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Buell Motorcycle Forum » XBoard » Buell XBoard Archives » Archive through October 19, 2006 » Brakes Lacking Bite... Do 07's have different pads? « Previous Next »

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Teddagreek
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 09:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I did demo test ride a few weeks ago... I know the bikes are NEW.. Two fingers on the those bikes and my bike were night and day..

Did buell change something for 07 or as I kinda suspect my brakes are slowly getting crappy... I've briefly locked my rear tire on fast stop the other day.. I also notice bit of a wobble when just using the front brake..

I got 10K I think I'm going to change the pads for the hell of it.. Whats a good aftermarket pad?
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T9r
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 09:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

If you have been using the stock pad all this time, those sound like... typical issues.

I say typical because when folks have issues with the brakes this is what it feels like.

Two points of advice... Clean your front brake rotor with brake cleaner, trying not to get the cleaner on anything else. Also clean the hardware off that attaches the front rotor to the rim. Where the rim and rotor touch, at the multiple points is where there builds up resistance. The rotor must be allowed lateral, side to side, movement.

Try that and see what happens. Past that have you checked the torque on the steering head cap.
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Teddagreek
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 10:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Thanks T9r I'll give try tomorrow...

Does make sense if the build up is not allowing movement...

About Checking the torque on the Head Cap
Should I jack the bike like the book says or can I get away with it since its all together.
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Sgthigg
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 11:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Any tips on spraying cleaner on the rotor while it still on the bike?

Will brake cleaner being on amber paint a couple seconds matter? Or will it jack it up?
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Prof_stack
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 11:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

When I got my XB9S back from the 10k servicing, the steering head bearings were tightened. That helped a lot in handling.

But the stock brake pads (1/2 gone) suddenly felt new again thanks to a simple lever or cable adjustment I should have done myself after I suddenly stopped with more urgency than I had anticipated.

Like a new bike again.
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Lovematt
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 11:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

When running the stock pads I often sanded and cleaned the rotor to try and address some of the symptoms you describe. When using brake cleaner I sprayed it onto a rag first instead of spraying while on the bike...always done it that way up until then on bikes and saw no reason to change.

However I always had "spotting" and some vibration/pulsing when using the front brake. I switched to the Lyndall Gold brake pads and within 50 miles the front brake was MUCH better. Apparently the stock pads leave deposits which cause uneven friction points that can produce a number of symptoms. Since switching to the Lyndalls the symptoms completely went away and the performance of the front brakes has been excellent ever since.

Along with checking the usual stuff (lever position, air in brake lines, cleaning the pads/rotors, you might look into different pads when the time comes to replace. I got mine from American Sport Bike...Al took the time to explain what was going on and he was absolutely correct.
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Kdan
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 04:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I got the Lyndall Gold front brakes from American Sport Bike. Like them a lot.
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12r
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 04:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Will brake cleaner being on amber paint a couple seconds matter? Or will it jack it up?
Most certainly, definitely yes ! Motul brake cleaner fries the amber coating quicker than you can say 'WTF'.
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Firebolteric_ma
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 07:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

YUP I WILL 2ND THE "I got the Lyndall Gold front brakes from American Sport Bike. Like them a lot." COMMENT
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T9r
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 07:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

To check the torque on the head bearing you need to follow the instructions in the manual, taking tension off the front suspension via lifting the front off the ground. How you lift it is up to the tools you have though. I often use the rafters in my garage to hang motorcycles and other objects from.

There are many threads on there, do a search, that talk about adjusting the steering head cap screw.
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99buellx1
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 07:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Your pads might also be a bit glazed.
Take them out and rub them on some concrete for a couple seconds to knock the glazing off, should be like new.
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Glitch
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 09:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Lyndall Gold
BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!
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Firebolteric_ma
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 10:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Glitch that is funny, I just put some Lyndall Gold pads on my bike. Front and rears.

The fronts do BZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz and the rears like to lock up even quicker than they did before, as for the rears I think I may go back to stock brake pads.

The fronts work nicely. I can live with the BZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz for now.
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Lovematt
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 10:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I like the BZZZZZzzz sound...better than AAAAAHHHHHHHHHH! when I can't stop....
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Blake
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 11:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

That's funny Matt! LOL
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Glitch
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 11:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I'm still not sure about the Lyndall brakes yet. I'm used to more bite. They stop well and all, they just aren't as aggressive as I *think* I'd like.

Back brake?
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Shinobi13
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 11:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I purchased some Ferodo sintered pads while at Laguna Seca and installed them a few weeks ago. The Ferodo pads have a fantastic feel and really give a lot more grip!! One-two fingered braking is definitely all that's needed now. I also replaced the stock fluid with Motul brake fluid and bled the brake line completely. Fantastic change for low bucks!!

