastic machines.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 10:40 pm: ||
If you do ride it you "will" buy it, it's like heroin.
|Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 12:14 am: ||
Froggy you always make me laugh with your out-spoken love of the 12 over the 9 motor!
My opinion: they are both great motors, neither of them with a ton of power. But that's what makes these bikes so much fun for me to ride! There is enough there, and the rest is up to the rider. I can from sport bikes that had more HP and could go a ton faster (in a straight line) than my Buells by simply twisting the throttle. No way would I trade back now.
Honestly, either motor is "enough" motor to have a lot of fun!
|Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 12:25 am: ||
I would highly suggest the Lightning SS or Lightning Long for the older models seeing that you're 6'2" My wifes got an Scg and it is really cramped riding for me coming off of my M2, and I'm only 5'10" The SS has a nice comfortable feel for me, it is the same streched frame as the ULY.
|Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 08:39 am: ||
It's always a debate. I'm still a novice rider so I'll probably never top out it's potential. Just trying to make the right choice for the long term. Did the 12's always come standard with the Thunderstorm heads? I know they were optional on the tubers and the 08's all come with them. If they're optional, is it worth the upgrade?
Now it's back to the decision tree.
My friends salvage 2003 XB9R w/ race kit (drummer instead). I'd need to replace the front end from a low speed accident. I have practically all the parts for repair. It should come out to $2500 - $3000 all said and done.
Pro: it's cheap, know the history, comfortable with a passenger, has all the accessories I want. I'm going to keep it for a while so the salvage title won't hurt that much and Im getting it at a good price.
Used bike around $4000 - 5000. (this City x is my second favorite color combo - pretty much a stock bike though)
New 09 in my favorite color and the model I want (xb12R or xb12ss - $7000 all said and done. I'll pay more in tax but I remember reading that the tax you pay on a new vehicle in 09 should be refunded or deducted because of the stimulus plan. Double the insurance. Financially would be the most difficult - but they may take my bike in a trade in and be done with it. Warranty is always a big thing - but these models are much more reliable than what I'm used to.
I ruled it out last week because of financial reasons - but I can't stop thinking about it. I'd have to travel a few hours to get it - can't get a quote for my bike without seeing it. Bringing back 2 bikes could be an issue if I don't like the offer...
(Message edited by blackandchrome on November 04, 2009)
|Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 12:38 pm: ||
I (6'2") was very uncomfortable on the SCG, but am fairly comfortable on an 05 9sx. The seat and suspension on the 05 9sx is a lot taller.
|Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 12:48 pm: ||
I'm with Froggy on this one. The 12 really is a better engine, and I've owned both. Still have the 12, if that is worth anything. I, like many others, tried to convince others the 9 was superior due to all the reasons above. I was drinking my own paint thinner, apparently. The 12 is superior to the 9 in every way, and THAT is why they put those in more bikes. There was simply more demand from the public to buy the bikes. If the cityx and 9R sold in higher numbers, we might have more on the road. As it stands, we don't.
That being said, either is still a fun bike. The 12 just makes riding 'easier'.
|Posted on Monday, November 09, 2009 - 11:58 pm: ||
However I am not 6'2", I take my girlfriend on rides all the time, around town is nice because the bike is so nimble that a well schooled passenger is not a large incumbency.
I do believe it is geared a little different, but not much. I have no problem at highway speed, and unfortunately a little faster
I love my 05 SX, no problems, easy to make your own with cheap modifications.
|Posted on Tuesday, November 10, 2009 - 01:55 pm: ||
I took the bike for the ride, I will not be buying that particular bike (kept outside a block away from the beach). I don't think I'll be looking at other CityX's either.
I didn't like the feel of the bike. When you say you sit upright, you really mean upright! I'm used to no wind protection (don't have the front fairing on my X1), but the extra upright-ness really exaggerates it.
The bike felt half the length of my X1. (The tail riser kit on the other lightning I checked out exaggerated the shortness - but in stock form it still felt short to me). Leaning over to get out of the wind didn't feel "right." My X1 feels "right" whether I'm sitting upright, leaning over, or laying down with my feet on the passenger pegs.
It really is tall. I've sat on a couple of my friends bikes (jap sports bikes) and never had an issue being flat footed. I didn't have an issue on my motard DRZ either. I was able to put my feet flat on the CityX, but not nearly as comfortable as other bike.
The translucent Hero Blue didn't really do much for me in person. It may have been the condition of the bike, but it looks like a dark blue from a distance. It looks a lot lighter and see through in pictures. I do love the black engine case.
