G oog le Buell 1125R Forum | Login/out | Topics | Search | Custodians | Register | Edit Profile


Buell Forum » 1125R Superbike Board » Archives 001 » Archive through January 12, 2011 » Kawasaki recall « Previous Next »

  Thread Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post
Archive through December 18, 2010Skizzy30 12-18-10  08:53 pm
         

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jules
Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2010 - 09:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It's unlikely to be a wrong spec of model sent to the US as all UK sales of the bike have been postponed too...
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Reepicheep
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 10:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have to give Kawasaki credit for getting it right enough the first time. I've accidentally found myself as a Kawasaki collector... I always buy on the capabilities and price and niche balance... and Kawasaki keeps winning hands down.

So the list for me so far is:
1985 KLR-250
1985 KLR-250 (parts bike was same price as new head I needed).
1995 KDX-200
1990 KX-60
1971 F8 Bison 250

All those bikes (except maybe the Bison) came out, worked well, and remained competitive for 10 to 20 years with only the most minor of changes. Makes parts easy to get as well.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 12:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Your are missing the point fresno. A Buell recall was done for whatever the reason was ? Techs were not trained to do such a task. Once again you are not looking at the big picture but instead picking away at the little things.It was a situation that wasn't rectified in a proper mannor.

i am missing the point? Picking on the little things? If you consider your factual misrepresentations "little things" then there isn't really any reasoning with you. Simple as that.

PS--There were many techs who were trained properly and unfortunately your dealership fell down on the job. The training program on the 1125 platform WAS available. My servicing dealership sent its Buell tech to out of town for "1125-specific" training on more than 1 occasion.

I know I was scared as hell thinking about a Harley tech working on my 1125R, but apparently the training worked as his work has been impeccable.

I know, I must be missing the point somehow by making factual statements like the one above
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 12:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Poorly trained Harley techs have taken the liberty to experiment with our bikes.They have no sufficient training to even look at a rotax engine.Why in the world would someone allow this? Why would the release of a bike be done without trained techs?

Just caught this statement. Simply not true. There WERE training programs in place. If your dealership was too cheap or too stupid to sent a tech to get trained, that's too bad but don't spout misinformation.


}
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 01:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Not a safety related item, perhaps they have discovered a faulty part that would be embarrassing if let go,


I tend to agree--something so embarrassing that it will affect future sales. Something so embarrassing Kawi feels it needs to hide it from its dealer network....and by extension the general public.

"Unintended acceleration?"

Don't know about you guys but this "throttle by wire" scares me to death. We know how well Toyota has done with the Prius.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Hybridmomentspass
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 02:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

fresno - TBW (throttle by wire) has been around a while. Im NOT a fan of it, but I also dont think its likely to think of it as a problem.

I'd prefer to not have a vehicle with TBW, but unfortunately as the years roll on then it'll be more and more prominent, we're going to see it a lot more.

And as for the Prius, yes, there was a problem, but that car remains one of the highest selling cars for 18 months in a row now. Toyota had a big problem, but handled it well.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Sunday, December 19, 2010 - 02:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'd prefer to not have a vehicle with TBW, but unfortunately as the years roll on then it'll be more and more prominent, we're going to see it a lot more.

Indeed you are correct. I hate to think my life is in the hands of a computer. Computers are only as good as the guy programming it.

Unlike the a 4-wheeled vehicle, which has protection and "options" for the driver to shutdown the vehicle without major incident, a software glitch on a bike at speed is a whole different matter.

Look at how we feel about the 'noid on our bikes when it kicks in--totally scares the crap out of you.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Zac4mac
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 12:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Fly by wire is coming, accept it.
This year, H-D is extending TBW to the CVO Softail.
Big move for the Softail family in the near future, seems a lot of customers want Cruise Control.
Can't really do mechanical CC on a Softail. no place to hide the junk.

Once the throttle has a servo-motor run by the ECM, CC is EASY.

I won't ever have it on Loretta.

Z
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ratsmc
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 12:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Jules, you are right. I have since found out from friends around the world that sales have been suspended everywhere including Japan.

So...ignore my conjecture.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fast1075
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 08:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

A "source" has it that there is an oiling problem at high lean angles. The "source" also told me that it was something he heard from somebody that knows somebody at R&D/TTD...so it may all be B.S....

At any rate, there will not be any customer owned bikes kicking rods out ; ).
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 10:33 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

A "source" has it that there is an oiling problem at high lean angles.

If this is indeed correct, sounds somewhat familiar. I suppose there isn't an "easy" fix like the added oil jet on our 2008 Rs.

