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Dannybuell
| | Posted on Sunday, February 20, 2011 - 09:36 pm: | 
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...and the right to fall in with a heated mob and beat/rape hottie CBS journalists....
the journalists initials are LL. |
Drawkward
| | Posted on Sunday, February 20, 2011 - 09:51 pm: |
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Natty: I'm familiar with "Egyptian" Muslims and the events that foolishly turned Iran into what is a modern day caliphate. While I don't have the time or strength to argue this again, all I will say is that I disagree with you. Islam has not changed in the 1400 years that is has been around. What happened in Iran/Jordan/Syria will eventually happen in Egypt...it will be ruled by some form of Sharia law sooner or later and THAT will be bad for everyone there.
I respect your opinion though, seems as though you have some idea of middle eastern history...and that's awesome. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Monday, February 21, 2011 - 11:25 am: |
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Someone just lost their job for their 'humor' on the subject of LL.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2011/02 /21/133932626/breaking-news-man-tweets-without-rea lly-thinking-about-it-first?sc=fb&cc=fp |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Monday, February 21, 2011 - 11:27 am: |
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I am a little bit surprised NattyX1's comments were not disacknowledged by anyone else, especially those who have such strong moral opinions. |
Drawkward
| | Posted on Monday, February 21, 2011 - 12:01 pm: |
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Danny: Do you mean you are surprised that no one else chided Natt for being a pig about his comments? I didn't say anything because it didn't really surprise me.
What happened to Lara Logan also doesn't surprise me. She's a blonde western woman in a mob full of angry Muslim men...that kind of thing is expected in my eyes. I don't care what anyone says about the moderate nature of Egyptian Mulsims...that is savagery. "Egypt" will do nothing about it because in the eyes of Islam (who now runs that country) the men who assaulted her and her "guards" did nothing wrong.
It has also been revealed that she was stripped, punched and slapped by the crowd, which was labeling her a spy and chanting 'Israeli' and 'Jew' as they beat her.
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/02 /21/daily-mail-lara-logan-stripped-punched-and-whi pped-flag-poles
Try to spin this in any way you want but those who know the true nature of Islam know that this is commonplace. When Jews and Christians are equated to pigs and dogs in children's TV programs and in school books across the Muslim nations, it is to be expected that they will act this way when they are adults. This is NOT extremism...this is moderate. Your Americanized Muslim friends that drink on the weekends and aren't called to prayer are NOT the norm against the billion plus Muslims across the world...so whilst they cast their religion in a peaceful and accepting light, know that they are as blind as anyone else.
I'm starting to get pissed off writing about this so I'm stopping now before I start saying shit that will make me look like a nutter.
EDIT: It doesn't take much searching...
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Article.aspx?id=209102
And "radical" Islam isn't just happening outside of the U.S.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/02/20/muslim-cleric-plans-protest-outside-white-house-attempt-spread-sharia-law/
(Message edited by drawkward on February 21, 2011) |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Monday, February 21, 2011 - 12:37 pm: |
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A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything. Legally silence is considered acceptance. |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 12:56 pm: |
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Drawkward- I agree with you on much of what you wrote. You, like many other in here are a thoughtful person and that is what makes this a great place to spend time I don't actually have.
Syria's situation is different. It's a straight up fascist model with a state socialism overlay as created by Hafez and now feted to his slightly more open-minded son Bashar. And like other monolithic Arab governments, it makes the necessary nods to religion for reasons of social control, not piety (similar to Saddam's Iraq and for similar reasons - tribalism/Sunni-Shia split, etc). It has WAY more in common with North Korea than Iran in terms of how it functions. It's not a "Caliphate."
Ok, lecture over. Sorry.
I'm confused about one thing: you weren't surprised I was being a "pig" with my wry/arch comment regarding that journalist... and then a few pgraphs later you use the same term (pig) to describe how Muslim culture references Jews? Maybe I'm misinterpreting your statement ... I hope I am... but it sure feels like you directly insulted me. Or maybe you weren't surprised that no one chided me?
