| Author | Message | ||
     Swordsman |
If I'm understanding this correctly, the O2 sensor and the AFV calculation both affect parts of (or the whole) fuel map. But I'm not clear on why we need both systems? Why can't one do the job by itself? Or is the O2 sensor driving the AFV value? But then, why would there be a separate EGO correction value? Can you tell I'm confused?  ~SM | ||
| Gemini |
o2 is the sensor that afv is adjusted by. afv is the shift up or down(add or remove of fuel) of the whole fuel map as a long term change. ego is the same effect as afv but as a short term change. because the enviorment, tuning and the engine are never always perfect and always change, it is neccesairy to have this setup | ||
| Swordsman |
If this is the case, why bother with a long term change? Seems like it'd be simpler and more efficient to calculate everything in realtime, constantly...? The EGO correction just makes more sense to me, I guess. ~SM | ||
| Xl_cheese |
Do a datalog and watch it. Compare Ego Corr and O2 voltage. Ego Corr takes control during CL riding. An AFV is calculated based on info in CL. In open loop the AFV multiplier is applied rather than ego corr. You can run an experiment at idle while the bike is running. Set AFV to 100 and watch RPM Set AFV to 105 " " " " " " 110 " " " Then watch what happens when ego corr takes over once the bike warms up. It doesn't matter what you chang AFV to while it's in CL the bike will function off ego corr. | ||
| Gemini |
they use afv to try and maintain the normal adjust from base line that is needed. they use the ego to keep the o2 sensor switching from rich to lean. this allows the bike to verify that the o2 sensor is not stuck at rich, lean or at center. because ego relies completely on the o2 sensor working and being hot. at startup, it ignores the sensor. becasuse the afv is a stored value, the bike is already close to being at the right fuel ratio. | ||
| Typeone |
question on this topic: when AFV rises, say to 105 from 100, is the EGO Corr. affected as well? meaning the number you can watch during a log review. reason i ask, i tend to watch EGO pretty closely when i review my logs before making edits. but i never understood if that value is moot once AFV changes. hope i'm being clear.. . | ||
| Swordsman |
Okay, I think I'm starting to get it. Now my dumb question is: what is the rpm range that constitutes a closed loop condition? I looked around for a setting in ECMSpy because I assumed it would be adjustable, but I didn't see anything. I know you can set the idle to be closed loop via a checkbox, but what is the normal closed loop range? ~SM | ||
| Gemini |
typeone- if your ego is around 115% and your afv is at 100%. you will likely see your afv rise towards 110-115% and your ego reduce towards 100%. your actual fuel injector pulsewith with be the value of the cell x afv(%) x ego(%) X constant(ecm value in ms). to our knowledge, the constant value is not adjustable with ecm spy. swordsman- if you are running the latest version of ecmspy, start by fetching eprom. now go to maps. the area in blue is your closed loop area. this area will use your o2 sensor as well as other sensor as a feedback system. the area in red is the area that your afv is learned. the area in green is your idle area(this is not adjustable). the black line represents your wide open enrichment area. anything above that line is getting the enrichment value listed under "WOT". hope this helps some | ||
| Swordsman |
Huh, I wondered what all the color was about! Never noticed that in the manual. Thanks! So can you change the colors to and modify when it switches between open/closed loop? Or is that hardwired into the system? ~SM | ||
| Xl_cheese |
yes, you can change them. One trick that xopti does it to lower the max values so that you go into open loop quicker. Open loop enrichment will kick in at lower rpms thus giving you a lil more power. | ||
| Swordsman |
LOL, I wonder if the guy that made ECMSpy had any idea the number of internet forum threads he would ultimately be responsible for? There's SO much information to absorb! Thanks for all the feedback. I feel like I'm beginning to get the gist of this thing. ~SM | ||
| Gemini |
yeah he knows. Gunter ans Ralph are great guys. Gunter gets on here from time to time | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
yes gunter and ralf are very great and down right 100% gifted. as mentioned earley you can modify other things in the ecm with ecmspy you just have to apply then as direct code in the eprom cells. as thats what i use to do on timing and all the other maps page info as well as the configuration page. there are a couple functions still not in ecmspy that are use full but very very sensitive. such as o2 counts and dwell time. its so nice to read every where more and more people understand the madness. now if we can just get them all to use a 4 gas analyzer over a wide band 02 alone. then you can see all the important stuff. not just afr. i can have a bad timing and other functions off and still get a perfect power afr. and never even be able to see it with wide band. then put the 4 gas on it and dial in timing and dwell. a bit better and find the afr was way out of wack. read read and keep reading. as you can never learn too much. remember no questions are3 dumb questions. every single one of us was at that spot at some time. mike | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
FOR A 4 GAS GET A PORTABLE UNIT!!!! http://www.bridgeanalyzers.com/900345_moto_desc.ph p4 THESE SEEM TO BE VERY VERY GOOD | ||
| Moosestang |
anything above that line is getting the enrichment value listed under "WOT". I was just about to ask why my WOT line doesn't run along the top row. This is a timing table, but you get the idea. for clarification, the colors he was refering to are the colored lines in the image below. You can see the closed loop, wot and LCL(learned closed loop?) areas by checking the boxes beside the abbreviations.  |
