| Author | Message | ||
     Livnlo |
or you could always buy a moped | ||
| Roadrailer |
We may not know the attitudes, but we absolutely know the circumstances and conditions, thanks to the video evidence.  BTW, if you don't want people to be critical of your riding style, don't post videos for the world to see. Such is the internet. | ||
| Jjk |
For those people who criticize ride videos, I always assume it's because they don't have the same skill set as the riders they are critiquing. It is very easy to look at a video and say "how dangerous!" when you don't realize exactly what a modern sportbike is capable of. It was very clear to me from that video that those riders are very skilled and experienced. No running wide through corners, no slamming on the brakes on the entries, etc. Are they perfect? No, of course not. But come on. When that video was posted, the host didn't say "this is the right way to do it". Just watch and enjoy. | ||
| Rkc00 |
If you don't want to be passed by someone faster you have two options here, speed up or get the hell off the bike. Or just stay at the back like I did. Mike Long Island, NY 06 XB12X Black of course | ||
| Roadrailer |
For those people who criticize ride videos, I always assume it's because they don't have the same skill set as the riders they are critiquing. It is very easy to look at a video and say "how dangerous!" when you don't realize exactly what a modern sportbike is capable of. It was very clear to me from that video that those riders are very skilled and experienced. No running wide through corners, no slamming on the brakes on the entries, etc. Are they perfect? No, of course not. But come on. When that video was posted, the host didn't say "this is the right way to do it". Just watch and enjoy. You know what they say about assumptions.  Please note that, for the most part, I am NOT criticizing riding skills here. I am, however, critical of the decisions they made while riding. Hanging out on (or crossing over) the double yellow in a left hander; not a good decision, and, quite frankly, a pretty good indication that the rider is in over his head. Passing a rider on the right in his own lane; not a good decision, especially since it appears that the rider being passed doesn't even have a mirror on the right. Passing a vehicle in a corner without a clear sight line, leading to a very close encounter with oncoming traffic; not a good decision. Or just stay at the back like I did. Good decision! I enjoy a good ride video, but I just hate watching another rider make bad decisions that put themselves or, worse, other riders at risk. You can either close your eyes to it, or you can learn something from it. | ||
| Trac95ker |
The camera was mounted on the left side of my helmet. Thats why it looks like I'm over. The tires are three feet to the right. "To close for comfort" We obviously have a difference in opinion. | ||
| Roadrailer |
The camera was mounted on the left side of my helmet. Thats why it looks like I'm over. The tires are three feet to the right. "To close for comfort" We obviously have a difference in opinion. There are several point in that video where you're clearly over the line in left handers. Your wheels MAY be right of the line, but your body is clearly over. You're nuts if you think that was a clean pass. If that SUV had been going much faster (or a bike hauling ass in the other direction) you'd be a hood ornament. You got lucky with that one. | ||
| Smokescreen |
I live in the South; it is not something "we" do. And what part of the South would that be that you live in? I've been riding in the North GA mountains for a couple of years now. All my experiences have been people either let you pass or they yield on the shoulder and let you around. If being passed is a problem for you, simply don't ride with us. I have the capacity to evaluate and decide what and when I do and the outcome has always been the same, me on two wheels screaming down the road. I ride my own ride, if you like riding at the posted speed limit and living a safe suburban life, maybe you should have come and signed up for some demo rides. Might be more your caliber. Smokescreen | ||
| Trac95ker |
If,if,if...It wouldn't of mattered if the vehicles were side by side. There was plenty of room. | ||
| Roadrailer |
