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Buell Motorcycle Forum » Buell XBRR Pirate Racing Page (XB-arrrr-arrrr maties!) » XBRR Threads Consolidated Here! » XBRR engine fitment?? » Archive through February 14, 2006 « Previous Next »

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Firemanjim
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 03:16 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
So will an XBRR type motor fit in a standard XB frame or just a stretched version--or none of the above??Want to start collecting parts now for next generation B'ville bike.
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Whodom
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 06:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Good question. I wonder how the "taller" cases will affect the fit. Seems like the whole engine has to be taller given the changes they've made. Is a shorter top/front engine mount possible, or does the crankcase sit lower on the XBRR?
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What_the
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 08:08 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
The RR engine will bolt right in stock XB frames and uses uses stock front and rear isolators.

The RR frame is a stock unpainted Firebolt frame with added fuel capacity.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 10:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
It's not a firebolt frame. It's a Lightning long frame.
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99buellx1
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 10:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
It's not a Lightning long frame, it's a Ulysses frame.






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Diablobrian
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 10:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)



Ok, ok it's a lightning long / Ulysses frame.

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M1combat
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 10:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Whatever... It's a long Firebolt frame.

Anyway...

Jim...

I think I heard from a credible source that the upper/rear motor mount was different. I "think" they were referring to the one that's just in front of the seat. It was said that this is the only difference as I recall.
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Henrik
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 11:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Duck season ... Rabbit season ;)
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Wyckedflesh
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 05:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Its not 'You can shoot HIM now', its you can shoot ME now SO SHOOT ME NOW!...*BLAM!*
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Josh_
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 05:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Bugs is my idol
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Henrik
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 10:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Pronoun trouble ...
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Mutation_racer
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 11:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
the frame is a xb12 long the same as the uly. 4.4 gal.
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Anonymous
Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 11:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
No. The XBRR is an XB12R with the side stampings from a Ulysses/Long welded in to increase the fuel capacity, as allowed in the AMA FX rules.
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Charlieboy6649
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 02:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Ah HA! Following the rulebook works too...
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Firemanjim
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 03:16 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
So will I be able to use any of the regular XB frames--a 9 or a 12?Thanks for all the insight,BTW.
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Diablobrian
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 09:08 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Thank you for the clarification!
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M1combat
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 10:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Yep. A long firebolt : ).
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What_the
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 09:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Firemanjim.

The answer is yes to your last question.
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Firemanjim
Posted on Friday, February 10, 2006 - 09:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Cool,I'll start collecting parts.
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Trojan
Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 09:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
No. The XBRR is an XB12R with the side stampings from a Ulysses/Long welded in to increase the fuel capacity, as allowed in the AMA FX rules.

Which surely rules it out of Thunderbike and other series' rules even with the 'power down' kit fitted? Or do you expect the entire 50 bikes to be raced in FX?

(Message edited by trojan on February 11, 2006)
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Blake
Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 12:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Matt,

That would be unfortunate. Do sprint race class rules not allow additional gussetting to reinforce the frame? If so, might that be the point that keeps the bike legal in the various Thunderbike type sprint race classes?
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Trojan
Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 02:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
I think that it would be outside the meaning of the FUSA Thunderbike rules as they stood before the new organisation took over, and certainly as they stand in the UK Thunderbike series. The rules state:

Frame, cylinder head(s) and engine cases must be from the same production model motorcycle.
Single cylinder motorcycles may use any frame and engine.
The frame must be as originally supplied by the manufacturer on the approved model.
Strengthening gussets or tubes may be added. Only brackets or tubes not supporting suspension, engine, or drive line components may be removed. Single cylinder motorcycles are excluded from this restriction

As the part added to the frame by Buell isn't for strengthening, but for added fuel capacity, I can't see how it can be allowed. It is also apparent that the frame is manufactured from components of different models. Even the engine would not qualify under these rules, as the XBRR heads are different from the road model.

I am in no way criticising the XBRR by this, but I am very interested to see how it can be adapted to fit into other race classes just by using a 'power down kit' as the factory have intimated. I have heard a rumour that there may be 3 XBRR's coming to the UK. If that is the case I cannot see where or in which class they will race?
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Blake
Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 05:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
"As the part added to the frame by Buell isn't for strengthening"
I strongly disagree. I say it was added for strengthening. It sure looks like it would add a bunch of strength to the frame. How is Mr. Tech inspector possibly going to prove me wrong? Answer: He cannot.


"It is also apparent that the frame is manufactured from components of different models."
I'm not seeing that. How would one be able to discern that the frame was fabbed from components of different models?

Point taken wrt the engine. Aren't there other higher level classes in which the XBRR can compete? Not sure it would be fair to allow it in an SV650 type class.

Edited for mispellings and gramatical errors. : )

(Message edited by blake on February 12, 2006)
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Buelldyno_guy
Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 12:43 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
We did not get the Bike, but if we win the AFM F4 championship I have been promised that we will get an engine for next year. It will go into our XB9 Frame and we will race AFM "Open Twins"
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Jon
Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 12:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Right on, Terry!
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Mutation_racer
Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 08:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
i talked to the people at CCS & ASRA and they told me that i can race the xbrr in middle weight up to super bike, so to answer the ? i just won't be racing it in lw classes. and the only class that needs the power tune kit is thunderbike.
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Blake
Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 06:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
CCS ROCKS! Their rules are exemplary for what all racing organizations should adopt. Each class allows all kinds of different engine configurations and limits displacement accordingly. WERA/CMRA rules unfortunately do not adopt such an all inclusive approach to their class rules.
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Trojan
Posted on Tuesday, February 14, 2006 - 04:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
This is from the Canadian Superbike Press release:

The 2007 XBRR will be eligible to race in the following U.S. series and classes: American Motorcyclist Association (AMA) Formula Xtreme class; American Sportbike Racing Association (ASRA) Thunderbike and Superbike classes; Western Eastern Racers Association (WERA) Formula 1 National Challenge Sprints; American Federation of Motorcyclists (AFM) Formula Twins Expert and Formula 4 Expert classes; Willow Springs Motorcycle Club (WSMC) BOTT Heavyweight Expert and BOTT Middleweight Expert classes; Washington Motorcycle Road Racing Association (WMRRA) Formula Thunder Expert class; and Championship Cup Series (CCS), SuperTwins Expert and Thunderbike Expert and Amateur classes.


I would still like to know how it will be eligible for Thunderbike, as it seems to break almost every rule in the book regarding original frame and engine cases. Any input here from Anonymous would be appreciated.
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Charlieboy6649
Posted on Tuesday, February 14, 2006 - 11:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Hey I'm just a jarhead looking in, but wouldn't it seem that because all of the 03 and later models use variants of the same frame that whether you mixed and matched parts or not wouldn't matter?
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Mutation_racer
Posted on Tuesday, February 14, 2006 - 01:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)
Once again I talk to CCS reps and the bike is cleared for thunderbike and also middleweight up. Also i have a fax from them stating that fact which i will bring to every race this year.


GO BUELL
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