| Author | Message | ||
     Firefast |
I have a XB12r firebolt and want an upgrade to the 1125r. What are the pros and cons about this upgrade? | ||
| Beachbuell |
Search the knowledge vault. there is a lengthy thread on this. | ||
| Badlionsfan |
Screw the knowledge vault, go test ride an 1125r. All your questions will be answered. | ||
| Clarkjw |
Test ride one for sure. But make it a 2009. Excessive heat, extreme vibration, and low RPM surging are found on most '08 models (especially the demo at Liberty Buell). It handles better/steers lighter. Makes enough power to give you whiplash. The power comes on later and torque is less noticeable. The slipper clutch is a dream though. It's actually more comfortable than a Firebolt. | ||
| Xl1200r |
The power comes on later and torque is less noticeable. That is an inaccurate statement. The 1125R I rode pulled harder at 3500rpm at half throttle than my XB12R does at full. If I had to do the pro/con thing... The 1125R is MUCH faster The 1125R feels a good bit lighter The 1125R feels more stable in turns The XB12 has more "character" The XB12 gets better MPG The XB12 costs less to buy Maintenance is a wash from what I can tell (You have to do valve adjustments on the 1125, but fork service and oil changes are more spread out than an XB). Looks are up to the owner. I think my XB12R is a gorgeous bike. I also think the 1125CR is a gorgeous bike. I don't care for the 1125R, but I can see why others do. BTW - My 1125CR comes in in 6 weeks, so you know what I decided. (Message edited by xl1200r on August 12, 2008) | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Until they hire a designer to remove the excessive ugliness from the 1125R, it will never be as good-looking as the XB12R. The XB is an iconic motorcycle design, and will always be remembered as such- the 1125R never will. | ||
| Mr2shim |
Until they hire a designer to remove the excessive ugliness from the 1125R, it will never be as good-looking as the XB12R. The XB is an iconic motorcycle design, and will always be remembered as such- the 1125R never will. Nice opinion too bad it's not factual.  | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Yes, it's my opinion- and opinions (non-legal), by definition, are not statements of fact. How's this: "In my opinion, the XB is an iconic motorcycle design- pure in historical, technological, and cutting edge aesthetic design. It has earned a place of honor in the annals of motorcycle engineering excellence." As to part two of this thread's question: "In my opinion, the 1125R, being a derivative of the XB platform, has much improved performance with the adoption of the non-historical Buell powerplant; has styling that is, at best, controversial; and continues the technological advancements laid down by the XB. Given that it is an evolution of a ground-breaking design, it will never achieve the iconic status of the original." Is that better? The best thing about opinion threads on forums is being able to share one's opinion. Let's come back to this subject in ten years and see who's opinion was "right". | ||
| Iamarchangel |
Ooooh, somebody studied diplomacy. Nice. | ||
| Xl1200r |
And a 1967 L88 Corvette must not be an iconic car because it only built on what was laid down by the original in 1953. Get real. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
The XB is an iconic motorcycle design, and will always be remembered as such- the 1125R never will. I beg to differ. The 1125r is an absolute ground-breaking milestone for Buell. While no one except Erik Buell knows what direction the company will take with the Helicon motor, I think it is safe to say that the 1125r has garnered more press (mixed bag, but hey it's the first shot on a totally different platform) than the XBs ever did or ever will. The shootouts and comparos will continue to increase for the 2009 model. Combine that with the current and future racing success and you have a bike that is beginning of some really great things at BMC. The XB is great bike, but it had its first year niggles. By now they have pretty much been worked out and the things are pretty bulletproof. The 1125r is a whole different animal for Buell and they did a remarkable job for the first time out the chute. And we all know that the 1125r and its derivatives will get better and better...I can't wait to get my new one in a couple years. I am really hoping for a RR model with humane ergos. Too much to ask? We'll see. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
excessive heat, extreme vibration, and low RPM surging are found on most '08 models Incorrect generalization. Problems here get amplified, so MOST 1125r are fine running machines. Mine is one of those, luckily. No surging. Vibes are not any worse than my XB. Heat is an issue, I'll agree with that one. MPG could be better as well. In general, the 1125r is a more refined machine that has a monster motor and supreme handling characteristics. Firebolt on steroids? Remember now--you buy and 1125r and you are on a world-class level of V-Twin, competing directly with the best the world has to offer (1098 & RC-8). Now for $12 large, THAT'S cool. | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Xl1200r, Not at all- the only thing in common between the 1953 Covrvette and a '67 L88 is a fiberglass body. If you recall, the '53 'Vette didn't even have a V-8, they were fitted with the "Blue Flame" six cylinder engine. The only relationship between the two is the name, body material, two seats and limited production numbers. The 1125R is completely derived from the XB- with an out-sourced engine (still a V-tiwn), and many parts that interchange. That's as "real" as it gets. Also, while the Helicon engine is a milestone for Buell (first liquid cooled powerplant) it is being used in a current (XB) chassis design and that's why the 1125 series remains a derivative of the XB. Until Buell introduces a bike with a new frame, suspension, exhaust, braking system, and styling, all the current Buell offerings will remain derivatives. Do some research on the introduction of the XB series from 2002. You will discover just how much press the XB got for it's ground-breaking design- probably more than you think/remember. The main focus of the 1125R press is the engine and styling- because the frame/chassis is not new. None of us argue, though, that they're both outstanding motorcycles, and we own them 'cause we love 'em. (Message edited by redbuelljunkie on August 13, 2008) | ||