This is directed at Dannybuell also: I was being wry/arch in my comments about the reprehensible and completely indefensible mob behavior in Cairo. It seemed so obvious to me that no rational person could ever support such actions. I intended my absurdist comment to be darkly funny -- "gallows humor" -- as it is known. It's the kind of joke actual journalists make (am one, have been one, worked for ABC news, etc etc) who cover very difficult and upsetting stories (this certainly qualifies).
So maybe your and Danny's response was that the "joke" was in bad taste. Ok, I accept that as a reasonable response, after all, what's more subjective than comedy? It wasn't however, as Danny suggested, my "opinion." It was a sarcastic, ironic crack -- the same kind of thing that could have been said by John Stewart on The Daily Show. Maybe you cringe. Maybe you smile. Maybe both.
Of course I recognized (and was horrified/sickened) by the insanity of those Egyptians attacking that woman in the street. I can imagine what pain she's in on an emotional and physical level. It sucks. It's evidence of the crappy, complex and contradictory choices people make in tweezed up groups that they'd never make alone. I get all that, trust me.
But to use my joke as evidence that I'm a "pig"?
Last thoughts: I'm no "fan" of Islam. I was working toward a grad degree in Political Science at UC Berkeley with the intention of getting a PhD and teaching or perhaps moving into Gov't service like State Dept or CIA. My area of specialization was the Middle East with particular focus on traditional systems v. modern influences in social change. (I paid for this working on cars and bikes and driving an auto parts delivery truck -- gearhead/schoolhead). I traveled to North Africa, spent time in Egypt... went to Jordan. I studied Arabic (hardest thing I ever tried to learn). In retrospect, I think one underlying motive had something to do with the "know thy enemy" tenet. I ultimately wanted to be part of a "let's just get along" solution.
Anyway, it all got too frustrating because I saw first hand, (as you pointed out), how the hatred and intransigence among the "players" was so deeply ingrained. I also got frustrated with Ivory Tower insulation and politics. So I went into journalism... figured I'd be better off out in the world getting the real story and then telling it in ways "real" people might want to hear, as opposed to ruminating in small rooms of cowering intellectuals.
I eventually found myself doing domestic crime coverage (inlcuding working at America's Most Wanted). I ultimately got sick of being sickened by seeing first hand the actions of the worst kinds of people. You guys would probably think the kinds of jokes made by the cops, medical investigators, coroners, FBI agents, and journalists were in terribly bad taste. I think a fairer way to look at gallows humor is that it is a coping mechanism. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 01:31 pm: |
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@NattyX1 "the kinds of jokes made by the cops, medical investigators, coroners, FBI agents, and journalists were in terribly bad taste. "
Do you practice their values? Just trolling?
You would 'drop' the first person to talk like that if LL was your wife, sister, mother...
nuf said |
Hootowl
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 01:36 pm: |
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It seems intuitively obvious, even to the most casual observer, that it was said with intent to portray the attackers in a poor light, and not to cast any blame or disparagement on the victim. I'm not sure what your beef is here. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 01:43 pm: |
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it is all a matter of perspective.
desensitize or actualize how do you empathize? |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 01:54 pm: |
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+++ what Hootowl said.
Danny its all about the context. And in this context, no, I wouldn't "drop" someone for being ironic about how a mob of arabs might motivate and justify its evil actions |
Drawkward
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 02:02 pm: |
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Natty: Most people who would make that joke are pigs or piggish, in my opinion.
Me calling you a pig (as I am one from time to time, naturally) or your comment as piggish contains hardly the vitriol that it does when used by Muslims to portray the Jews or Christians.
Sorry if you took it that way.
As for Syria, I never called it a caliphate, just Iran (and even then it's hidden as one). Syria though, IS indeed ruled by sharia law, regardless of what their government informs the general public is the truth. As someone who has studied this, you would know of the harsh treatment of those not in line with Islam, and those that speak out against the government. It is theocratic at best and is ruled by Islam. Semantics aside, it might as well be a caliphate...minus the one ruler and the jizya, it locks in step pretty easily. Regardless, honor killing your daughter for infidelity isn't out of the ordinary...and neither is not going to jail for it. |
Curve_carver
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 02:31 pm: |
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I installed them today. They were free. lol
Here are some pictures for the few that requested em. |
Curve_carver
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 02:55 pm: |
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Dannybuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 05:06 pm: |
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Those levers are beautiful !!!
