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Buellhist_monk
Posted on Saturday, September 02, 2006 - 11:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

First Post

Hi all.

Bought a used '04 XB12S, 9100mi., on Monday. Friday I'm 257mi from home getting gas and the bike is on the sidestand leaning more than its normal horizontal position, broken pivot bolt, no surprise. Glad it didn't fall over. Leaned the bike against a pole, got some cable-zip-ties, fastened stand to bike and she's good-to-go.

Fixed the sidestand by drilling out the 1/4in threaded hole to 1/2 and securing the stand with a 1/2in bolt and nut. No pictures, sorry.

When I bought the bike it had those carbon-fiber frame covers. I told the sales guy the previous owner must have had her down. Sales guy said previous owner had said no to that question at the time of his trade-in for a snow mobile. Buyer beware. Silly me. Today I pulled those carbine-fiber covers off to see how bad the damage really is. Fist size dent on the frame, where a puck would go.

Now, I'm not all too worried about having something that isn't in perfect shape but I know the bike isn't worth the 5425 I paid before taxes, and that makes me a little pissed but I wont dwell I'll move on. What I don't know is how this bike handles compared to a bike in perfect shape. This bike doesn't feel totally planted, like the front end is light, it seems to wobble ever so slightly. I also don't know if the engine sounds like it should. It doesn't sound terrible but it has noises which makes it a long way from being a smooth running engine.

Anyone in Wisconsin care to do some riding sometime? I'd like to get an idea of my Buells soundness.

I also want to re-torque that drive nut since it probably will come loose like the sidestand did. Anything else I missed? I'll keep reading. Great forum!

Kevin
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Brineusaf
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 12:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Congrats...on the purchase, sorry about the dealer kinda screwing you.

Maybe take it back to the dealer and question their sales tactics with someone in a management position?

As far as the bike not feeling planted... did you set the suspension for your weight? What tires?

Will a puck cover the dented area or is it too large?
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Bake
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 12:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Definately take it back to the dealership and have the salesman sit in on a meeting with the manager or owner and you, stay calm and state your case.

Your suspension probably just needs to be setup but I think I would be more inclined to get my money back and buy one from a reputable dealer or off this board.

My .02c
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Xring
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 12:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

The frame dent most likely has nothing to do with handling.

Without the pucks, even falling off the sidestand could dent the frame/fuel tank.

The XB's are sensitive to tire pressure and suspension settings. They also need steering head bearings adjusted regularly.

It took me a few weeks to start trusting my XB...it feels different from other bikes. Now I like it a lot. The suspension and handling are amazing.

I don't think you did bad on price, really. Have you seen how much new retail price is?

Good luck,
Bill
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Pwnzor
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 12:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

If you go back to the dealer, all agitated they will point to the paperwork that says "as-is" or some other schmuck tactic instead of making good.

Go in all honey and sugar, be very cool about it and just see what you can get out of them. For something like that I'd probably look for a fat service credit or similar compensation. You'll probably get your best results shooting for the something the dealer pays squat for, like LABOR. You'll notice that most HD dealers charge 75 per hour and UP for labor, and charge a certain number of "book hours" for a particular job. Book hours are what "the book" says how many hours a job "should" take. Doesn't mean they can't charge you more.

Point being, the dealer pays that mechanic maybe $15 per hour and is charging upwards of $75. It's not tangible, but if you are not planning to work on the bike yourself, the labor is where they stick it to you so get as much as you can.

Maybe they're jerks and won't give you anything in which case you can tip over their trash cans and knock their magazines on the floor as you leave, slamming the door open behind you.

Maybe not that last part.

On a more positive note, dents aside, welcome aboard your new Buell. These are great bikes, sometimes a bit quirky, but it all depends on how well you take care of it. They're easy to work on, and probably the most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels. Take some time and find an out-of-the-way road somewhere with a few turns and some bumps in it, so you can ride the same conditions over and over while you adjust your suspension. Spend an hour or two on it, then ride for a few days, and repeat if necessary. Took me almost a year to dial it in fully. I had to learn more about myself as a rider for it to happen.

Welcome to BadWeB. This is the last stop for all Buell information, the other boards with "Buell sections" don't compare.
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Brineusaf
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 12:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

knock their magazines on the floor as you leave
Think they would do anything...? Sir... Excuse me Sir! (bike starts) Sir you are going to need to... (drowned out my wheelie out of parking lot).

Sorry.. caught in a day-dream there.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 02:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Welcome to badweb!

