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Buell Motorcycle Forum » XBoard » Buell XBoard Archives » Archive through August 12, 2006 » Help me solve my scary problem « Previous Next »

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Nasty73z
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 02:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Well I went out tonight for a nice ride, onlyh the second time since I had it serviced last week. I was excited because I've spent some major bucks on this thing recently and had yet to feel the power gain from my mods. I was out on a "closed course" and did a run up through the gears and had an extremely violent headshake. I'm talking full lock-to-lock at 90+ mph and it lasted for probably half a football field. I stayed steady on the throttle and after what seemed like an eternity is settled and I went wide towards the grass median. I had no front brake action did some dirt track style back braking to bring it back on the rode. I went down the rode to a gas station and look at the bike and let my nerves settle.

Tire pressure is fine, though the mechanic might have set the suspension back to stock settings but I checked at they are still set to the "aggresive" ones as posted in a chart I found on here. I installed the Crossroads bars, could the more forward position have me putting more weight of the front end and caused it? I have not changed my riding style and never had this problem before. I also had a slight one the day I picked the bike up accelerating hard on the highway on ramp. Could something resulting from the service be causing this? Please give me any advice, I do not want to ride the bike harder until I can get this figured out. Thanks Badweb!
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Sgthigg
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 02:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

FRONT WHEEL BALANCE!!?
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Nasty73z
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 02:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Well I don't know. They were perfectly balanced before it went into the shop, had them balanced when I put the Diablos on probabky 3500 miles ago.
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M1combat
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 03:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Grip the bike with your knees. Keep your arms loose and arms bent. Use your torso to lean into wind instead of pulling yourself forwards with your arms. Do you have wide flat spots in the center of the tires from riding on the freeway a lot? If the engine was out for the mods are all the tie bars and other engine mounts installed properly? Front wheel balance? Rear wheel balance (A lot of shops don't have the hardware to balance the rears)? You aren't steering right to go right are you? Deep heavy gouges in the road not quite parallel to the direction of travel? Is the front ride height stock?

(Message edited by M1Combat on August 09, 2006)
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Gentleman_jon
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 09:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Something is very seriously wrong here.

You did not mention if you were in a turn, or the bike was just going straight. Were you accelerating hard?

You also failed to mention the nature of the service. Old timers always look at what was "fixed" last when there is a strange new problem:-)

Was there any change in speed, direction, or a bump just before the headshake started?

I was also wondering on mileage on tires, and how long it has been since the steering bearings were checked.

Even if everything is good on the bike, going over a sharp bump with the bike laid over hard will cause headshake, as will a very rapid transition from one side to the other under hard acceleration. In my opinion this problem is exacerbated by the Buell short wheel base, and is worse with larger, less smooth riders. Holding the bars too tightly, a normal reaction, doesn't help either.

If everything on the bike checks out ok, you might just find that you are a candidate for a steering damper.

But remember, a damper is not supposed to be used to solve a mechanical problem elsewhere in the bike, it is just to dampen transitional instability that normally occurs in certain high speed cornering events.

Re reading your post I see that you have 3500 miles on your tires.I think that might be getting near the end of the road for them. Change both tires when the time comes for new ones, and it won't be long now.
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Nasty73z
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 11:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I was accelerating hard in a straight line. The service was the 5000 mile service. I didn't rotate the engine, and I do not recall hitting a bumo or anythign before it happened. Nothing out of the ordinary from all the hundreds of others times I have done this. My tires probably have 50% tread left, the front might actually have more than that so I wouldn't think they were a factor.
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M1combat
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 12:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

IT's not the tread it's the profile... Is there a flat spot worn down the middle of the tires?
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2k4xb12
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 12:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Hmmm, a couple things come to mind here and both relate to triple clamps. You say you installed Crossroads -- did you make sure to tighten up the clamps when you slid the fork tubes back into position? Also, isn't the head bearing adjusted during the 5K service? If so, maybe they misadjusted the head bearing torque, or perhaps they forgot to retorque the lower triple clamps when they finished?