And what part of the South would that be that you live in? I've been riding in the North GA mountains for a couple of years now. All my experiences have been people either let you pass or they yield on the shoulder and let you around. If being passed is a problem for you, simply don't ride with us. I have the capacity to evaluate and decide what and when I do and the outcome has always been the same, me on two wheels screaming down the road. I ride my own ride, if you like riding at the posted speed limit and living a safe suburban life, maybe you should have come and signed up for some demo rides. Might be more your caliber. Smokescreen Pay attention; I have no issues with being passed. If a faster rider comes up on me I will move right and wave him by. My issue with the pass is that the camera bike passed him on the right in his own lane. In addition, it appears that the bike being passed had no mirror on that side, so he couldn't see the pass coming. Had the leading bike moved right for any reason, there would have been no place for the passing bike to go. Two guys go down for no reason. Do you understand the difference between this situation and a pass in the opposing lane? Good for you if you've been getting away with ignorant moves like this. You've been lucky. I hope I'm not the guy you take out when you screw it up. Let me say it again, just so you understand, my only issue with the pass is that it was done on the right in the same lane. I have ridden tens of thousands of miles in TN, AR, MO, and MS, and have passed and been passed successfully more times than I can count, ON THE LEFT. I don't have an issue with a clean, proper pass, and I don't have a problem with speeding under the right conditions. Clear now? (Message edited by roadrailer on April 05, 2007) | ||
| Roadrailer |
If,if,if...It wouldn't of mattered if the vehicles were side by side. There was plenty of room. So that makes it a good idea?  One driver freaks out and twitches and you've got a face full of mirror. You're putting a lot of faith in a couple of drivers you don't even know. If it's not a race why risk foolish passes like that? (Message edited by roadrailer on April 05, 2007) | ||
| Rogue_biker |
I cannot believe some of the belly aching in here. I thought the video was right on and didn't see anything in it that was anywhere close to dangerous. Broke the speed limit? Of course! Who doesn't? If you're afraid of speed, ride a bicycle. Crossed the double yellow? Who doesn't as long as it's safe? If you're one who doesn't, fine. Just don't expect others to be like you. Damn! Those of you who think the video is a complete disregard for safety, quit riding and drive a freakin' SUV. It's safe, slow, and you will never see videos like this ever in an SUV website! | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
Passing on the right is illegal, yes ILLEGAL for a reason. It's dangerous and rude. I resent you saying we do bonehead moves like that here in the south. No we don't. I'm not going to even lie and say I follow the traffic laws when I ride, but passing people on the right in their own lane is not cool period. I would have a big problem with it if you did it to me. You wanna pass me? Do it on the left when it's safe to do so. I'm happy to yield to riders wanting to go faster than I feel like going at the moment. The roads aren't a race track, and I don't ride on a race track with my street bike because I don't want that level of risk on public roads while riding a machine I've put a great deal of money and time into. I'm not trying to be ugly, so don't take it that way. Just use your head and don't put other riders in danger. Pass on the left. I enjoyed your videos by the way. Thanks for sharing. That looked like a heck of a lot of fun! You guys do ride well. | ||
| New12r |
My issue with the pass is that the camera bike passed him on the right in his own lane. The rider who got passed has no mirrors at all, or turn signals either while we are at it. The way I see it, Tracker had one moment of opportunity to pass, one whack of the gas and he was by him, only took a second. Also, Bullet gets passed by his squidly brother on a 636 on the right all the time at over 100mph, so the guy who got passed was cool with it.......that is all that matters! I hope you enjoyed the video! Now I need some track footage to show you what a 1:40 lap around Barber looks like!(yes that is flying around Barber) | ||
| Hammer71 |
If I can ever get down for that one I'll tape it.... And be right on your back tire for some good footage. | ||
| Roadrailer |
The rider who got passed has no mirrors at all, or turn signals either while we are at it. So he has no way of seeing behind him (without turning around) and no way to signal his intentions? Great. I feel better about it already. The way I see it, Tracker had one moment of opportunity to pass, one whack of the gas and he was by him, only took a second. Also, Bullet gets passed by his squidly brother on a 636 on the right all the time at over 100mph, so the guy who got passed was cool with it.......that is all that matters! So why not pass in the opposing lane, where there's lots more room? It's not a race; there are lots of opportunities to pass if you show a little patience. And it really doesn't matter if the guy is "cool" with it or not, it still doesn't make it smart. He has no way to know it's coming. Just because you get away with something doesn't automatically make it wise. | ||
| Slaughter |
