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Archive through November 20, 2006Danger_dave30 11-20-06  02:15 am
         

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Milar
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

>Lets give this a whack. Lets do a thread >on what we'd like to see from Buell in >the form of a Sport-Touring bike. Discuss!

1. Sport-touring bikes are a dying genre. Honda just killed off the VFR.

2. Erik has said he's not building a sport tourer.

Buell is NOT going to build a sport touring bike.

However they might build a BMW RT style touring bike. The Uly showed they can go head to head with BMW's biggest selling bike the GS. BMW's next biggest selling twin is the RT.

IMHO that is where they will go next.

M
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Midknyte
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 01:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Honda just killed off the VFR.

Wha??? News to me. They just brought back the tri-color graphics for 07. Pretty schweet looking.

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Steve_mackay
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 02:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

The tri-color DOES look nice.
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Jaimec
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 03:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

How is the BMW RT NOT a sport tourer?
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Naustin
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 03:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

1. Sport-touring bikes are a dying genre.

}
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Xbeau12s
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 04:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Here is my sport tourer, commuter, canyon carver, stunter, chick magnet, car alarm settin offer, MPV of bikes.

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Bébèrt
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 04:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

S3Touring ??


S3T


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Milar
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 09:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

"Honda is also discontinuing one of the best street bikes that never sold - The Honda Interceptor, which actually started life as the VFR750."

Cycle News #46, page 98, far right column.
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Leftcoastal
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 10:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Here's my SPORT tourer
Emphasis on sport, with the turbo.
AL



Got bags - must be a touring bike?!
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Tunes
Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I still have my S3 also... Why? Cause Buell has not built the replacement they said they were going to build, then said they weren't going to build. I still have the Cycle World article saying they were going to offer hard bags on the XB platform in the future. Limiting hard bags to the Uly platform doesn't cover the rest of the XB models, does it? So, I'm with Steve_mackay. Since Buell doesn't plan on building a REAL replacement for my S3, I'll either build one (I can't wait to see Steve's) or just keep my S3 on the road.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Toni's City-X has been tempting Steve to go XB since they got it ;)

We were discussing the mods to be done to the SS at homecoming, I suspect the suspension
travel of the TT will mean the under-tray of the Uly tail will not need to be modified
after all. That was the only real un tested area of the "build".

I'll have to schedule a visit to help with the build when you get the bike Steve, if
you want the company and extra hands : )

(I must be insane, volunteering to go to Wisconsin in the winter! I haven't done
that since boot camp at Great Lakes in 87)



The tri-color interceptor reminds me of my old 84 VF1000F. One of the best bikes I ever
owned. Larry Pegram's race bike looked like that this year too.
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Xbduck
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Buell needs to find a way to produce add-ons that will allow an owner to create a sport tourer. A lot of dealers would like the extra profit from add-ons. I have been told by one dealer that they don't sell Buell because there is no after market add-ons from the factory with appeal and a good profit margin.

With this type of approach the dealers gets incentive to sell Buell and the consumer gets options to customize their bike.
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Steve_mackay
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Brian, you hit the nail on the head, in regards to the TT and the undertail. It'll still be a TAD taller than the S3T I think, but not much. And the lean angle will still be better. I'm sure tunes, and anyone else with an S3 can attest to, it's too darn easy to scrape pegs on the S3s.

I will still never sell the S3. It's a beautiful bike. But the XB platform is just so much better.

Brian, you know, you're ALWAYS welcome to come up here.

Ya wanna see a crowd of Buell employees gather around a bike, just wait till Homecoming if my plans work out : )

I'd also bet that if there is enough interest in a bike such as I'm going to build, Hals could be talked in to offering a "custom" bike such as this. They have built custom touring bikes in the past. They had build a SWEET looking Roadglide based on a Vrod in the past.

I'd REALLY like a larger fairing than what the Firebolt, or shark skins offers, but I'm not prepared to re-create the wheel. If I had a 3D scanner, I could model my self up a larger fairing(I do design/manufacture molds for a living.)