}
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Buellmojo
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

My experience with Kawasaki leads me to believe, regardless of what the issue is, the problem will be resolved in a timely and precise manner...Similar too Aprilia solving their RSV4 engine problem.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Curve_carver
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I tend to agree--something so embarrassing that it will affect future sales. Something so embarrassing Kawi feels it needs to hide it from its dealer network....and by extension the general public.
"WRONG"
The reason they most likey recalled to the warehouse it so the work can be done by a trained tech. I know some are considering the wrong shipment came in. I dont think Kawasaki would make that big of an error.

Once again you have missed all the Important points??? Im glad your dealer has sent its techs for training.

Funny I cant find one in ohio that has after calling dealers.So the majority in my eyes is maybe 75% or more have not been trained,Thus leading to poor service.

"CASE CLOSED"
Ive actually called HD and asked where I can find a tech in ohio that is specifically trained.They agreed to call me back. That was 5 months ago.LOL
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Curve_carver
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Welcome aboard buellmojo. I see your a new user.
Take a close look at the search function as you will find all the answers newer buell owners look for.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 12:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

>>>My experience with Kawasaki leads me to believe, regardless of what the issue is, the problem will be resolved in a timely and precise manner...Similar too Aprilia solving their RSV4 engine problem.

That's what I'd bet on.

I've never owned a Kawasaki I was disappointed in . . .although I've got 2 basket cases sitting here trying to decide what to do with. : )
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Crackhead
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 01:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Poorly trained Harley techs have taken the liberty to experiment with our bikes.They have no sufficient training to even look at a rotax engine.Why in the world would someone allow this? Why would the release of a bike be done without trained techs?

Just caught this statement. Simply not true. There WERE training programs in place. If your dealership was too cheap or too stupid to sent a tech to get trained, that's too bad but don't spout misinformation.

How did HD let dealerships sell the bikes with out receiving proper training?

What would happen if there was an issue with a bike that was 2 days old?
I would be pissed if I had to take it to another dealer or be told that i have to wait 2 months for the tech to be trained.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fresnobuell
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 01:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

"WRONG"
The reason they most likey recalled to the warehouse it so the work can be done by a trained tech. I know some are considering the wrong shipment came in. I dont think Kawasaki would make that big of an error.


So you are saying the Kawi techs at dealerships around the country are not trained? C'mon man. You just got done ranting because Buell techs weren't trained on the 1125r platform.

My belief is there was a cost savings and more quality control in rounding up all the bikes and fixing the problem on a mass basis, rather than one at a time in the service departments.

Whether or not, they did this to keep the service departments in the dark (and by extension, the public) is still in question.

Do you see how this stuff gets out of control when we speculate on speculations? And this is a Buell board!

Kawi should spill the beans.
}
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Buellmojo
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 01:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Curve carver:
Thank you!

Court:
I have also been very fortunate with my ownership experience over the years with Kawasaki.
Fortunately I have had the opportunity to own several Kawasaki's throughout the years, dirt bikes(2) and street bikes(4), with little to no issues at all with them.
The issue's that did occur was handled immediately and fixed with only one visit, but that was my experience, others might have had a different experience than me though.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Azxb9r
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 04:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Don't know about you guys but this "throttle by wire" scares me to death. We know how well Toyota has done with the Prius.

Drive by wire has been around for quite a while, and has had its share of problems, but Toyota is the one that got all the bad press about it due to the throttle sticking open. Most of the drive by wire problems are the opposite...you hit the throttle and nothing happens. I have run into this frequently on GM, Nissan , and Mercedes. The funny thing is that Toyotas problem was not an electronic drive by wire problem, but rather a mechanical problem with the pedal assembly itself. My main complaint with drive by wire throttles is the "disconnected" feel that they tend to have. The throttle does not always do exactly what you want when you want. I am getting away from the OP here...dont want to derail the thread.

I was unhappy with my recent stator replacement on my 1125, but it had nothing to do with the quality of work or service from HD of Tucson...my complaint was with the 3 weeks it took to get the stator. The stator is a known problem, yet HD seems to be treating it like a nuisance that they are hoping will go away. It would be nice to see HD come up with a "fix" for the problem, and have a recall of their own.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Kenm123t
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 08:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Court are those KLR 650s?
you could ship them south its winter after all
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Monday, December 20, 2010 - 11:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yep . . a guy gave me 2 KLR's and a Bandit 1200 complete with keys and titles.

No clue as to what I'm going to do with them. They are all in rough shape but I keep thinking about melding the 2 KLR's into a super motard.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Kenm123t
Posted on Tuesday, December 21, 2010 - 12:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thats what I was thinkng about the Klrs for a dualsport and a motard build up.
We seldom see Klrs in south fl Dual sporting is more common in the north Fl down to the Ocala area
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jules
Posted on Tuesday, December 21, 2010 - 06:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've had a couple of KRLs, one as a motard one as a crosser - fabulous bikes and so easy to work on..