I've only used bar end mirrors on my two bikes. I know people complain about looking at your elbows - these things were completely useless. (the guy had "sport mirrors" on them)
It was very sluggish. I've never thought much of my X1 - my buddy with the XB9R can always fly by me. My X1 felt like a beast compared to this.
I still haven't rode a 12 yet. Still trying to decide about that and the crashed bike.
*edit* do all xb12r's have Thunderstorm heads? It seems like only the newer bike have the Thunderstorm badges on the cases. If they are an upgrade, is it a noticeable difference?
**Found my own answer - they've been in every XB and some tubers. The engine in the XB is all Buell compared to the tubers. There were major changes in 08 to address common issues and to save on maintanence costs.
(Message edited by blackandchrome on November 10, 2009)
(Message edited by blackandchrome on November 10, 2009)
(Message edited by blackandchrome on November 11, 2009)
|Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 12:20 am: ||
I had all kinds of complaints from my passenger on my stock seat on my 05 xb9sx, then I got a corbin, no complaints at all, even on a 425 mile ride.....also put a 07 seat on it and it was still alot better for passenger then the 05 seat. I think its called the skyline seat. IMHO it is the perfect commuter bike around town (houston, texas) even on these crazy 6 lane highways around the city at 65-80mph it does everything I need it to do, with power to spare. Im a pretty small guy though so, take that into consideration....5'9" - 135 lbs....my passenger was is even smaller.
I got 21k miles on it and only one issue so far, broken header flange bolt two weeks after i got it. Nothing since then....not even new battery or anything....My XB9SX is bulletproof......Thank you Buell. You will be missed. sniff, sniff, whimper whimper......Why harley? why? For the love of all that is two wheeled....WHY?
|Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 11:11 am: ||
Just my opinion,
If you still haven't made a decision. I love my 07 cityx. It is perfect for dodging in and out of traffic. It has been my daily driver for over 2.5 years now and I have just over 20k on it. I have only had a couple issues (leaky gaskets) to speak of, but warranty took care of them. It does have a perplexing issue of hesitation at about 4k rpm, that the idiots at my local HD haven't figured out, but..
-As far as passengers: The seat is, as discussed above, quite short so there is no "extra comfort" between my wife's butt and the rear wheel, especially with removal of the "Cheese Grater" (not that that would help anyway). She likes riding 2 up so much that I have since dropped the issue and removed my rear pegs... The issue of power is also there. The 9 engine is perfect for 1 person to get up and go away from/through traffic. But the addition of another person has a noticeable effect of performance . I am a rather tall guy at 6'2", however (hard as I try), I am quite light so it has enough power for me. But as my riding skills improved, I did find myself wishing I had a little bit more that a 12 could probably offer.
- I like how quick the 9 revs and have discovered that even with the lower red-line than a "sport" bike, the 9 engine does enjoy revving higher than the average "normal riding" shifting rpm range. Since I am 6'2" the reason my wife dislikes the short seat is probably because I have to sit a bit further back than normal, and my ankles have developed arthritis because of 2 years of relatively cramped leg position.
-It does leave a bit to be desired when riding, or trying to, with others on jap bikes. It's nice getting away from them at lights until you get through the intersection and they're engine gets above idle rev speed. But on the other hand we handle better than they do.
All in all I like the bike, and am happy with my purchase decision. I would like to add more power and possible lower pegs though...
|Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 11:42 am: ||
I ride an 08 9 my buddy rides an 07 12 when we gun it we are neck and neck always. Also the seat height on my 9 is higher than the 12 so i don't know if that factors in for you but it helps me an I am 6"1. Also while i like and find Froggy entertaining and knowledgeable his hate of the 9 makes him too biased to be completely trustworthy on 9 info
|Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 03:38 pm: ||
Dont like the looks of the ULY, dont like the room on a CityX ?
|Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 05:33 pm: ||
I'm glad I held off.
I will be picking up a 2008 XB12R with 600 miles in my favorite color for only $5000. It's at a car dealer less than 2 hours from me. His friend bought it and wanted to stick with his Harley; the car dealer bought it thinking it was worth much more. He wants to stick with his cruisers as well and just wants to get rid of it. Listed for 5500, $5000 cash takes it.
Insurance sucks, I wish I could just get Liability and Collision. Whatever, I'm getting the exact bike that I want. I don't have to swap the plastics or rims. I have the upgraded tranny and higher rev limit and all of the upgrades for the long run. I wish it was an all black 09 with the improved brakes, but I'm happy anyways. Besides a drummer and cleaning up the little things, I won't have to do anything to it besides enjoy it!