| Author | Message | |||
     Ferocity02 |
Well I recently have been having this problem. The bike does not want to idle in open loop. When I first start the bike, it idles okay for about 10 seconds around 1000rpm, then it drops and tries to idle at 600-800rpm with 5.9% TPS. I have to bump it up to in between 5.9% and 6.3% so it wouldn't die. During this time, there is a strong smell of gas coming out of the pipe, kind of like a car without cats. Once it warms up and get into closed loop, the idle jumps back up immediately to around 1000rpm. I decided to datalog the bike while it was idling warming up. It clearly shows the idle improving once it hits closed loop. Also at this time, some of the other parameters, of which I am not too experienced, change also. These are shown in the MLV plot as well. I just changed the spark plugs thinking it might be a fouled plug. Also, I noticed the AFV was at 90 the entire time, which is what the minimum is set to. I didn't notice this before starting so I have no idea if putting it back to 100 will change anything. I'll go try again after posting this and letting the bike cool. Here is the MLV plot with some different parameters. The fuel maps used for this were the stock race maps. I'll also attach the log file. I did a few revs at the end just for fun. The log file it attached also. The bike is a 2005 XB12Scg EDIT: I upped the AFV to 100 and it idled a little better. Then I put it all the way up to 125 and it idled perfectly at 1050rpm with 5.9% TPS I then went for a short 5-min ride and the AFV fell to 119, but the bike felt very good, solid, and smooth. It idled perfectly. There was little to no decel popping. I then went for another 10-min ride and the AFV fell again to 113. Bike still felt good, but there was a little more popping on decel than before, which I guess is expected if bike is leaning itself out. 7/11: Just went for another longer ride with some 3000rpm cruising to help the ECM learn. AFV dropped to 107 and the popping came back. I also cleaned the TB, what I could of it at least and the idle didn't need adjusting. I'll ride it again tomorrow and see if it drop anymore, I think it might level off around 107 since this last ride was much longer than the previous two and it didn't fall as much. I wonder how it ended up at 90...
 (Message edited by ferocity02 on July 11, 2008) | |||
| Ferocity02 |
Okay... So I just tried it again and upped the AFV to 100 and it idled a little better. Then I bumped it up to 125 and it idled GREAT at 5.9% TPS right around 1050rpm. So what does this mean? My idle VE tables are too lean? After some driving won't the AFV drop back down to 90 again? Any help would be appreciated, maybe some tuning is in order. | |||
| Elf |
Possible intake manifold leak? | |||
| Ferocity02 |
Wouldn't an intake manifold leak make it idle too high? I just took it out for a short, 5 minute ride. The AFV dropped from 125 to 119. It felt good, rode smooth, little to no popping. I guess I will keep riding it and see where the AFV ends up. I'm guessing a AFV that's too high isn't going to hurt anything, correct? | |||
| Elf |
Just your fuel mileage  I'm not sure on the idling higher part. I was just basing it off of the fact that when you added fuel (raised AFV) it idled better. Sounds like it might have been starving for fuel. Easy to check for leaks, though. What kind of plugs did you put in there? Same heat range as stock? | |||
| Mr2shim |
Why is your AFV so high? I try to keep mine right at 100. Runs like a champ. Idle's a bit low but the bike and I seem to like it. Are you data logging when you ride? See what VE analyzer does for your map. (Message edited by mr2shim on July 10, 2008) | |||
| Ferocity02 |
The AFV is so high because I raised it to see what would happen, and it ran WAY better. I'll ride around some more and see where the AFV ends up. If it drops below 100 again then there is probably a mechanical issue I'd guess since this has never happened before with stock maps. | |||
| Ferocity02 |
Just went for another 10-min ride and the AFV fell to 113. | |||
| Treadmarks |
I have also noticed on both my bikes that the big twins like to be fat down low. Don't spend too much time down low with the fuel that fat or you will start going through spark plugs. | |||
| Xl_cheese |
pull your airbox off and clean your throttle body. I went from having to have the tps at 6.1% to idle at 950 to only needing the tps at 4.7%. | |||
| Ferocity02 |
pull your airbox off and clean your throttle body. How did you go about doing this? Did you leave the TB on the bike and clean it or remove the TB? Looks like it would be a pain in the ass to remove without dropping the whole motor. On my bike, the TB and intake manifold are one piece. How did you go about cleaning it without getting any grime/contaminants into the motor? (Message edited by ferocity02 on July 11, 2008) | |||
| Bombardier |
Have you changed the fuel map injector durations to much longer than the factory map? It sounds like the AFV is adjusting itself to try and set the correct A/F ratio and with an afv of 90 it is sensing that the map is too rich and so is removing fuel from the map. | |||
| Prichmon |
Elf: How do you check for leaks? +1 on recommendation TB cleaning. | |||
| Elf |
Spray a little carb cleaner or WD-40 around the intake manifold where it connects to the heads while the bike is idling. If the idle changes, you've got a leak. | |||
| Ferocity02 |
The service manual recommends spraying propane around the leaks. Sounds like a good idea but awfully dangerous. | |||
| Moosestang |
You can also check for leaks using a bottle of propane, if the idle changes, you have a leak. | |||
| Moosestang |
Whoops, didn't see Ferocity's post.  propane is not dangerous, just open/close the nozzle as needed. | |||
| Blake |
There is no closed loop idle. | |||
| Ferocity02 |
There is no closed loop idle. There sure as hell is. | |||
| Id073897 |
Idle is in closed loop. This can be seen clearly from the log at time 661.09s, when the O2 sensor get's active: veCurr2 is decreasing, but pw2 is (slightly) increasing. Regards, Gunter | |||
| Bombardier |
Have data logged my 12 and VE the table. Applied it to the ecu and as it much richer the afv always goes to 90 if the learn enable is not turned off. | |||
| M1combat |
You want to tell MLV to not adjust the closed loop area. |
