| Author | Message | ||
     1324 |
Not sure if you're the best person to ask, Court, but since you seem to be all knowing when it comes to Buell, I'll have a try with you. Are the throttle tubes the same between all years of XB's? How about the control housing that it sits in? Aside from 2008 (possibly), I would assume they are the same from 2003-2007. Would this also be the same as the one used on the Blast? How about earlier models? Thanks for your help, I'm trying to find commonality between all models for a reason I'll disclose later. | ||
| Court |
First. . .for the record. . . Blake is almost always the best person for technical questions. He'd dull, boring and smart as a whip . . the stuff engineers are made of! I specialize in sage global wisdom and a continually ongoing assessment of the human condition and what "feels" right . . . Second. . . what the hell is a "Throttle Tube"? I have, if it would be of help, service and parts manuals for every Buell ever made and am not above doing a bit of research. I presume you mean the throttle bodies, for instance the 29806-02 that was used on the 2003 XB?  | ||
| 1324 |
He'd dull, boring and smart as a whip . . the stuff engineers are made of! Hey, I dispute that!  LOL Anyway, I am referring to the plastic tube that the right grip is adhered to. You know, the tube that holds the throttle cable ends and pulls/pushes the cables as you twist. | ||
| Buell920 |
7/8 size , all the same | ||
| 1324 |
I know they are all for 7/8 bars, I'm asking if the part numbers are the same for all models, all years...tubes and housings. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Shoot me an email at work, jgoetz@hdoffrederick.com, and I'll "remember" to check for you. I have parts lookup on the 'puter there  | ||
| Thunderbeast |
On the X-1's the Switch Assembly-Handle Bar Right-w/Throttle Control is 70404-99Y and the Throttle Cable Sleeve is 55944-99Y. I know with the new Buell grips I received also a new Throttle Cable Sleeve. Of course these are the "old" part numbers. Anyone have a way of cross referencing the "old" to the "new" part numbers? Chad | ||
| Ratbuell |
IIRC the parts lookup will have the original numbers. Doubleclick, they'll show if there's a supersession. I should be able to chase all of them from there. I would suspect the new sleeve comes with P&A grips just because you may or may not be able to detach the grip from the sleeve. | ||
| Ratbuell |
parts lookup shows N0051.K being the right hand grip on just about all 7/8 bar Buells back into the tuber days. It shows the grip as including the sleeve, not seperate. The Traction P&A grips we have in stock also have the sleeve built in. Your part number from above for the sleeve (55944-99Y) is obsolete and supersedes to the N0051.K number. No dealers show the old part number in stock, sorry. | ||
| 1324 |
Thanks for the help, Rat. I know you can separate the sleeve from the grip, but this confirms what I was thinking. Next question is, are the switch housings all the same? If so, I'm getting pretty psyched! | ||
| Blake |
I'd clarify that most of my writing here is dull and boring. I myself happen to be quite exciting.  | ||
| Jasonk |
...writing to the lowest common denominator, Blake?...lol... | ||
| Court |
Badweb is non-denominatorable. . . we don't care what religion you are. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Yep. Same switch housings 03-07, XB and P3. N0159.TA left side; N0158.TA right side. So...gonna share the excitement with us? | ||
| 1324 |
Alright fine, I'll spill though I doubt others will be as excited as I am. I'm working with Rifleman to prototype a throttle insert to reduce throttle 'throw'. I should have a prototype at my house by the time I return from traveling this weekend and we're looking at reducing the throttle grip rotation from ~90 degrees to around 72. | ||
| Court |
Before you do (and I'm sure you've already done this) be sure to check out FMVSS FMVSS 209, Part 571 Std 123. Generally covering . .. Standard No. 123 - Motorcycle Controls and Displays - Motorcycles equipped with handlebars, except for motorcycles that are designed and sold exclusively for use by law enforcement agencies (Effective 9-1-74) This standard specifies requirements for the location, operation, identification and illumination of motorcycle controls and displays, and for stands and footrests. Its purpose is to minimize crashes caused by operator error in responding to the motoring environment, by standardizing certain motorcycle controls and displays. Suzuki applied for a control variance several years ago, to put the rear brake on the left handlebar. I'm not sure where that went but ever since they got this stuff standardized. . . well they can be sticklers. I do not know if degrees of