I want-------! |
Jgarner99
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 10:16 pm: |
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Hey! Quit hijacking the thread with pictures of levers, and let's get back to the soapbox politics and snotty attitudes! |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - 10:47 pm: |
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Jgarner99 - THX
nattyX1 - answer the question, the assertion was family, if you want to equivocate... |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 12:58 am: |
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DannyBuell:
I'm sorry if I offended you in some way. I think my previous statement about context asnwers the question you've asked.
Drawkward: I hope you're wrong about where Egypt is headed. I think we agree that the last thing the world needs is 85 million people screaming for Jihad... especially in this case with their rather formidable army and air force. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 10:35 am: |
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Nattyx1 - The offense was the social trip wire you didn't see. It is your trip, I hope it does not cause you to fall like that fellow at NYU. |
Drawkward
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 11:36 am: |
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Natt: I hope I'm wrong too man. Egypt has been a somewhat stable "ally"...we need a little stability. |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 01:23 pm: |
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Amen to THAT Drawk...
Danny: I made the comment in HERE. Not on NPR, which, in fact, I figure is a way more repressive/pc/don't say the wrong thing cuz someone might get ruffled feathers sort of environment.
At least, I thought it was.
Let's go back to talking about motorcycles.
My shoulder hurts too much to type anyway. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 01:54 pm: |
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You never read the link, the NPR story was based on a NYU employee twitter! This forum is more than a twitter!
A tragedy is either given respect or disrespect. Surely you cannot tell me there is respect shown by making a joke out of some persons tragedy? Nobody jokes at a rider who goes down. Get well soon.
colder weather means longer warm up time for cold and old fork oil to start flowing freely. tires need more time to warm up too. |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 02:15 pm: |
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>>> Nobody jokes at a rider who goes down.
Sure they do. All the time. Most any race where Pedrosa or Stoner goes down for instance. |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 02:31 pm: |
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What Blake said.
And you can joke about me crashing all you want. To keep the concepts parallel - DON'T joke about me, or my shoulder pain, or anything I did to be in that situation. ONLY joke about other riders on the track, or the badly paved track, or the bike, etc. Then the joke is about the SITUATION, not the person who suffered pain.
Where people DON'T joke is when a rider dies.
And really Danny, I KNOW there was nothing funny about what happened to that woman. I wasn't making a joke about her, or her experience.
I was making a sardonic comment about the MOB and how, in their skewed/messed up/myopic world view, their hideous actions were (perhaps) somehow explainable/justifiable (from THEIR point of view). The main instrument of social control (Mubarak and his police) was removed. The mob went nuts. Maybe they thought, "oh she's a dirty infidel - Allah would say whatever we do to her is more than fine..." They've justified far more evil behavior than this, as we all know.
Whatever.
The perps should be severely punished. I sure hope she fully recovers. I sure hope we can stop discussing this.
Maybe admin can go in and delete that phrase since it's so irksome... |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 03:20 pm: |
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One problem I have is with the reporting. "Sexual assault" can mean anything from being groped to rape. So what exactly happened? I have no idea. No one is reporting it. LAME!!! |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 03:26 pm: |
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I do know from Dr. Wafa Sultan's autobiography, A God Who Hates, that even Arab females are not immune from being accosted sexually in public. She describes riding on the bus from her medical school in Syria to the nearby city in order to purchase provisions. If she or other female med students didn't find a seat and got stuck standing on the bus the men would inevitably press up against them and masturbate underneath their robes.
What kind of @$^%ed up culture is that?!?!? |
Hootowl
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 03:27 pm: |
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I read that she was not raped, but was sexually assaulted for something like 20 minutes. I don't know what that means. |
Nattyx1
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 03:43 pm: |
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+1 what blake said.
There is no parallel to their systemic misogyny.
hoot: I don't know what that means either. Maybe it's "everything/anything" except penetration?" Dunno. But whatever... it isn't good.
I wonder if they even HAVE a version of the SVU in Cairo and if anything is being done about this.
Seems like a good reason to hold back on that next big fat aid check our govt writes their govt every month (or whatever the payment sked is). |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 05:40 pm: |
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