Maybe the RR fairing might be available in fiberglass by then?

XBduck, Buell does offer the parts. But who would be willing to shell out the $$$? I'm going to guess, I'll have at least $13K in to this bike when all is done.
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Xbduck
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 01:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I guess my biggest issue is that Buell hasn't shown how what they have can be used across the model line. Sure if you have a Uly you can add bags and such, but can they be put on my '03 XB or do I have to modify the pee out of them to get them to work?

Some will pay the $$$ just so they don't have to make major mods themselves. However you are correct in wondering how many are willing to pay the price.
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Xbduck
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 01:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I believe that if there was a way to make simple changes, one step at a time, people could more afford modifications.
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Steve_mackay
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 02:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

The problem is, Erik and company seem to think Sport touring bikes don't sell.

yet BMW sells all the RTs they make, as well as Honda with their ST1300, Yamaha with their FJR, Ducatti with their ST4, etc...

I think the S3 sales gave sport touring bikes a bad taste to the mothership, and Erik. But I think the sales were poor because of the reliability problems of Buells in that era. It's too bad really.

Think of what Buell COULD make with their current resources. A class leading Sport touring bike. With an emphasis on Sport, VS an emphasis on touring like the RT, FJR, ST1300, and the new Concours14. Don't get me wrong, all of those bikes are GREAT bikes in their own right. Just oo big and heavy for my tastes.
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Tunes
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 02:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

After getting off the XB and riding the S3, I can't tell you how many times I scared the crap outa myself scraping my toes on the ground!

Opinions vary on the usefulness of hard bags vs. soft bags vs tank bags. If you want hard bags, you know yer gonna pay. Soft luggage is lighter, cheaper, and easier to put on and take off. But if you want more security, like the looks, etc., you go hard bags. I like hard bags and I don't want to fabricate anything if I don't have to... or in this case, I don't want to. I already have a bike (S3) with hard bags, so Buell needs to either build a bike, or convince me that the Uly is it. And the latter won't happen. I don't like the looks of the Uly and it's too tall. However, ifn ya put a std front fender on, remove the hand guards, bar-end mirrors, lowered the bike by several inches min., you'd have something. But Steve's idea, with the larger fairing is more the way I would prefer to see a sport-tourer look, and being picky, I would like to see the hard bags flow more with the bike, like the S3... ...just my opinion.
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Midknyte
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 11:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

A Firebolt with the relaxed ergos of the
Ss and the benefit of added frame fuel
capacity and some hard bags would be tits!
Leave the fairings as is (beautiful).
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Steve_mackay
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)


After getting off the XB and riding the S3, I can't tell you how many times I scared the crap outa myself scraping my toes on the ground!

ROFLMAO! I can certainly relate to that!

I've ridden the CityX more than the S3T this year. Just because it's more fun IMHO. I have taken the S3T when I NEED to carry stuff, or when I know it's going to rain. It's nice have a fairing you can tuck behind.

I've got all the luggage on the CityX. Tank bag, saddlebags(which are currently being replaced because of a bad zipper, and they wont have replacements till Dec 15th), and the trunk bag. It works, but it's not weather-proof whatsoever.

Midknyte, If I could, I would just make the Firebolt fairing proportionally larger by about 15-20%. }
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Diablobrian
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 01:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Gee Steve I bet you could borrow Dora's off of her race bike for modeling purposes ;)

Where there's a will......



I'd heard that Hal's has built some one-off specials, are you sure it's true? : )
(says the guy that rides one)
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Steve_mackay
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 01:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Yeah, I know I could borrow one, but I don't have access to a 3D scanner to create the point cloud to do it properly. At least not cheaply. And Brian, you should know... I'm a cheap bastard : )

Yeah, the boys at Hals seem to kinda know what they're doing when it comes to custom bikes. I hear they aren't too shabby in the race bike arena as well. : )
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Diablobrian
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 04:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

There has to be someone on here that has access to the scanner...time to advertise the need.

I'm sure someone will help on a project like this.