This is exactly why in our Angeles Crest/Angeles Forest Highway we now have double fine zones, hyper-zealous enforcement of motor vehicle and equipment (including smog) - A double yellow with speed and reckless charges in the area can now cost nearly $2500 We're bringing this down on our own heads. Too many complaints from those evil cell-phone-talking-SUV-driving-soccer-moms. Remember, they take the time to write and call their governmental representatives. What's our defense? That we had it under control? At least it can inspire others to mimic the behavior of these more skilled riders - so I can keep my supply of spare racebike parts well stocked. | ||
| Smokescreen |
So TX05Xb12s, you just decide which laws you want to break then? You've never passed someone on the highway in a lane right of the fast lane? That's illegal too. So is drag racing (which cops would consider ANY group bikes moving at elevated speeds). I suppose you get on Killboy and talk s**t about people who make mistakes in front of the camera there too. I thought you people bought a Buell to enjoy it. Oh, that's right! You all bought a Buell to tell your friends how badass you are. And when I say South, I mean GA, AL, SC, TN, NC. If you don't live in one of these states then you don't live in the south. Get over it.  | ||
| Brineusaf |
Gosh you people bitch alot about riding that isn't your own. Nice video guys! You're nuts if you think that was a clean pass. Well it appeared to be a clean pass to me... did he hit the vehicles? Big deal if he crossed the line. That's why you're supposed to practice looking through the turn - so you can make adjustments where they are needed. Did he get his head taken off? No? Then no adjustments needed to be made. Ride On. | ||
| Trac95ker |
The guy I passed on the right was cool with it. He held his line. Thats why I passed on the right. If he wanted me to pass on the left he would of got over. We were going 80 or 90. At that speed riding styles change. Looking in your mirror is not always a good idea. It is more important to focus on the line rather than looking in your mirrors, that could get you killed. You are going to be in for a big surprise if you do a track day. | ||
| Roadrailer |
His point, Smoke, is that passing on the right is not smart. I personally don't care if it's illegal or not, it's a stupid move. I think we all enjoy our Buells, but some of us also realize the risks involved in riding, and take steps to minimize the unnecessary ones. Part of evaluating those risks is turning a critical eye to our own riding, and the riding of others. That's how you learn. It's not impossible to have fun and think at the same time. And when I say South, I mean GA, AL, SC, TN, NC. If you don't live in one of these states then you don't live in the south. Get over it.  Oh god that's rich. Arkansas and Mississippi aren't in the South? Have you been to either of these states? What about Virginia? You know, Richmond, the capital of the confederacy? Hell, seems like half that city's residents think the Civil War (ahem, sorry, the War of Northern Aggression) is still being fought. Southern as it gets, champ. | ||
| Ducxl |
If he wanted me to pass on the left he would of got over. i wish some of the slower traffic i encountered would have moved to the right.I got stuck,and had to modulate slower to increase distance then faster to enjoy the tight corners.I was spoken to at the event and warned not to pass on the right(i never did it,but was creeping up in slow speeds). | ||
| Smokescreen |
Roadrailer, You must be one of those people your talking about. I've been to Mississippi and Arkansas for that matter, as well as stationed at Quantico. You consider that south? You're kidding right? And MS and AK are known for their great riding? It amazes me how you people want to belong to something so bad you'll include just about every state in the south. I suppose California is southern too huh, oh yeah and Wisconsin too! That's where they make Buells right? You guys need to seriously get over yourself and get out and ride. Then you might not be here crying about who's southern and s**t. This was about a video, now it's about who you think is considered southern? You people need a life. I got your Champ right here, anytime little man, anytime you want to put up or shut up, I'm game. | ||
| Roadrailer |
The guy I passed on the right was cool with it. He held his line. Thats why I passed on the right. If he wanted me to pass on the left he would of got over. We were going 80 or 90. At that speed riding styles change. Looking in your mirror is not always a good idea. It is more important to focus on the line rather than looking in your mirrors, that could get you killed. You are going to be in for a big surprise if you do a track day. If you can't glance in you mirrors for a split second on the road, you're going too fast for conditions (of course, he doesn't even have mirrors, but I digress). Riding styles do change at that speed, which makes your fly-by even more ill-advised. The faster you go, the more room you need to adjust for the unexpected. You're cutting off his options if he needs to adjust his line, and he can't even see you doing it. Doesn't matter that he's "cool" with it, it's not smart. Al together now: The Road is NOT the Track. If you want to do shit like this, do it at the track, where the penalty for screwing it up is minimized. No oncoming traffic, no hard objects at the edge of the pavement, no cops to write big tickets, etc. Brineusaf, just because you get away with something doesn't mean it's a good idea. | ||