rotation is mandated. I'd also look for conformity from mfg to mfg . . . you could be committing a federal crime. . . Welcome to the motorcycle business. The following is just a sample of how involved a seemingly innocuous thing can get . . . [Federal Register: December 3, 2004 (Volume 69, Number 232)] [Notices] [Page 70304-70306] From the Federal Register Online via GPO Access [wais.access.gpo.gov] [DOCID:fr03de04-99] -------------------------------------------------- --------------------- DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION National Highway Traffic Safety Administration [Docket No. NHTSA-2004-18745] Receipt of Applications for Temporary Exemption From a Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard; American Suzuki Motorcycle Corporation AGENCY: National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), DOT. ACTION: Notice of receipt of two applications for temporary exemptions from a Federal motor vehicle safety standard; Request for comments. -------------------------------------------------- --------------------- SUMMARY: We have received two applications from American Suzuki Motorcycle Corporation (Suzuki), a motorcycle manufacturer, for temporary exemptions from a provision in the Federal motor vehicle safety standard on motorcycle controls and displays specifying that a motorcycle rear brake, if provided, must be controlled by a right foot control. Suzuki asks that we permit the left handlebar as an alternative location for the rear brake control for two of its scooters, the Burgman 400 and the Burgman 650. Suzuki states its belief that ``compliance with the standard would prevent the manufacturer from selling a motor vehicle with an overall level of safety at least equal to the overall safety level of nonexempt vehicles.'' We are publishing this notice of receipt of the application in accordance with our regulations on the subject, and ask for public comment on Suzuki's application. This publication does not mean that we have made a judgment yet about the merits of the applications. DATES: You should submit your comments early enough to ensure that Docket Management receives them not later than January 3, 2005. ADDRESSES: You may submit your comments [identified by the DOT DMS Docket Number cited in the heading of this document] by any of the following methods: Web site: http://dms.dot.gov. Follow the instructions for submitting comments on the DOT electronic docket site. Fax: 1-202-493-2251. Mail: Docket Management Facility; U.S. Department of Transportation, 400 Seventh Street, SW., Nassif Building, Room PL-401, Washington, DC 20590-001. Hand Delivery: Room PL-401 on the plaza level of the Nassif Building, 400 Seventh Street, SW., Washington, DC, between 9 a.m. and 5 p.m., Monday through Friday, except Federal Holidays. Federal eRulemaking Portal: Go to (http://www.regulations.gov. ) Follow the online instructions for submitting comments. You may call the Docket at (202) 366-9324. You may visit the Docket from 10 a.m. to 5 p.m., Monday through Friday, except Federal Holidays. FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: For non-legal issues, you may call Mr. Michael Pyne, Office of Crash Avoidance Standards at (202) 366-4171. His FAX number is (202) 493-2739. For legal issues, you may call Ms. Dorothy Nakama, Office of the Chief Counsel at (202) 366-2992. Her FAX number is (202) 366-3820. You may send mail to these officials at National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, 400 Seventh St., SW., Washington, DC 20590. SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: I. Background 49 U.S.C. Section 30113(b) provides the Secretary of Transportation the authority to exempt, on a temporary basis, motor vehicles from a motor vehicle safety standard under certain circumstances. The exemption may be renewed, if the vehicle manufacturer reapplies. The Secretary has delegated the authority for Section 30113(b) to NHTSA. NHTSA has established regulations at 49 CFR Part 555, Temporary Exemption from Motor Vehicle Safety and Bumper Standards. Part 555 provides a means by which motor vehicle manufacturers may apply for temporary exemptions from the Federal motor vehicle safety [[Page 70305]] standards on the basis of substantial economic hardship, facilitation of the development of new motor vehicle safety or low-emission engine features, or existence of an equivalent overall level of motor vehicle safety. Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 123, Motorcycle controls and displays (49 CFR Section 571.123) specifies requirements for the location, operation, identification, and illumination of motorcycle controls and displays, and requirements for motorcycle stands and footrests. Among other requirements, FMVSS No. 123 specifies that for motorcycles with rear wheel brakes, the rear wheel brakes must be operable through the right foot control, although the left handlebar is permissible for motor-driven cycles (see S5.2.1, and Table 1, Item 11). Motor-driven cycles are motorcycles with motors that produce 5 brake horsepower or less (see 49 CFR Section 571.3, Definitions). On November 21, 2003, NHTSA published in the Federal Register (68 FR 65667) a notice proposing two regulatory alternatives to amend FMVSS No. 123. Each alternative would require that for certain motorcycles without a clutch control lever, the rear brakes must be controlled by a lever located on the left handlebar. We also requested comment on industry practices and plans regarding controls for motorcycles with integrated brakes. If this proposed rule is made final, the left handlebar would be permitted as an alternative location for the rear brake control. II. Applications for Temporary Exemption From FMVSS No. 123 NHTSA has received two applications for temporary exemption from S5.2.1 and Table 1, Item 11 from American Suzuki Motor Corporation, a motorcycle manufacturer. Suzuki asks for extensions of existing temporary exemptions for the Burgman 400 (also known as the AN 400) and the Burgman 650 (also known as the AN 650) for MYs 2005-2006. The Burgman 400 and 650 motorcycles are considered ``motor scooters.'' Suzuki has applied to use the left handlebar as the location for the rear brake control on its Burgman scooters, whose engines produce more than 5 brake horsepower. The frame of the Burgman scooters have not been designed to mount a right foot operated brake pedal (i.e., each motor scooter has a platform for the feet and operate only through hand controls). Applying considerable stress to this sensitive pressure point of the motor scooter frame by putting on a foot operated brake control could cause failure due to fatigue, unless proper design and testing procedures are performed. III. Why the Petitioner Claims the Overall Level of Safety of the Motorcycles Equals or Exceeds That of Non-Exempted Motorcycles The applicant has argued that the overall level of safety of the motorcycles covered by their petitions equals or exceeds that of a non- exempted motorcycle for the following reasons. Suzuki has stated that the Burgman scooters are equipped with automatic transmissions. As there is no foot-operated gear change, the operation and use of a motorcycle with an automatic transmission is similar to the operation and use of a bicycle, and the vehicles can be operated without requiring special training or practice. Suzuki provided test data with its October 4, 2002 original temporary exemption petition showing that the Burgman 400 ``can easily meet'' the braking performance requirements in FMVSS No. 122 Motorcycle brake systems. Suzuki provided similar test data with its June 2, 2002 original temporary exemption petition for the Burgman 650, which also showed that the Burgman 650 ``can easily meet'' FMVSS No. 122. Suzuki further stated that it will not sell more than 2,500 exempted vehicles in the U.S. in any 12-month period for which an exemption may be granted. At the end of the exemption period, Suzuki stated that it does not intend to comply with the rear brake control location requirements of FMVSS No. 123. Under previously-granted exemptions, Suzuki sold approximately 2,702 Burgman 400 scooters and approximately 2,947 Burgman 650 scooters over a two-year period. IV. Why Petitioner Claims an Exemption Would Be in the Public Interest and Would Be Consistent With the Objectives of Motor Vehicle Safety Suzuki offered the following reason why another temporary exemption for its motorcycle would be in the public interest and would be consistent with the objectives of motor vehicle safety. Suzuki asserted that the level of safety of the Burgman scooters is ``at least equal to similar vehicles that are certified to FMVSS No. 123.'' Suzuki further asserted that scooters like the Burgman 400 and 650 are of interest to the public, evidenced by the number of companies that have previously requested exemptions to sell similar products in the U.S., the favorable public comment on the exemption requests, and the number of scooters sold under the granted exemptions. | ||
| 1324 |
I was unaware of all of that, actually. I'm not going to delve into the legal side of things since I'm no lawyer and just a lowly engineer. That being said, I'm not the one who will be selling these, which will probably just have the label of "For off-road use only" applied to them. Not to long ago, I swapped the throttle tube/sleeve from my SV650 for an R6. The difference in throw was amazing, and I'd like to have the same effect on the Buell. For reference, here is Rifleman's site: http://www.doublezracing.com/ |