As many of the racers on the board can attest The XB's "crash well". Meaning the damage
from the average crash is relatively cheap to repair, and the chassis is very hard to
tweak out of shape. If you are concerned enough you could take your bike to GMD compu-
trak <sp?> in Chicago. The specialize in motorcycle frame straightening and optimization.

As has been said these bikes are sensitive to suspension set-up and tires, so that is
probably the culprit not the frame.
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Aldaytona
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 07:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Almost every bike used has been down, it's what they do. How many bikes have you owned that you haven't dropped, or laid down or your buddy let it fall off the stand, ect.?
You bought it and took it home, you own it, period.
If you feel you got "screwed" look in the mirror, not at the salesman unless he made you sign the buyer's agreement and grabbed your wallet.............................
We all get remorse or make mistakes but in the end "we" did it ourself.
Ride it or sell it, either way, you'll feel better.
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Xring
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 09:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I read your post more carefully, didn't notice the first time you mentioned engine noises. The first time I heard my bike run, I literally turned to the salesman and asked "Is it SUPPOSED to sound like that?". Yes. Yes it is. Plus I thought it was only running on one cylinder. Turns out that is just what it sounds like at idle. After a year and a half and 9000 more miles (the bike had 3000 miles on it when I bought it), I don't worry about noises anymore.

Don't neglect to check those steering head bearings.

Welcome to the Buell world.

Bill
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U4euh
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 09:49 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

As someone else said, SUSPENSION SETTING! It will surprise you at how much difference the bike handles. As far as the noise, cannot judge that. Mine is as noisy as rocks in an ole lunchbox, been that way for 23,000 miles. I have heard some that have less miles, and sound worse, but ran fine. Hopefully someone will take you up on a ride. Maybe you could ride over and see DaveS.
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Percyco
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 10:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

When I got my XB I felt the same way, "Holy $hit I paid money for this, I can't even keep it in the road" I thought...Well, I set the suspension to the manual, I put in correct tire pressure (20 lbs were in them) and replaced the bald Dunlop on the front. WHAT A DIFFERENCE ! The noisy engine doesn't bother me as I already own a H-D. I don't think your frame ding hurts a thing and it looks like the price you paid was pretty good.

Good Luck and lets see some pics !
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Jlnance
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 10:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Anyone in Wisconsin care to do some riding sometime?

Welcome to Badweb, this is a great place.

You're lucky enough to be 100 miles from an excellent Buell dealership in Appleton, WI. Dave S, a salesman there, is the source of parts for a large fraction of Badweb. Even if you normally plan on doing your own service work, you might want to take the bike to them for whatever service you have comming up. They will be able to tell you if the engine sounds normal and help you set your suspension up.
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Daves
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 11:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Yes, ride it on up to Appleton and I will gladly look it over and set your suspension for you. Only takes about 15 minutes.
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Daves
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 11:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

PS
Come up on Weds about 5-6:00 and you can go on our BRAG ride with us at 6
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Buellhist_monk
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 01:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Thanks for the replies guys.

Bought the bike from a big four dealer hence no warranty offered for a Buell.

I have dropped or tipped every bike I've owned, but not the Buell yet.

I picked up a service manual from the local HD/Buell dealership and have adjusted the suspension once so far.

Tires are Michelin Pilot Power, front and rear. 42 psi

Going along on a BRAG ride, not exactly sure what BRAG is, would be cool. Am I suppose to be a member?

Some pics of the bike and the modified sidestand bolt.





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Steve899
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 02:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Congrats on the bike, I wouldn't worry about the dent, but 42 psi did you say, that will make it handle strange, I run 34 psi ft & rear on my XB12R 05. Welcome to the world of Buell.
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Jlnance
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 04:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

hence no warranty offered for a Buell.

The bike comes with a 2 year warranty from Buell. The 2 years starts when the bike was first titled, so depending on when the last owner bought it, you may have some left. HD dealers can get you that info by running your VIN through their computers.

not exactly sure what BRAG

Buell Rider Adventure Group. It's the Buell equivalent of HOG. Whether you should join or not depends largely on the local group. I suspect the group in Appleton is excellent, but it's 100 miles from you. It's worthing riding up there to see.
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Old_man
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 05:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I wouldn't worry too much about the dent, I'd put the carbon fiber back on and forget about it.
If they didn't give you a manual with the bike, I'd get one.
Set the suspension to what is given in the manual for your weight.
Set tire pressure to proper recommended pressures.
If the bike is still equipped with the stock Dunlop tires, I would toss them and get some good handling tires.- The best mod I have made to my Buell.