| Macbuell |
Man, some of you guys need to get over it. You don't like the way those guys were riding in the video. We get it. Crying about it isn't going to change anything. Shut up about it already. Personally I liked the vid but if I remember right, it cut off right before one of the best sections of 60. Am I right? | ||
| Roadrailer |
Roadrailer, You must be one of those people your talking about. I've been to Mississippi and Arkansas for that matter, as well as stationed at Quantico. You consider that south? You're kidding right? And MS and AK are known for their great riding? It amazes me how you people want to belong to something so bad you'll include just about every state in the south. I suppose California is southern too huh, oh yeah and Wisconsin too! That's where they make Buells right? You guys need to seriously get over yourself and get out and ride. Then you might not be here crying about who's southern and s**t. This was about a video, now it's about who you think is considered southern? You people need a life. I got your Champ right here, anytime little man, anytime you want to put up or shut up, I'm game. Who's crying? You brought up the whole "that's how we do it in the South" thing, and you were the one who made a point of (narrowly) defining what the South is. I don't care if where I live is considered in "the South," I'm just pointing out that a lot of people would add a few states to your list. Who's wanting to belong here? I don't think it's a valid part of this thread either, but you keep bringing it up. FWIW, the riding in Arkansas is spectacular. Great roads, very little traffic. On second thought, never mind. Arkansas is horrible. The roads are straight and the women are ugly. Stay away. | ||
| Trac95ker |
This is a little farther down the road. its my favorite part of the ride. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwhlXjDt8eE | ||
| Chadhargis |
When I first started riding, I used to ride with a group of guys who had WAY more experience that I did. I used to think those guys were all nuts. Riding that fast on the street wasn't prudent and it wasn't safe. Fast forward a few years, and I'm sure I do things that some folks think isn't safe. No one wants me to not get hurt more than me, but it's all relative. A safe pass for one person, might make another person feel uneasy. Riding is all about being relaxed and in control (even if you don't appear that way). These guys aren't new riders. They know the risks, they know their skill level, and they accept those risks. Like it or not, that's just how it is. I ride faster than I should on the street, and I've been down a few times. It's just part of riding for me. I know when I throw a leg over the bike it might be my last ride, but it's a risk I'm willing to accept. I do everything I can to keep myself safe, but there is no way to avoid all risk. | ||
| Roadrailer |
I don't think anyone's talking about eliminating all risk from motorcycling. What we're talking about is identifying the biggest risks and minimizing them, maybe even eliminating a few that are totally unnecessary. That's why we wear helmets and gear, and keep our bikes in good working order. And some of us analyze when and where we pass. It's not an issue of skill. I've ridden with guys could pass these guys in the video like they were standing still (I'm not trying to be insulting with this), and they wouldn't make these moves. That inside pass was totally unnecessary, and significantly upped the risk for both riders. I don't care how skilled they are. Same for passing in the opposing lane in a right hander. If it's not a race, why are you trying so hard to stay with the pack, or get ahead? (Message edited by roadrailer on April 05, 2007) | ||
| Smokescreen |
If it's not a race, why are you trying so hard to stay with the pack, or get ahead? Isn't that the idea behind a spirited ride? Keep up till you can't then meet up at our amassing point and keep riding? I suppose all the group rides you have been on have been to Red Lobster with your Hog buddies on Sunday. If your so good at analyzing other people maybe you should be a race coach or something. Otherwise your wasting your time and effort arguing with any of us. We ride like we want to. If that's too much for you, stay your ass in Arkansas with your ugly women. |