Just a couple of thoughts...

Steve.
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Nasty73z
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 02:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

The tires have no flat spots, they still have a nice round profile. I didn't drop the forks when I installed the bars, I loosen the flyscreen housing. Maybe the head bearing torque was misadjusted. I will call the dealership and talk to the mechanic.
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Hammer71
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 03:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

F the mechanic. Obviously they did something to your scoot and wont tell you oops I forgot. Grab some tools and go over the entire front end yourself. it wont take that long and if it fixes the problem then it's worth it. Loosen and retorque every nut and bolt on the front end and see what happens, as of now you have nothing to loose.
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Mb182
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 03:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I have a question on the bars..
My old KTM Duke was real sensitive and would head shake really bad. Easy way to stop was slid up and put more weight on the front end. Duke and Buell rake and trail are real similar..
I am not familiar with the bars... is it possible that you are more upright now with less weight on the front?

MB
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Djkaplan
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 04:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Aren't XB engines laterally located in the frame with links like a tubers? Inspect the links and make sure they aren't throwing the rear wheel out of alignment with the front.
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2k4xb12
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 04:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Don't think the bars themselves are to blame. Many here (myself included) are running the Crossroads bars. I've run well over 120 mph with no reduction in stability. I've never felt any instability in the front end on this bike -- in fact it's the most stable bike I've ridden.
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Nasty73z
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 06:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Okay well I called the shop and talked to the mechanic. He said he did not adjust the steering head bearings because he couldn't jack the bike up since I have the Jardine muffler on it. He said if I want to put the stock exhaust back on (which I can't) then he would adjust them. He failed to tell me this when I picked my bike up.

So.. when I hold the front brake and push down on the forks, there are a couple of slight pops as it travels through its action. One sounds like it is coming from the steering head area and the other sounds like it is coming from the front axle. Aren't these classical head bearing symptoms? This sucks 'cuz I have no way to get the fron end off the ground to adjust it myself. And I don't have the little spring scale either. This blows I don't want to ride the bike until I get it fixed.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 08:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Do you have a rear stand and a ceiling or carport available with open beams that you can use to lift the bike up off of the ground?

If so then you're in business. A fish scale is available at any walmart and will do the job for setting the tension in a pinch.
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Dtx
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 09:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Nasty,
Check and see that there are the exact same amount of lines shown on the top of your forks. I heard if your forks are uneven, you could experience some headshake.
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Skully
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2006 - 11:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Nasty - ever make it down to East Texas?

Keith
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Nasty73z
Posted on Thursday, August 10, 2006 - 03:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

No, I don't have exposed beams or a rear stand. I really need to get a set, or just knuckle up and buy a Drummer SS so I can jack it up. I have a transmission jack and regular jack, along with an engine hoist "cherry picker". I think I am going to rig something using the engine hoist. Can you jack up an XB from the bottom of the engine case? If I were to pull off my Jardine muffler and place a jack under it. Thanks for all the helpful advice!
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M1combat
Posted on Thursday, August 10, 2006 - 11:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Use a piece of wood between the jack and the case, use the spot where the exhaust mounts to the engine. Devise a way to stabilise the bike.
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Skyguy
Posted on Thursday, August 10, 2006 - 12:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I have used ladders propped up against a wall and a ratcheting strap to lift the bike from one of the ladders rungs.

Then again I already have a few scratches on the bike so I am not worried about the straps rubbing the bodywork.
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Aeroe
Posted on Friday, August 11, 2006 - 02:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Nasty,
I'm not sure if you're still in the city, but if you are and need some help. call me 818-5985
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Fullpower
Posted on Friday, August 11, 2006 - 03:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

you dont need a jack, just pick up the right hand grip, takes two fingers worth of force, insert 6 inch wood block under front of muffler let front end down.... that is how i change wheels, etc.
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