(Message edited by old man on September 03, 2006)
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Buellhist_monk
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 05:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

On the tire the recommended psi reads 42. They were a bit lower than that before I topped them off. The bike felt wobbly more before the increase to 42psi. but I also Increased the rear preload two notches. Next I'll decrease the front preload by 1/2 notch, after increasing it to three lines. 4 lines was just to soft and the forks sagged to half their limit. I'm wondering if my fork oil is past its prime since it's recommended replacement is 10000mi. and maybe that would cause too much sag. Too much sag would be weak springs though, correct?
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Old_man
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 05:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

You have compression and rebound settings that must be adjusted also. The are as important to the handling of the bike as spring preload.
The recommended pressure settings for my XB9s are 36psi front-38psi rear

(Message edited by old man on September 03, 2006)
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Angelwild327
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 06:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

soon as you can, get rid of the Dunlops.. there have been many discussions on the tires and everyone just about, agrees dunlops really suck... hence the pirelli's across the board on the 07 line-up.
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Steve899
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 08:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Too much sag ,weak springs that's right. 42 psi is the max pressure I believe.You should run a lower pressure. Remember as the tire heats up the pressure goes up,as much as 6 psi here in Texas. Tire patch size is related to tire pressure,if you can get comfortable with a low pressure than 42 psi you will have more grip. Ex: Try to do a standing burn out just easing out the clutch with 42 psi vs 25 psi,which do you think would break free easier?
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04xb12s
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 09:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

You don't need to be a BRAG member to ride with the Appleton group, and if you have a buddy that rides another brand, he is welcomed too. It's a good time.
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Buellhist_monk
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 10:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

so... I'm just reading the service manual p.1-51, Handling Irregularities, wheel weights must be on the brake rotor side for the front wheel. Take a look in the first picture I posted. I'll bet my wheels are unbalanced. Just a guess.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 11:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

36psi front and 38 rear is what the manual suggests. If you are doing a track day,
or riding hard in the twisties 30-32 is about right, but the tires will wear faster.

You should go see Dave for help with suspension set-up, and to see his store!

Here is what are known as the aggressive, or Higbee (Shawn Higbee wrote it) settings:

"aggressive settings"

and this is a link to the owner's manual on Buell.com: http://www.buell.com/om/99474-06Y_en/file-5.asp#hdtopic000030
with the relevant section: http://www.buell.com/om/99474-06Y_en/file-5.asp#hdtopic000667
(scroll up to see pics of where the adjusters are located : ))
The 2004 and 2006 use the same settings so don't worry ;)
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Old_man
Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2006 - 11:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I didn't know that they put the manual on the web. I'm glad to see it.
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Slaughter
Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 12:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Don't sweat the dent - at least as far as the bike handles. I'd still be pissed off at the dealer though if that happened to me. Pretty cheesy.

Pic is MY dent. Second pic is Jeff Dixon in the lead with my bike, with MY dent -

Take Dave Stueve up on his offer to setup the suspension for you. These bikes do really well with proper attention paid to suspension. I know it's a crusade of mine but I'd always put money and time into suspension before the motor.


dent


Dixon in the lead


(Message edited by slaughter on September 04, 2006)
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Diablobrian
Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 01:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I dig the 883 number Dixon carries......I wonder if it has any significance? ;)




We all have our crusades Slaughter! Mine is (surprise!) proper riding attire (ATGATT)
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Mags
Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 03:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Hello everyone. Just came back from a short ride and I have to say that I was going to log on to write pretty much the same thing as MONK. I do have a few added questions though. The weeble wobble feeling; how can I adjust the clutch so it's not so hard; the throttle feels chunky, I couln't find a smooth transition on take off; now the one I'm sure does not have a cure She gets so damn hot it's almost not bearable. The inside of my legs were on fire. I won't even get into the noises or I'd never stop writing. Other than all the concerns I have I had a great time learning my bike. Let me know what you all know. I'd have to say that without this forum having my XB12S 05 would not be as enjoyable. I have learned more from this forum than I could get out of the dealership. Thank You, MAGS
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Old_man
Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 03:24 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Mags,
To make the clutch a little easier to pull make sure the cable is lubricated well.
Then what I did is to move the lever in toward the center of the bars about an inch and a half. This allows you to have more leverage in that you are centering your pull more toward the end of the clutch lever. If your hand is large enough to grasp it the pull should be much easier.
I know it worked well for me.
With some miles on the engine and synthetic oil the bike should not get as hot as when new. But it still gets hot.
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