| Guell |
Redbuell, the frames between the xb and the 1125 are actually different, just look the same... | ||
| P_squared |
Completely derived from the XB? That's a curious statement to make. The frames appear the same to a casual observer, but they aren't. Agreed that the engines are completely different. So that leaves the wheels, brakes and body being parts that "interchange." ZTL2 - I supposed you could argue it's derived based on the introduction of the XBRR. I'm not going to argue wheels. That leaves body work. Tail sections are nearly interchangeable in regards to the plastics. Different sub-frames though. My opinion says a completely new bike that shares technology originally introduced on the XB platform. To a casual observer, the 1125R appears to be a derivative of the XB. I don't make that association personally, but that's just me. | ||
| Xl1200r |
Not at all- the only thing in common between the 1953 Covrvette and a '67 L88 is a fiberglass body. If you recall, the '53 'Vette didn't even have a V-8, they were fitted with the "Blue Flame" six cylinder engine. The only relationship between the two is the name, body material, two seats and limited production numbers. The 1125R is completely derived from the XB- with an out-sourced engine (still a V-tiwn), and many parts that interchange. That's as "real" as it gets. Your logic is flawed. There are probably more similarities between a '53 and '67 Vette than there are between an XB12R and an 1125R. But that's besides the point. Just because something is an evolution of something else doesn't mean it can't be "iconic". Take even an XB. In a twisted sense, an XB is nothing more than a Tuber with a slightly different frame made to hold gas and a relocated shock. P.S. - The Helicon is Buell's second liquid-cooled powerplant. (Message edited by xl1200r on August 13, 2008) | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Geez guys, The XB frame was made larger for the Ulysses, and then adapted to the 1125R (a derivative). If you had a car that shared frame design, chassis, brake design, several body parts, wheels, final drive system, fuel injection system and controls- would you consider it a "ground-breaking" new design? It's a derivative. Speaking of cars, I'm hard pressed to find any similarities or parts that would interchange between a '53 and '67 'Vette- are you really serious about that argument? They are both GM two door, two seat fiberglass cars named Corvette- that's about it. In a twisted sense, an XB can be considered a tuber if the only criterion required for similarity is powerplant. Otherwise, the XB differs from tube-frame Buells in frame, chassis, swing arm, controls, all body work, wheels, and braking system. You're right, Erik Buell purchased a liquid-cooled, two-stroke, square-four engine from overseas (Britain, I think) in the early 80's, and even sold one (1) race bike. But when discussing "Buells" on forums such as these, it is generally agreed that everybody is referring to bikes produced by the H-D/Buell company formed in 1993. Finally, why would anyone not want to have a bike that's derived from an icon such as the Buell XB? You'd think people would want to be more closely related to, than trying to distance themselves from, the XB series of bikes. Any more questions? | ||
| Badlionsfan |
The XB frame was made larger for the Ulysses, and then adapted to the 1125R (a derivative). Sorry to break it to you Duc...Brad.... I mean Redbuell, but frame is NOT considered to be an XB frame. They look the same from the outside, but when you start taking off air box covers and seats, you see the major differences. There are pics here somewhere, I'll try to find them for you. EDIT-- here's the thread for 1125r frame pics. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/4062/384144.html?1218208554 (Message edited by badlionsfan on August 13, 2008) | ||
| Xl1200r |
I don't think anyone is arguing that the 1125 isn't derived from the XB. They're arguing that the fact that is doesn't mean it can't be an iconic bike. Plus, you just started using "groundbreaking" in place of "iconic". Stick to the original argument. If you had a car that shared frame design, chassis, brake design, several body parts, wheels, final drive system, fuel injection system and controls- would you consider it a "ground-breaking" new design? It's a derivative. Yes. Pontiac LeMans = relatively boring. Pontiac GTO = Iconic. Same body. Same interior. Same frame. Slightly different drive train. | ||
| Guell |
Redbuelljunkie- Your buell history is a bit skewed too, he bought a whole company and reworked the chasis heavily on the rw750 to the point where it handled well. Why wouldnt the really early buells be considered on this site such as the rr1000? The frame difference has been beaten to death. Its different than the uly. The xb is an x braced frame. The 1125 has no x brace in it. They only look the same... The 1125 frame is evolved. They took everything that was great about the xb and made it better. Again, the xb being iconic is a opinion. I would consider the 1125r to be a more iconic bike for buell. But then again, its an opinion. | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