I'm on a mission....
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=4062&post=782285#POST782285

(Message edited by diablobrian on November 21, 2006)

(Message edited by diablobrian on November 21, 2006)
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Jaimec
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 08:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Somebody in California PLEASE get your XB12Ss over to Corbin so he can not only design a saddle for the bike, but maybe a set of beetlebags. If I could get a color matched set of beetlebags for my Lightning Long I'd be in Hog Heaven!
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Slaughter
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 08:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

The RR could easily be done in fiberglass.

Anybody ask the factory?

I'd bet they could sell a few to "regular" XB owners/racers looking for better aerodynamics. Put a sport touring screen on it and modify it for lights and you'd be good to go... it would seem.

Howzabout just picking up a busted fairing from another bike type and starting from there?
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Kevinfromwebb
Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 09:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

This is a very interesting post. I"m planning on purchasing a ST1300 this spring. I"m going to keep my 12R as it's great for commuting and playing on the weekends.
Here was my main critia for a sport tourer:

Wind Protection
Radio
Cruise
Upright Riding Position
Storage, lockable

The ST fits the bill pretty well. I"ll have to add the radio and cruise but the bike comes with speaker grills and I've found a plug and play cruise. If Buell made a similiar bike I'd look but since they don't I don't have much choice.

JMO

Kevin
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Bandirola
Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 09:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I just bought a BMW R1200ST which has pretty much replaced my S3T as my daily driver. The ergos are almost the same with more power, better handling, smoother running, better long range comfort and the big one RELIABILITY. Don't get me wrong, I love my S3T, but reliability issues have made me move on. If Buell will make the S4T that can compete with my new BMW I will come back in an instant.

Dave
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Tunes
Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 10:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Bandirola, you will find out that BMW's aren't any more reliable than a Buell. Speaking from personal experience, I sold my BMW and bought my Buell because of reliability and customers service issues. My S3T smokes my buddies R1200ST with more power, better handling, smoother running, and better long range comfort. To each his own.
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Jaimec
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

It all depends on your dealer. BMW is on this suicidal mission to shut down ALL of the dealerships that put them on the map with the IDIOTIC idea that they'll sell the bikes in combined auto/motorcycle shops. This rampant stupidity has resulted in the last remaining dealership on Long Island being shut down and now they feel if you live anywhere from Brooklyn through Montauk Point you should be perfectly happy schlepping into MANHATTAN for service.

I've purchased my LAST BMW. Once my local shop is no longer able to provide service and support for my K1200LT I'll likely get rid of it and get a GoldWing. Honda isn't trying to cut their own throats.
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Rubberdown
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I had a R1200ST. GReat bike! Had two Buell XB's, GReat bikes! Got BMW HP2 now. Great bike!

(Message edited by rubberdown on November 29, 2006)
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Swordsman
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 02:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Not to hijack a thread, but Jaimec, just how many auto dealerships is BMW expecting to convert over to dual-purpose? If they had done that from the start I could see it being pretty efficient, but having to move bikes and bike mechanics into a car dealer seems kinda' crazy this far into the game. Hope they don't expect to train the existing car mechanics on the bikes! THAT would be a scary service experience!

~SM

(Message edited by Swordsman on November 29, 2006)
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Whodom
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 03:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I had a R1200ST. GReat bike! Had two Buell XB's, GReat bikes! Got BMW HP2 now. Great bike!

Mike, you are a motorcycle ho.
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Jaimec
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 04:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I've no clue, but I can tell you what is GOING to happen. After spending probably hundreds of thousands of dollars to modify the dealerships to handle motorcycles, getting the new tooling required in the service department, hiring the necessary mechanics, etc. they'll learn they'll get relatively little back on their investment compared to car sales. And as those of us with Buells in Harley dealerships know, that means the bikes will be neglected in favor of the more profitable automobiles and eventually the dealerships will give up on the bikes altogether!! BMW, of course, will have to learn this the hard way. Idiots.
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Ted
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 04:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

i think more gas capacity is a must.
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Steve_mackay
Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 05:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

4.4 gallons at 50+ MPG is good enough for me : )
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