Lee
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Barker
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 04:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

My EBC DoubleH pads BZZZZZZZZZ too!

recently I noticed the more I ride the more the lever softens up. It seems like the fluid/lines are lacking? Whats up with that?
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Teddagreek
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 09:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Working better I'm 75% there.. I really appreciate all the advice..

I cleaned my disk with cleaner but I think I need to hit it with some sand paper to take the glazing off..

I took some wheel cleaner shot all the bolts let soak and Scrubed the hell out it with a stiff brush I have.
I also could push on the rotor and scrub in there.. I repeated this a few times untill I had easy movement of the rotor side to side..

My bike probably had the stock fluid.. So I Drained it and flushed with Synthetic Valvoline brake fluid SynPower.. Bleed it pretty good not having a pump..

End results much less play and pulsing and vibrating is totally gone... Two fingers is okay I have much better smoother braking but still missing that good bite thinks its due to the glazing..

Is there a trick to bleeding the brakes on these bikes.. Took me forever to get it to where I some what happy.. Also a friend mentioned to me to Tie my front brake with a zip tie over night and that will help get some of the air out? How tight do you make it?
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Al_lighton
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 09:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Lyndall has a new HH compound that I'm testing now. I sent a couple sets to some badwebbers to try, jury is still out.

According to Paul Jr. at Lyndall, they will split the difference between the sintered HH pads (stock, Ferodo, EBC) and the Lyndall Golds with regard to bite and feel. They definitely still Bzzzzz. I rode them moderately hard this past weekend on the way to/from the BBQ, liked the feel. I didn't fade them that I noticed, but I don't think I was riding at a fast enough pace to have done so.

Al
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Thespive
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 10:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Heck, my stock pads BZzzzzzzzzz if you listen close enough.

--Sean
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Glitch
Posted on Thursday, October 19, 2006 - 10:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

But can the rider next to you hear the buzz from your pads?
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Jackbequick
Posted on Thursday, October 19, 2006 - 11:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

"..Is there a trick to bleeding the brakes on these bikes..."

Yes, it is called The Knowledge Vault (aka KV), here are three of my favorite recent brake related threads:

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/3842/205900.html?1160663371

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/3842/174272.html?1139415194

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/3842/180731.html?1142990316

If you don't use Henrik's well detailed trick of putting Teflon tape on the bleeder screws you're missing what I consider to be the "Tip of the Century" for making brake bleeding work well and more easily.

I use a Mity-Vac, Henrik's syringe method seems to attain perfection at chasing out elusive bubbles, but, in any case, the KV is a storehouse of knowledge for getting the brakes working right and the info can be applied to almost any motorcycle with a similar brake system.

Jack
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Sloppy
Posted on Thursday, October 19, 2006 - 06:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

A note on multi-caliper pistons. Whenever you change the pads you need to make sure that the pistons extract evenly when you pull the brake lever. If they don't apply even pressure then you will not have full force applied to the brake pads and thus less than optimum brake force. You would "feel" this as a spongy brake lever even though there is no air in the system. If the pistons don't move evenly then you should clean the pistons and test again or just rebuild the caliper.

A note on using a rag and brake cleaner on rotors. The rag HAS to be completely clean of oil or grease. If it's not, the brake cleaner will dissolve grease from the rag and it will be deposited on the rotor. I HIGHLY recommend the use of clean sheets of paper towels for this procedure in place of rags.

Last note. Brake cleaners use extremely nasty chemicals. At a minimum, you should wear NITRILE gloves (not latex) and safety glasses. I typically also wear a solvent cartrdige mask to protect my lungs. Your skin will readily abosrb the chemicals in brake cleaner which your liver would rather not have to deal with...

(Message edited by sloppy on October 19, 2006)
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Teddagreek
Posted on Thursday, October 19, 2006 - 07:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Lyndall has a new HH compound that I'm testing now. I sent a couple sets to some badwebbers to try, jury is still out.

When will these be available???
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Tx05xb12s
Posted on Thursday, October 19, 2006 - 10:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Hey also I would suggest you spray the cleaner on your clean rag and not the rotors. This way you aren't spraying it all over your powdercoat.

American Sport Bike sells a rotor hone for your drill, but I'm thinking sandpaper will probably do the same thing with a little elbow grease. They also recommend you replace the mounting hardware/springs when you remove the front rotor.

Also, according to Matt Purdy at Trojan-Horse, sintered pads provide that bite we're looking for on the front, and semi-metallics give the most "feel" for the rear. He did caution that the sintered pads will wear out the rotors a lot faster though.

I'm at 8,300 miles and think my brakes are still performing like new. However I must say that though I realize the rear brake is intended mostly for stabilization and not necessarily stopping power, I wish it had more feel. It seems to me that it's either not doing much of anything at all back there or locked up. There doesn't seem to be any in-between. Anybody tried that Brembo 4-pot setup Trojan-Horse is selling for about $400USD?
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