That's so interesting, especially when Buell has stated that the 1125R frame is an "updated" XB frame design with the longer rails from the Ulysses for additional fuel capacity. Give me a few, and I'll locate the complete quote for you. I don't know why this is such an argument- how can it not be a derivative of the XB frame... it's so obvious. Does it make you feel good to call me Brad? My name is Peter Hampton, I live in Jacksonville, Florida, I am the Customer Service Manager for St Johns Powersports in Palatka, Florida, I currently work part-time due to being run over by an SUV and sustaining eight (8) fractures (the XL883 I was riding was totaled- thank goodness the XB12R was safely at home in the garage that day), I have owned three (3) Ductais (love 'em), five (5) Triumphs (love 'em), one (1) BMW (love the twins), 3 XLs (love 'em but also have had trouble), four (4) Buells (S1, X1 tube models, XB9R, XB12R... adore them all, but have had troubles), and multiple bikes from the Big Four (never had any trouble, but they have no soul- just plain vanilla). So please, at least give me a different nick name. | ||
| Guell |
"None of us argue, though, that they're both outstanding motorcycles, and we own them 'cause we love 'em." thats all that really matters, im off my soap box. Go ride fools. | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
From the Buell website: Here's the XB12R spec- "Buell Intuitive Response Chassis (IRC) With its 52-inch wheelbase, the Firebolt handles with surgical precision. The rigid chassis keeps you stable and confident through the turns, while the 21-degree rake and 3.3-inch trail improves agility. Frame and swing arm Handling is key to everything we do. That’s why our massive frames and swingarms are made of aluminum. Lightweight and extremely rigid, they won’t flex or bend in the corners. Incorporating the nearly 4-gallon fuel tank into the frame and the oil reservoir into the swingarm also improves handling. By lowering the placement of the fluids, the center of gravity shifts downward, which explains why a Buell flicks so effortlessly through corners." And for the 1125R- "Buell Intuitive Response Chassis (IRC) The Intuitive Response Chassis (IRC) is the stiffest we’ve ever built, resulting in a bike that’s better able to hold a line with minimal flexing or bending. Constructed of lightweight aluminum, it responds to aggressive riding with precision and predictability, delivering an unprecedented amount of rider feedback, regardless of road conditions. Frame and swing arm The cast-aluminum swing arm has been specifically designed for improved rear suspension geometry while its stiffness has been tuned for the 1125R. Its pivot shaft is carried in the engine cases to create a stiff connection between the rear wheel and the rest of the chassis. Slider bobbin added to the swingarm for protection and use of a rear stand." According to Buell, they're both IRC designs with the 1125R being the latest/greatest version. And yes, this all goes back to my opinion that that the 1125R will not be considered an iconic bike like the XB already is. Only time will tell, but there is sure a lot of people here wishing to be different... truth is, we are different- we own Buells. | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Oh, two other differences of note- The 1125R frames (as with all new Buell frames) are manufactured in the US. The previous generation XB frames had been manufactured by Verlicchi in Italy. and The new DDFI-3 fuel injection is sourced from an American company- IDS (Intelligent Design Solutions) The 2007 and earlier DDFI equipped Buells were Magneti- Marelli (same as Ducati and several other manufacturers) | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Brad had alot of bikes too.  | ||
| Mr2shim |
Redbuell is God, he knows EVERYTHING. The rest of you need to just STFU.  (Message edited by mr2shim on August 13, 2008) | ||
| Sloppy |
Having this discussion is like asking which is better, Vanilla or Chocolate. In other words, kinda pointless. Let's boil this down - If you want the fastest bike then get the Hayabusa. If you want a great handling bike then get the Aprilia RS250. If you want the best touring bike get the Gold Wing. So, if you're deciding on which bike to own, then you need to get the one that moves your emotions -- that's what motorcycles are, moving emotional mojo. Get the bike that puts the biggest smile on your face. For me, that would be the air cooled series cause I have a passion for air cooled bikes (my first passion is 2 stroke bikes, but that's a different story). So what moves your mojo? There will always be a better, stronger, faster, bike out there so don't worry about it. Which one makes you want to make love to your spouse as soon as you ride home? Now, that's the bike to own. And the correct answer to the first question is Vanilla. Sorry Chocolate fans, it truly is Vanilla. | ||
| Court |
>>>The 1125R frames (as with all new Buell frames) are manufactured in the US. That is an inaccurate statement. Much of the other information in this thread is inaccurate as well. Welcome to the Internet. | ||
| Lost_in_ohio |
This one point is true beyond discussion. I still cannot get beyond those pods. | ||
| Hr_puffinstuff |
i agree, Court.....that crap about vanilla was just WRONG. as proof, i'll put forward the fact that vanilla can be covered in chocolate syrup, but nobody makes vanilla sauce for chocolate ice cream. |