I did once collide with an RAF camp on the crosser (attempting to jump the 7' perimeter fence and failing) but the bike was unscathed (shame I couldn't say the same for my testicles)...
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Tuesday, December 21, 2010 - 09:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Jules, post a photo of the motard if you have one.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Sunday, December 26, 2010 - 05:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Things like this always make me think of the famous company started in Milwaukee, WI in 1903 . . . they introduced, in 1909, a V-Twin motor that would go one one day to become famous . . but it suffered from problems and was withdrawn from the market in 1909 . . had the bugs worked out and was reintroduced in 1911.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Sunday, December 26, 2010 - 05:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

By the way . . you'll have to REALLY dig into Harley-Davison history to learn about it. They . . go figure . . don't talk about it much. All they tell you is that "very few of the V-Twins introduced in 1909 were sold" and then they reappear with the "F Head V-Twin in 1911.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Dannybuell
Posted on Sunday, December 26, 2010 - 10:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Court - wouldn't that be nice if history repeated itself.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Nattyx1
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 11:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Fresno et al.... I think the problem is with the way H-D and other brands work the training vis a vis the franchise issue.

Caveat: I have friends who work at H-D who were deeply hurt by the loss of Buell. I know people at HDU who do a GREAT job and wished they could have done more. The issue is about how the business itself is structured.

The mfers/distributors cover their costs and actually (if they work it right from their pov) profit from in house training programs by charging dealerships to participate.

This of course meant dealers opted out who were (in your words) "too cheap," or perhaps were just struggling financially, or were small and only staffed one or two techs, or any of a bunch of possibly reasonable explanations for not ponying up hundreds or thousands of dollars (with travel costs, etc).

And so what happens? Since there's no requirement, some dealers say no thanks.

In aggregate, this results in the kind of spotty, unpredictable, customer-confidence-killing and ultimately brand-killing "service" that we've all read about and many have experienced.

Which leads me to think about how things might otherwise have gone.

IF as part of the franchise deal, dealers were contractually obligated to participate in these (often excellent) training programs...

If dealers wanted warranty service reimbursement, then dealers should have to have HAD only factory-trained and certified (and periodically re-tested) service techs work on the bikes. If some hamfisted 1%er tried his SAE/HD tools on a Buell, dealer would get no reimbursement. End of problem.

IF as part of the franchise agreement, dealers HAD to have only dedicated factory-trained Buell-riding salesmen in Buell shirts in a Buell section of the store selling Buells and Buell products, and bringing bikes to local sportriding hangouts, events and trackdays etc, the bikes would have sold a helluva lot better. How many Ducatis were sold because sportriders got dirty looks from fringe-wearing HOG lifers as they walked into the store?

IF unique insurance and financing options were created and offered for Buell customers to additionally make the entire purchasing experience feel more Buell and less HD...

Then, frankly, I think a bunch of us would be riding Barracudas this year and celebrating the 150,000th or 200,000th bike to roll off the line in East Troy at Homecoming in June...
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Court
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 12:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

200,000th bike
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Dannybuell
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 12:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Nattyx1 - the Buell dealer segregation issue you raised came to life last summer on the day ride I took when my stator died. This was a HD Biker ride open to all. At one of the last rest stops I wandered over to the rice guys who had managed to segregate. I talked a friends son riding a CBR600RR. His friends were on sport and cruiser rice. The ricers enjoyed the way the ride turned out and admitted to having reservations about riding with HD guys. They were happily surprised. Stereotypes!

The HD business model plays the bad boy biker stereotype card, in the case of Buell it may have worked against them.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Oddball
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 12:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?artic le=42964

What is valve surging? A different way of saying float?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Fast1075
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 03:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Back in the 70's Honda had problems with 100/125 cc engines. The engines would suck the intake valve...problem was from a straight wound single spring design...at high rpm, harmonics would develop and the spring would no longer control the valve..keeper pops off, Mr. Honda owes the 15 year old kid a new motor.

If memory serves me, I saw 15 or 20 of them blown up...no broken springs...the cure was a progressive wound spring with a damper...

When I went to Honda school...the instructor set up a 100 engine on the test stand...cranked it, opened the throttle wide open in neutral...announced that it was lunch time and away we went...45 minutes or so later when we came back, the engine was still wide open at 10k rpm or so...true story.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Curve_carver
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 - 05:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Fresno I also want to say to your comment about your tech being properly trained.
There was buell certified harley techs.
Then there is buell certified techs that had additional rotax training. Get back with me on that???}
« Previous Next »

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Bold text Italics Underline Create a hyperlink Insert a clipart image

Username: Posting Information:
This is a public posting area. Enter your username and password if you have an account. Otherwise, enter your full name as your username and leave the password blank. Your e-mail address is optional.
Password:
E-mail:
Options: Post as "Anonymous" (Valid reason required. Abusers will be exposed. If unsure, ask.)
Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action:

Topics | Last Day | Tree View | Search | User List | Help/Instructions | Rules | Program Credits Administration