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Prof_stack
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 03:15 pm: | 
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Or maybe a Rotax single for an updated Blast (it REALLY needs a makeover - I know, I had the '00 model). Recall the Blast was the "test mule" for the XB twin for a couple of years. |
Mattwhite
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 03:40 pm: |
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I don't think they're claiming any accuracy with the picture, it's a guess.
My guess for '08 is trickle down from the RR motor.
A shorter stroke and wider bore could provide similar displacement to the current motors and allow higher revs. The rev limit is a common complaint even in positive reviews of the 1200. It would also bump up the HP.
I don't know if the weight savings are just from magnesium or if the different castings would also be lighter in aluminum.
The intake wouldn't work on a street bike, but Harley was able to make their exhausts sound better because they got less noise from the new motor and transmission. Buell already updated the transmissions without changing the exhausts, so they should have more room to tune the airflow for performance.
Of course they could go for a double and launch a superbike contender at the same time. |
Tommy_black_shark
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 05:14 pm: |
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I was just reading something the other day about GM and Honda each breaking their own Cardinal rule by buying an engine from a direct competitor, each other. It's a new world out there and I think anything is possible. Since Honda doesn't seem to be doing anything with the RC51 tooling maybe they'd let it go cheap. All that power and Honda reliability, you wouldn't need to worry about who would service it. |
07xb12scg
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 08:45 pm: |
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I was just reading something the other day about GM and Honda each breaking their own Cardinal rule by buying an engine from a direct competitor, each other.
Oh yeah? Which engine(s) changed hands? |
Austinuu
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 09:07 pm: |
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I believe GM used honda engines and transmissions in the 2004- current Saturn VUE.http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3012/is_9_181/ai_79007382/pg_5
(Message edited by austinuu on June 30, 2007) |
Tommy_black_shark
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 09:17 pm: |
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Oh yeah? Which engine(s) changed hands?
Also, Honda is using a small diesel from GM, maybe Isuzu? |
Jwhite601
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 09:31 pm: |
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The Pontiac Vibe and Toyota Matrix are siblings also, but im not sure if it has the Toyota motor or GM powerplant. All the manufacturers do it, Ford/Mazda, Mercury/Nissan, GM/Honda, GM/Toyota, Dodge/Mitsubishi, I've even worked on AMC's that had an engine that used Ford AND GM parts. It wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if Buell used someone elses engine.
(Message edited by jwhite601 on June 30, 2007) |
Crusty
| | Posted on Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 11:09 pm: |
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Eleven years ago, Buell took a Sportster engine and made it produce 50% more Horsepower. In that span of time, they've improved the powerplant tremendously. The XBRR makes 150 HP.
Why do they have to get a powerplant from another manufacturer? Having seen what they can do with a pushrod engine, doesn't anyone believe that they could produce a competitive motor without having to buy one from somebody else?
Can you imagine what the V-Rod would be like if it had been developed by the Elves in East Troy, instead of Bulgemobile mindset drones?
Maybe Buell's about to let the world see what it is really capable of. |
07xb12scg
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 12:31 am: |
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Why do they have to get a powerplant from another manufacturer? Having seen what they can do with a pushrod engine, doesn't anyone believe that they could produce a competitive motor without having to buy one from somebody else?
That's a great point. I'm sure Erik and the boys could design and build an amazing engine if they had the resources. I'm not exactly sure how things run, but I assume Erik has to get approval from HD to do anything of this magnitude. In order to come up with a new engine from scratch, HD would have to give Buell a ton of capital and I'm not so sure they'd be willing to do that for a Buell only engine.
Can you imagine what the V-Rod would be like if it had been developed by the Elves in East Troy, instead of Bulgemobile mindset drones?Remember that the V Rod engine was developed in conjunction with Porsche. Their engineers are certainly not slackers. If HD developed that engine alone it might weigh twice as much? |
Indy_bueller
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 12:50 am: |
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Why do they have to get a powerplant from another manufacturer? Having seen what they can do with a pushrod engine, doesn't anyone believe that they could produce a competitive motor without having to buy one from somebody else?
Sure they could. The unfortunate fact is that Buell does not have an engine assembly line of its own. Nor do they have space right now to put one in. I'd be willing to bet that this is on Flicks "To Do" list.
The way I understand it, there is a "contract" relationship regarding the manufacturing of the current XB motor by HD. I may be wrong, but the way I see it, Buell could have any part they want produced by anyone they want. Hence wheels from China, frames from Italy, so on and so forth.
Buell could design a V-8 engine and have it produced by Fiat, if that is what they wanted to do. At least, that is how I understand the process.
The one thing most folks here don't seem to understand is that Buell is owned by Harley Davidson International. That parent company owns Harley Davidson, Eagle Mark Savings Bank, and Buell Motor Company. They operate as separate entities, up to the point where they have to provide financial information, etc to HDI. |
Mattwhite
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 06:48 pm: |
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Did everyone forget the news from the capital drive motor factory over the winter?
HD wanted the union to give some up some benefits in order to get investment in the plant. They said it would add jobs, so it's probably a new engine rather than upgrades to the existing line. I think the union voted it down so it ended up going to KC.
Either HD or Buell is probably getting a new engine platform. If it's like the auto industry the timing wouldn't be likely for that line to produce engines yet, but we can hope HD moves quicker. It could even be plans the dirtbike motors. Everyone assumes those will be outsourced, but it's all guesswork.
There's been a trend in the manufacturing industry toward flexible plants. They could be making an engine platform that will allow enough variety to put dirtbike and sportbike motors on the same line. It could spread development and capital costs across a higher sales volume. That would make it easier to get all the new projects past the bean counters.
(Message edited by mattwhite on July 01, 2007) |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 08:38 pm: |
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Less than 7 days... |
Cityxslicker
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 08:43 pm: |
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and you had to post anony to do that? I thought everyone KNEW it was 07/08... When bikes will be showing up at the dealer?, is the more pertinent question  |
Crusty
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 09:03 pm: |
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I wonder if they might let the folks at Homecoming know what's coming? After all, we'll be there on the 8th, so we wouldn't be getting anything over on the dealers.
Wouldn't THAT be a cool little fringe benefit. |
Mattwhite
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 09:29 pm: |
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There was a suggestion in another thread to hang around at the track on Sunday. |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 10:12 pm: |
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That would be a good idea! |
Aatch
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 12:18 am: |
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anonymous = Erik Buell??? |
M1combat
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 03:32 pm: |
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Sometimes Aatch. It's always someone under NDA with Buell though. The site admins scrutinize the origins of the Anony posts so it's a bit of a "sacred" thing here. You won't know who specifically it is, but you can generally trust the source.
I have seen Erik post on here as Erik specifically as well but as I recall it was an unrelated subject. |
Indy_bueller
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 04:22 pm: |
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Yea, just search for "Erik". You should have no problem finding it.
Just kidding.
 |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 11:27 am: |
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Maybe they'll start building the damn XB12ST I've been waiting for...
Only a couple days, but for me it doesn't much matter. I just bought my '07, so I'm in no hurry to off it.
New engines? I'm not opposed to the idea, but the lump is part of what defines a Buell for me. I love the combination..."opposites attract"... ;)
In my opinion, putting a super-fast liquid cooled DOHC twin in a Buell chassis would only put them in direct competition with the Italians and Japenese, as opposed to being something a little different as they are currently. That 50-year-old engine design sets Buell apart from basically everyone else.
Of course, that doesn't mean I wouldn't give up my first born for one... |
Paintballtommy
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 11:56 am: |
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okay so they are announcing the new buell product on sunday. when and if it is a bike would we be able to run to the dealership and buy it? |
Nasty73z
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 12:09 pm: |
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Dealerships should probably have them within 2-4 months after the announcement. Higher volume dealerships will get them first, I know at the one I used to work for we didn't get our TT for like 5 months. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 01:05 pm: |
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I wonder how quickly the website will be updated once everything is announced?
~SM |
Josh_cox
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 01:07 pm: |
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Dealers will begin receiving 08 models around July 16. That does not mean this model will be there then. Remember how long it took for XB's to show up after they were announced? |
Paintballtommy
| | Posted on Friday, July 06, 2007 - 01:15 pm: |
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oh man i cant wait. ahhhhhhh i wanna jump off a bridge im so excited |
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